Law The Trump administration is officially moving to overturn a law that requires clergy to report child sexual abuse, saying it violates priests' constit

[HereticBD]

I thought they were already obligated to report any potential criminal activity through confession. I might be thinking of psychiatrists with doctor patient confidentiality, though.

It's a pretty stupid loophole if they're not. I get privacy and all that, and confession is supposed to be between you and God, but to what end?

 

[DoctorTaco]

So i understand it right - there is a law that FORCES priests to disclose if one comes and confesses to abuse of children? And their point is - there shouldn't be such a law?

Cause ok, if there isn't a law, they can keep doing it anyway, right? If their conscience forces them to do it, they will disclose it to the police. I don't see how a law would affect them, it's not like the pdf would confess to the deed AND to confessing about it to the priest, which would constitute a breach of law. maybe i'm not understanding it right.

Priests are not mandatory reporters, the state of Washington is saying they should be.

 

[EL CORINTHIAN]

I thought they were already obligated to report any potential criminal activity through confession. I might be thinking of psychiatrists with doctor patient confidentiality, though.

It's a pretty stupid loophole if they're not. I get privacy and all that, and confession is supposed to be between you and God, but to what end?

I was gonna ask about psychiatrists and lawyers too. Are they obligated to report confessions like that?

Fuck all that though. s deserve to be dragged through the street.

 

[Fox by the Sea]

Priests are not mandatory reporters, the state of Washington is saying they should be.

Would this apply only to christians or to any religious denomination? i don't know how it works with the muslims or others, but i assume there's a history of similar contact between worshipper and "priest" in all of them. Jews too?

 

[Big Nasty Edison]

Surprising they don't get along better.

Two sides of the sane coin

 

[DoctorTaco]

No it's a matter of prosecuting someone who isn't even the person who committed the crime just for abiding by the well established laws of their religion.

ok, let’s change tact. If someone came in and told the priest they were going to perpetrate a mass casualty event, should the priest be obligated to tell someone? What is a priest to do if that person says they are going to target that church with their plot to kill dozens?

What if a child tells the priest during confession they are being molested? Should the priest be punished by the church for speaking up and helping the child?

But if we are talking about drawing lines, then why is it limited to this and they aren't forced to report everything else too?

You never drew a line. I would honestly care to know where yours is on this issue.

Is there any act heinous enough that a priest should have to report it to the authorities? Is there any act so heinous that it shouldn’t be covered by religious freedom?

The point of confession is that the person is looking religious or spiritual guidance for things they regret or feel guilty about, and are only free to do that knowing that it never leaves the confessional. They simply won't confess if they don't have that guarantee.

There is no way to know that they wouldn’t still confess. People say things to mandatory reporters all the time. Also, mandatory reporters are supposed to report suspicion of child endangerment too.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Would this apply only to christians or to any religious denomination? i don't know how it works with the muslims or others, but i assume there's a history of similar contact between worshipper and "priest" in all of them. Jews too?

Yes, all clergy regardless of religion. It’s pretty common

“States that include clergy as mandated reporters are Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Georgia, Illinois, Louisiana, Maine, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, South Carolina ...“

 

[Sinister]

This is dumb, religions is archaic and should be obsolete. Kids should be protected no matter what and should supersede everything else.

Imagine coming in here, again after YEARS of declaring that Trump is enemy #1 to every pdf file in the US, and arguing that this is somehow good. That someone's f*cking superstition should allow them to not tell Civil authorities about disgusting child predators. That, according to them, allowing people to face civic justice for their heinous acts towards children, is bad because their imaginary friend told them so. And this coming from an entity with vast amounts of political corruption who got outed for protecting child predators systemically BY cooperating with civic authorities in an effort to keep the fact that they knowingly put child predators in communities hidden. and prevented them from facing accountability.

 

[DoctorTaco]

TBF, he just copied it from a literal paid propagandist on bluesky who was the one intentionally lying because it's bluesky where they won't settle for anything less than dishonest propaganda. It's why the sherdog lefties all fall for the same stories and start raging when they find out they've been duped.

