This is why title defenses matter

Hazuki Ryo

Hazuki Ryo

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Forget about double champ status (sorry Pereira, Conor). The most impressive thing will always be the ability to defend a belt multiple times. Because as we saw with Volk, as you get older, young wolves will keep coming at you and being able to fight them off is incredibly hard.

Not only because of the physical deterioration with mileage, but also because of the mental aspect of it. Volk drowned his anxiety with alcohol. It's hard to be on top, harder to stay.

And this is why Jones, Silva, GSP, Aldo will remain the mount Rushmore of MMA for a long time.

EDIT : Damn I forgot Mighty Mouse as well.. My bad
 
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Only people who have bias or dont understand the sport dont value title defenses the way they should.
This is the most important things when it comes to greatness.

That's why I've always had a ton a respect for guys i was never fan of. A guy like Tyron Woodley is a good example. Not a fan of his but the fact that he defended four times in a stacked division speaks volume.

If you know anything about the sport, it will always be more meaningful than guys who won titles, did not defend and moved up like Conor or Pereira.
 
RockyLockridge said:
This some fighters have better journeys than title reigns. Like max, for example
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deanambrose said:
No, resume matters. No matter if you beat prime Max with or without belt.
Journey to the championship matters
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Yes but it doesn't involve the mental aspect of defending a belt everyone wants.

Many guys fought the fight of their life for a title shot (gus, Hendricks, Reyes) and ended up declining after. This is why it's hard, you have to be at your top every title fight and fight hungry sharks. The top of the food chain.

Yes journey matters also. Ferguson is the perfect illustration of it. But Khabib will never be part of the GOATs because he didn't defend enough. That's it.
 
Hazuki Ryo said:
Forget about double champ status (sorry Pereira, Conor). The most impressive thing will always be the ability to defend a belt multiple times. Because as we saw with Volk, as you get older, young wolves will keep coming at you and being able to fight them off is incredibly hard.

Not only because of the physical deterioration with mileage, but also because of the mental aspect of it. Volk drowned his anxiety with alcohol. It's hard to be on top, harder to stay.

And this is why Jones, Silva, GSP, Aldo will remain the mount Rushmore of MMA for a long time.
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11 title defenses doesn't get you on Mt. Rushmore?

1708276746453.png
 
Everyone knows Ilia is the FW GOAT. It’s obvious from his performances and being undefeated. Never lost, that’s what matters
 
jeff7b9 said:
We live in a very impatient,.instant gratification based era of society.

I have decided to try to just sit back and let people be wrong. No point in arguing, they don't grasp facts or math.
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This is why I debate whether to nuke my account here. I get tired of everyone claiming latest is greatest and perpetuating everything that's wrong with the landscape today. I was so so close recently.
 
deanambrose said:
No, resume matters. No matter if you beat prime Max with or without belt.
Journey to the championship matters too.
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Resume matters. But defenses are more impressive on your resume. Every fighter GSP beat in his 9 defenses were at the top of their game when they fought. Volk beating Max twice while defending is worth much much much more then Conor's defeat of Max early on in his career. Context is important as well.
 
I've always said the the true greatness of a fighter is the ability to reign over a division and win fights at the highest level, which are title fights. The more a fighter does this, the greater they are. It is the most honest way to prove greatness. If we look at the the long reigning champs like Jones, Anderson, GSP, Johnson and then the next level guys like Usman, Volk and Izzy, these guys have shown the ability to beat most of the best fighters in a period of time in a division. All those guys were the best for several years.

Now in terms of two division champs and how that stacks up against single division champs? In theory, if you have a long time divisional champion who defends 6-8 times and then moves up and defends several times in a different class. Yes, that would be IMO be more superior than a single divisional champion. And the UFC has attempted this with Izzy and Volk, but they just couldn't win the titles.

However, majority of the two division champs and ones that are trying now falls more into just the right match making and path to titles and I see it more as fabrication greatness and marekting than actual greatness based on wins. Guys like Conor, Cejudo, Perreira fall right into that. They got the right path to title fights and it's more fabricated than legitimattly being great.
 
JKS said:
I've always said the the true greatness of a fighter is the ability to reign over a division and win fights at the highest level, which are title fights. The more a fighter does this, the greater they are. It is the most honest way to prove greatness. If we look at the the long reigning champs like Jones, Anderson, GSP, Johnson and then the next level guys like Usman, Volk and Izzy, these guys have shown the ability to beat most of the best fighters in a period of time in a division. All those guys were the best for several years.

Now in terms of two division champs and how that stacks up against single division champs? In theory, if you have a long time divisional champion who defends 6-8 times and then moves up and defends several times in a different class. Yes, that would be IMO be more superior than a single divisional champion. And the UFC has attempted this with Izzy and Volk, but they just couldn't win the titles.

