UPDATE: Fedor legendary 9 wins -1 lost - 1 NC record against former UFC champions.

[Based Akali]

That´s what I thought. You´re a clueless bum repeatin´ others´BS like a parrot.

Ya know... When you dont know shit:

Clueless bum because I'm not going to answer a question about a point I didn't make. One you purposely created to make a false negative argument because you couldn't actually respond to the post in an intelligent matter.

In the matter of two posts you went from which fight, to conceding that there is even a 1% chance that a fight may be fixed. So ask yourself own fabricated question. Now if you want to address the actual argument of a post without trying to strawman than am I all ears. Until then take a step away from your keyboard and let the adults do the typing.

 

[gono btw]

Clueless bum because I'm not going to answer a question about a point I didn't make. One you purposely created to make a false negative argument because you couldn't actually respond to the post in an intelligent matter.

In the matter of two posts you went from which fight, to conceding that there is even a 1% chance that a fight may be fixed. So ask yourself own fabricated question. Now if you want to address the actual argument of a post without trying to strawman than am I all ears. Until then take a step away from your keyboard and let the adults do the typing.

you dont have the knowledge to assess which fight was fixed or not in Pride

bye parrot...

 

[Based Akali]

you dont have the knowledge to assess which fight was fixed or not in Pride

bye parrot...

You know I was honestly giving you the benefit of the doubt that you were trolling, but it's just clear you have a room temperature IQ.

To say that anyone doesn't have the knowledge to say fights in Pride were fixed when Pride fighters have openly admitted there were fixed fights is just beyond retarded. You've set a new level and even at the level you can still say some Pride fights were fixed, since it's a fact. Sorry you can't accept that.

 

[gono btw]

You know I was honestly giving you the benefit of the doubt that you were trolling, but it's just clear you have a room temperature IQ.

To say that anyone doesn't have the knowledge to say fights in Pride were fixed when Pride fighters have openly admitted there were fixed fights is just beyond retarded. You've set a new level and even at the level you can still say some Pride fights were fixed, since it's a fact. Sorry you can't accept that.

Shhhh....

 

[moreorless87]

I never doubted Fedor's fights at all, you're merely trying to nitpick a point because I said an organization was shady by fixing fights and promoting steroids. Stop trying to nitpick words to create an argument when you don't have a response for the actual post.

So how do your doubts in the org relate to Fedor's achievements within it?

I mean personally I look at his career and I see guys like Coleman, Fujita and Randleman who were all likely on PEDs when they fought Fedor, I also see in the Crocop fight several questionable standups that benefit Mirko, can't recall any questionable decisions from refs or judges that benefit Fedor in Pride.

What people tend to forget is that Fedor was a spoiler, guys like Semmy, Herring, Nog and espeically Crocop were all fighters Pride probably wanted to beat Fedor. It was only VERY late in the day in 2006 that Pride really started to push Fedor himself above anyone else.

 

[Based Akali]

So how do your doubts in the org relate to Fedor's achievements within it?

I mean personally I look at his career and I see guys like Coleman, Fujita and Randleman who were all likely on PEDs when they fought Fedor, I also see in the Crocop fight several questionable standups that benefit Mirko, can't recall any questionable decisions from refs or judges that benefit Fedor in Pride.

What people tend to forget is that Fedor was a spoiler, guys like Semmy, Herring, Nog and espeically Crocop were all fighters Pride probably wanted to beat Fedor. It was only VERY late in the day in 2006 that Pride really started to push Fedor himself above anyone else.

It's not just Fedor's achievements in Pride, I don't hold many of the achievements back then from anyone with as much weight as I normally would because of the fight fixing. Instead I like to focus on the absolute great fights that you can tell aren't fixed because both fighters are trying to kill each other. We will never know if fighters let themselves be hit and put down because of a pay day etc when it comes to Pride and sadly many fighters admitting that Pride fixed fights puts that doubt in my mind. It's not going to be a very popular opinion, but I'm okay with that.

You can bet Fedor was on something as well in those fights since it wasn't illegal, if all the fighters are doing them it must give enough boost to be worth it. Which is completely fine, it was legal in Pride and I don't hold anything against fighters that abused them in the org.

