International Trump-Ukraine Megathread Vol 2.

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Confucamus said:
It’s unreal how Democrats openly lie and abuse their power with no consequence, but believe they can impeach a Democratically elected President for almost any reason. Schiff is a joke and that’s why he fits in so well on that side of the aisle.
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If laws were broken, then those democrats you speak of nebulously should be investigated and face consequences. That "almost no reason" you speak of so dismissively is the president soliciting a foreign power to investigate someone as "a favor", and it is against the law.

And to address some of the recurring nonsense points:

whether or not Biden is the eventual Dem candidate doesn't matter.
whether or not Trump considers him a "political rival/threat" doesn't matter.
his intentions don't matter.
whether they were veiled threats doesn't matter.
If his claims about Biden are absolutely true doesn't matter.
If there was/wasn't clear quid pro quo doesn't matter.
Whether or not another president did the same/similar/worse doesn't matter.

It's still against the law, your >opinions< why you don't think it is, also don't matter.
 
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Biden's running the classic playbook.
Admit nothing.
Deny everything.
Make counter-accusations.

wp66quhos4p31.jpg
 
Kyiv Post's take (Ukraine's oldest English language paper).

 
Jeff Flake “35 republican senators would vote privately to impeach trump”

let the Flake character assassination begin. Do what you do best Trumpers
 
PainIsLIfe said:
Rep. Adam Schiff acknowledged on Thursday that he made up parts of the Ukraine phone call transcript when he delivered his opening statement at a much-watched TV hearing with the U.S. top intelligence officer.

In his opening statement, Mr. Schiff said Mr. Trump asked Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky for fabricated dirt on former Vice President Joe Biden and said Mr. Trump threatened to make the same request Mr. Zelensky eight times–––both quotes not in the transcript.


When it came his time to question Joseph Maguire, the acting Director of National Intelligence, Mr. Turner noted inaccuracies uttered to a large TV audience as Democrats rev up talk of impeachment.

"It's not the conversation that was in the chairman’s opening statement,” Mr. Turner said. “And while the chairman was speaking I actually had someone text me, ‘is he just making this up?’ And yes, yes, he was because sometimes fiction is better than the actual words or the text. But luckily, the American public are smart, and they have the transcript. They’ve read the conversation. They know when someone is just making it up.”

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/sep/26/adam-schiff-called-out-fabricating-ukraine-call-tr/


How can democats complain about Trump's dishonesty when their own party leaders act this way?
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Hey as the guy that made the original thread can you please put DerpThroat in the title?
 
Extrajumboshrimps said:
Biden's running the classic playbook.
Admit nothing.
Deny everything.
Make counter-accusations.
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#Irony

Again, soliciting a foreign power to investigate someone (quid pro quo or not) is a crime. The fact that it is one of the front-runners of the opposing political party a year before an election and years after said events occurred and has nothing to do with Trump are all damning indictments of his motivations, but again, his intent (be it personal gain or for moral reasons) doesn't matter.
 
Schiff saying that was stupid, regardless if it was in jest and purposely hyperbolic. Hands down.

But it doesn’t take away from the fact that the POTUS asked a foreign power to investigate a political rival. The outrage should be directed at that from all sides. That’s not ok, it undermines our elections. Imagine if other world leaders knew they could gain favor with the US by digging up (or manufacturing) dirt on political opponents. That’s a real problem.
 
Interestingly, reading around and there's quite a few accusations that Burisma wasn't actually owned by Mykola Zlochevsky anymore. Rather it was owned by Igor Kolomoisky. Impossible to verify, and may well be a CT, but if it's true it'd certainly change the narrative.
 
PainIsLIfe said:
Rep. Adam Schiff acknowledged on Thursday that he made up parts of the Ukraine phone call transcript when he delivered his opening statement at a much-watched TV hearing with the U.S. top intelligence officer.

In his opening statement, Mr. Schiff said Mr. Trump asked Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky for fabricated dirt on former Vice President Joe Biden and said Mr. Trump threatened to make the same request Mr. Zelensky eight times–––both quotes not in the transcript.


When it came his time to question Joseph Maguire, the acting Director of National Intelligence, Mr. Turner noted inaccuracies uttered to a large TV audience as Democrats rev up talk of impeachment.

"It's not the conversation that was in the chairman’s opening statement,” Mr. Turner said. “And while the chairman was speaking I actually had someone text me, ‘is he just making this up?’ And yes, yes, he was because sometimes fiction is better than the actual words or the text. But luckily, the American public are smart, and they have the transcript. They’ve read the conversation. They know when someone is just making it up.”

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2019/sep/26/adam-schiff-called-out-fabricating-ukraine-call-tr/


How can democats complain about Trump's dishonesty when their own party leaders act this way?
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Maybe the actual transcript did say that. We will never know because the WH buried it and will never release it. What they gave us is notes and people's recollections of the call.
 
*Z* said:
Maybe the actual transcript did say that. We will never know because the WH buried it and will never release it. What they gave us is notes and people's recollections of the call.
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Is that a fact?
 
MTT said:
Is that a fact?
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It certainly reads like a transcript. I can't imagine anyone would write with Trump's speech mannerisms if it wasn't.
However it does say on the first page:
CAUTION: A Memorandum of a Telephone Conversation. (TELCON) is not a verbatim transcript of a discussion. The text in this document records the notes and recollections of Situation Room Duty "Officers and-NSC policy staff assigned to listen and memorialize the conversation in written form as the conversation takes place. A number of factors can affect 'the accuracy of the record, including poor telecommunications connections and variations in accent and/or interpretation. The word "inaudible" is used to indifate portions of a conversation that the notetaker was unable to hear.
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Also the conversation doesn't seem long enough to have taken 30 minutes. Even allowing for Trump's speech patterns.
 
zebby23 said:
Jeff Flake “35 republican senators would vote privately to impeach trump”

let the Flake character assassination begin. Do what you do best Trumpers
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Even his name is Flake lol.
 
@MikeMcMann
QUOTE: well thanks for agreeing with me and making my point.​

You prior claimed this was not started over Trump identifying the Biden issue for investigation and quoted him saying it was over other reasons which he offered up later and acted as if you quoting him offering those other reasons was proof.​

I said you are not proving anything as I can quote (and you now admit) he keeps changing why it started. And that is ture. that is MY point. Thx.​

But the first one offered that put this in play was the Biden angle even if he is working to change that rationale now after, as he has learned that reason is one that is illegal for him to pursue.


​

Yes I believe that is the real reason, but I said the phone call doesnt support that it was to get dirt on Biden.

I then posted the call transcript and you posted a vid of Rudy saying that he started investigating on his own without Trumps knowledge as some sort of proof that Trump broke the law.

As for campaign violations - those are handled with fines not impeachment lest you want to start with house dems...
 
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