However, majority of the two division champs and ones that are trying now falls more into just the right match making and path to titles and I see it more as fabrication greatness and marekting than actual greatness based on wins. Guys like Conor, Cejudo, Perreira fall right into that. They got the right path to title fights and it's more fabricated than legitimattly being great.
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** please excuse my little side rant, I address your exact subject matter below.
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It is funny to me how Dana used to go on and on about how his business model was superior to boxing, only for his company to then go PRECISELY down so many of the same paths.

The UFC has 2 heavyweight champs right now and they aren't planning to fight eachother next.

"Our guys fight 3x a year against the best guys"

Outside of PrideFC, they never did, but currently we are lucky to see a belt defended every 10 months or so, and rematches happen so often that a division can easily go 2-3 years without fresh challengers, as we have seen in HW, 125, LW (Islam hasn't faced an actual LW in 1.5 years I think)
____________________________________

**
The whole "Double Champ" nonsense is almost entirely based on favoritism.

Jose Aldo didn't speak English so when he had 6 title defenses he was told he needed to vacate to attempt 155, meanwhile Conor got to hold his 145 belt for 3 fights out of the division just for a photoshoot holding up 2 belts he never defended once.

Before that, the OG double champs (Randy and BJ) both used the same method:
be a big name,
skip the line,
and switch divisions for free title shots

Anderson- non native English speaker, never got a chance at double gold even though he had legit top 5 wins in 3 weight classes.and racked up double digit title defenses.


If it wasn't for double standards, there were be no standards at all.
 
jeff7b9 said:
** please excuse my little side rant, I address your exact subject matter below.
__________________
It is funny to me how Dana used to go on and on about how his business model was superior to boxing, only for his company to then go PRECISELY down so many of the same paths.

The UFC has 2 heavyweight champs right now and they aren't planning to fight eachother next.

"Our guys fight 3x a year against the best guys"

Outside of PrideFC, they never did, but currently we are lucky to see a belt defended every 10 months or so, and rematches happen so often that a division can easily go 2-3 years without fresh challengers, as we have seen in HW, 125, LW (Islam hasn't faced an actual LW in 1.5 years I think)
____________________________________

**
The whole "Double Champ" nonsense is almost entirely based on favoritism.

Jose Aldo didn't speak English so when he had 6 title defenses he was told he needed to vacate to attempt 155, meanwhile Conor got to hold his 145 belt for 3 fights out of the division just for a photoshoot holding up 2 belts he never defended once.

Before that, the OG double champs (Randy and BJ) both used the same method:
be a big name,
skip the line,
and switch divisions for free title shots

Anderson- non native English speaker, never got a chance at double gold even though he had legit top 5 wins in 3 weight classes.and racked up double digit title defenses.


If it wasn't for double standards, there were be no standards at all.
Click to expand...

And that is exactly what I am saying with the champ champs, the ones we've had have been given opportunities easier and the right match making. And that's what I mean by fabricated greatness. Like Conor had a great run at FW and was as legit as it gets getting the belt. But he never defended once and got an instant shot at at fighter who he matched up well with. And then he lost his next 3 fights at LW. But yet the perception is he's some great champion. Same with Randy.

Fighters like Aldo and Anderson were the right ones to give a title shot to in a higher class. That would have been true greatness and real two division champs.
 
JKS said:
And that is exactly what I am saying with the champ champs, the ones we've had have been given opportunities easier and the right match making. And that's what I mean by fabricated greatness. Like Conor had a great run at FW and was as legit as it gets getting the belt. But he never defended once and got an instant shot at at fighter who he matched up well with. And then he lost his next 3 fights at LW. But yet the perception is he's some great champion. Same with Randy.

Fighters like Aldo and Anderson were the right ones to give a title shot to in a higher class. That would have been true greatness and real two division champs.
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And you are speaking the truth sir.

Aldo (135, 145 ,155) and Anderson (170, 185, 205) both, in my humble opinion, would have had a very strong chance to have won belts in 3 different weight classes if they received the same favorable treatment as a PPV draw with strong native english speaking microphone skills.

It has gotten to the point where guys like OMalley and Ilia were both talking about double champ fights before they actually WON THE TITLE, and Dricus and Leon both started campaigning for 2nd belts instead of facing challengers almost immediately upon becoming champ.

If OMalley gets past Chito, will he actually face Merab, who he is ducking right now?

He will very likely lose to Merab, thus ending his reign, where if he challenges Ilia, maybe he gets lucky and someone picks off merab for him. Either way he would get 2 more title fight paychecks instead of one, and the UFC seems to be on board with squeezing every possible penny out of the sugar show.

It's a mess. All these fighters have realized that they have a short window to build the financial future and that everyone else is disregarding the purity of the sport, so if you can't beat them, join them.
 
Defenses of the title certainly matter. Probably first and foremost. Before long though comes those calls to move up. It seems now more than ever before there are pressures to move up even sooner to be put on the map with those who have succeeded with that. I don't care for it. Take of your belt/division before looking elesewhere.
 
No matter from what angle you look, Jon Jones is the greatest
 
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