Thank you for actually responding to the point rather than strawman.

 

[moreorless87]

It's not just Fedor's achievements in Pride, I don't hold many of the achievements back then from anyone with as much weight as I normally would because of the fight fixing. Instead I like to focus on the absolute great fights that you can tell aren't fixed because both fighters are trying to kill each other. We will never know if fighters let themselves be hit and put down because of a pay day etc when it comes to Pride and sadly many fighters admitting that Pride fixed fights puts that doubt in my mind. It's not going to be a very popular opinion, but I'm okay with that.

You can bet Fedor was on something as well in those fights since it wasn't illegal, if all the fighters are doing them it must give enough boost to be worth it. Which is completely fine, it was legal in Pride and I don't hold anything against fighters that abused them in the org.

Thank you for actually responding to the point rather than strawman.

So you are claiming that fight fixing was going on just as other people claimed, again I'd repeat there questions which fights were fixed?

You look at Fedor's Pride career and I don't think there are really any situations where you could say the officals were biased in favour of him so it has to be that fighters agreed to take dives against Fedor for cash, can you highlight which fights you think were dives?

Honestly my opinion is you don't really have any understanding about the situation your commenting on, your just recycling criticism you've heard previously, heck you probably haven't watched many of the fights in question.

The reality is that the UFC outside the US is in essentially the same position as Pride, directly hiring officals and very little oversight. Indeed theres really nothing to say any UFC fight in or out of the US could not potentially have been fixed.

 

[OmegaRugal]

I think Chael's record vs Pride greats is even more impressive.

3-0 and possibly to be 4-0 very soon.\

One more for the badguy

 

[Rampage_Jackson]

It's ridiculous how in 2018 there are still daily "OMG Fedor is so great" threads

we get it, he was good (but NOT unbeatable).

I don't see the point in making fedor threads unless he is fighting someone in the here and now

Because MMA is gradually getting lamer and lamer. Much more fun to look back when MMA was great than to discuss current MMA.

IMHO

 

[Based Akali]

So you are claiming that fight fixing was going on just as other people claimed, again I'd repeat there questions which fights were fixed?

You look at Fedor's Pride career and I don't think there are really any situations where you could say the officals were biased in favour of him so it has to be that fighters agreed to take dives against Fedor for cash, can you highlight which fights you think were dives?

Honestly my opinion is you don't really have any understanding about the situation your commenting on, your just recycling criticism you've heard previously, heck you probably haven't watched many of the fights in question.

The reality is that the UFC outside the US is in essentially the same position as Pride, directly hiring officals and very little oversight. Indeed theres really nothing to say any UFC fight in or out of the US could not potentially have been fixed.

Any fighters taking dives isn't going to be too noticeable if they do it right, if you were being paid more than your purse to just let a strike through that you could avoid and go down would you? Many fighters out there would and we will never know, it's entirely possible I've given people too much credit for being able to throw a fight, but it's pretty common sense on how to make it look realistic, you simply let yourself actually get hit.

It could be happening in the UFC as well, but until high profile UFC fighters come out and claim WME is offering them cash in the locker rooms to take a dive I'll hold my judgement on that. If fixing fights in Pride were just unsubstantiated rumor than I wouldn't hold these opinions, but it's been proven as a fact that the org themselves fixed fights and that ruins the entire org's legitimacy to me, which is a pity for the fighters because they very could have never fought in a fixed fight Fedor included.

I religiously watched every Pride event growing up, I've seen the fights, that doesn't mean I have to be blinded by a corrupt organization though.

 

[Summoning]

 

[sapporo ichiban]

Are you suggesting that not only is Fedor the greatest of all time, but he also did in an organization that famously fixed fights and openly promoted the use of steroids? Where it was even stated in fighters contracts that they wouldn't be tested for steroids. Pride was full of steroids and to think that any fighter in that organization was clean is the real hard line approach.

The thread title is inaccurate because it doesn't matter what fighters went on to do, the only thing about a fight that matters is where that opponent was at the time of that fight. Fighters that Fedor beat that later went on to become UFC champions are irrelevant because Fedor didn't fight them at that time. It's just creating a false narrative, Fedor has absolutely nothing to do with the UFC, using anything to do with the UFC to try and give more credit to his fights is simply just trying to use the UFC brand name to bolster his legacy.

Ya, thats your opinion. If guys are good enough to fight in any of the premier leagues, the ufc included, and they are not completely green or shot then they are worth note in my opinion. The whole idea is to provide comparisons and it is fair for people to discuss it. If you disagree that is fine.

As far as the steroid thing goes, yes you are correct that they allowed ped use. Maybe they all took advantage and maybe only half did, who knows. Using any examples of ped use without solid evidence is still pure speculation, again, a matter of your opinion. I agree that there likely was rampant use but I am not going to use that to diminish any fighters achievements whenever I feel like it when I don't know for sure.

 

[Taric]

Any fighters taking dives isn't going to be too noticeable if they do it right

We all know exactly which fights are dives in MMA, because it's obvious as hell.
Every Takada fight, Oleg/Macias, Frye/Hall, Vitor/Charles, every pro-wrestler from PRIDE 1 to PRIDE 10.

The faked fights in PRIDE took place pre-2000, just like they happened in the UFC too. It was how the era was.

You gotta remember, the very first sanctioned MMA fight in the USA was in the IFC on September 30th 2000. The very first time there was a sanctioning body for a UFC event was UFC 28 (November 27th 2000). Anything before that was 100% NHB and stuff could be as real or as fixed as they wanted it to be. It wasn't a sport yet.

 

[moreorless87]

Any fighters taking dives isn't going to be too noticeable if they do it right, if you were being paid more than your purse to just let a strike through that you could avoid and go down would you? Many fighters out there would and we will never know, it's entirely possible I've given people too much credit for being able to throw a fight, but it's pretty common sense on how to make it look realistic, you simply let yourself actually get hit.

It could be happening in the UFC as well, but until high profile UFC fighters come out and claim WME is offering them cash in the locker rooms to take a dive I'll hold my judgement on that. If fixing fights in Pride were just unsubstantiated rumor than I wouldn't hold these opinions, but it's been proven as a fact that the org themselves fixed fights and that ruins the entire org's legitimacy to me, which is a pity for the fighters because they very could have never fought in a fixed fight Fedor included.

I religiously watched every Pride event growing up, I've seen the fights, that doesn't mean I have to be blinded by a corrupt organization though.

Fights earlier in Pride that were fixed like Coleman/Takada was most definitely noticed, the same with dodgy fights in the early UFC. The reality is that fixed fights do almost always look dodgy, its not easy to sell them as legit.

The reality I'd say is that Pride in the 90's existed between Pro wrestling and MMA, mostly legit fights, some pro wrestling and at least one fix but by the 00's they were having to sell themselves as legit and could no longer afford to have claims of fixing. Rampage was essentially offered money not to tap against Saku, he wasn't offered money to loose but he was still salty about his loses to Wand and Shogun so liked to muddy the waters a bit trying to delegitimise them.

One thing you could bring up I spose was Sergei releasing that armbar on Nog during their fight, whats your opinion on that? there was fuss at the time but I don't think it was an issue.

 

[Idonotbelieveit]

ah it´s actually close with Minotau, imo...

But fedor beat him x2
So it s not close and both were in prime

 

[Idonotbelieveit]

I miss those days. I used to get so pumped for every Pride and UFC care. Now I get excited maybe twice a year.

I don't follow anymore
Last event I watched live was andy vs bisping

 

[gono btw]

But fedor beat him x2
So it s not close and both were in prime

yeah, but you have to consider resumes, gets closer

 

[Idonotbelieveit]

yeah, but you have to consider resumes, gets closer

Yep
Nog has fought and beat a savage row
Fedor competition wise not in nog league
But fedor has an edge he beat him x2 and both were in prime
Nog is second though and top 4 ever imo

 

[JohnMandick]

 

[Idonotbelieveit]

View attachment 415607

He was one in a million
Glad I watched him in prime