I posted the article.

 

[DoctorTaco]

I thought they were already obligated to report any potential criminal activity through confession. I might be thinking of psychiatrists with doctor patient confidentiality, though.

It's a pretty stupid loophole if they're not. I get privacy and all that, and confession is supposed to be between you and God, but to what end?

Shrinks, doctors, coaches, teachers, other religious figures, they all are obligated to report if someone is at serious risk of harming themselves or others.

I was gonna ask about psychiatrists and lawyers too. Are they obligated to report confessions like that?

Fuck all that though. s deserve to be dragged through the street.

 

[Takes Two To Tango]

Imagine coming in here, again after YEARS of declaring that Trump is enemy #1 to every pdf file in the US, and arguing that this is somehow good. That someone's f*cking superstition should allow them to not tell Civil authorities about disgusting child predators. That, according to them, allowing people to face civic justice for their heinous acts towards children, is bad because their imaginary friend told them so. And this coming from an entity with vast amounts of political corruption who got outed for protecting child predators systemically BY cooperating with civic authorities in an effort to keep the fact that they knowingly put child predators in communities hidden. and prevented them from facing accountability.

Well said man.

 

[shockaholic12]

Uh, kind of leaving out a pretty big part there, no? The lawsuit is specifically about reporting what is told to them in confession because the punishment for that is excommunication. They still report anything told to them outside of confession. The seal of confession has been around since the early 13th century, it's not some shit they made up last week, so obviously demanding under threat of criminal penalty that the entire Catholic church violate canon law because of a law Washington state did just make 10 weeks ago that hasn't even taken effect is a pretty obvious violation of religious freedom.

The church doesn’t even excommunicate its people for raping kids so all this pearl clutching about 13th century “church law” that can’t be broken or woe is me is bullshit.

The church didn’t just let itself get away with preying on kids, it used it’s power to enable it, so claiming they have some lofty set of rules they must follow or they must punish themselves is a bullshit.

 

[Fox by the Sea]

Yes, all clergy regardless of religion. It’s pretty common

“States that include clergy as mandated reporters are Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Georgia, Illinois, Louisiana, Maine, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, South Carolina ...“

Ah ok now it makes sense.
Why would anyone want this law NOT to keep applying lol?

 

[rearnakedchoke]

In b4 the predator apologists of Sherfront come in to defend their predator in chief?

Edit: too late.

 

[TUFNewb]

Everywhere else in the world and all 49 other states respect the seal of confession.

Uh no not everywhere else.

Here priests are mandatory reporters. It extends to everyone in every profession, and to the general public. There is no confidential relationship that is above reporting child abuse... wtf that is the most retarded thing I have ever heard, had no idea priests get a pass on child neglect. Really all the states?? Different American culture hard to judge I guess.

 

[jefferz]

Yes, all clergy regardless of religion. It’s pretty common

“States that include clergy as mandated reporters are Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Georgia, Illinois, Louisiana, Maine, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, South Carolina ...“

North Dakota does not.
A bill was brought up, but it didn’t make it out of committee because they claimed the same thing, it violated their first amendment rights.

 

[CatchnShoot]

If you haven't figured it out yet..... Trump is really pro-Fredo. They are his people.

 

[nostradumbass]

Priests have been hiding kid diddlers amongst their own ranks since the early 13th century, too. Some of these religious nutjob traditions objectively suck and need to end.
But, hey, we all know why you guys suddenly had to stop pretending to care about kids recently, so carry on I guess.

Lol at the left pretending to suddenly give a flying fuck about kids after decades of demanding the right to murder babies they don't want with impunity, facilitating child trafficking across the border, and demanding to have sex talks with other people's children.

You know perfectly well the ONLY reason the left even pretend to care is when it infringes on religious liberty.

ok, let’s change tact. If someone came in and told the priest they were going to perpetrate a mass casualty event, should the priest be obligated to tell someone? What is a priest to do if that person says they are going to target that church with their plot to kill dozens?

What if a child tells the priest during confession they are being molested? Should the priest be punished by the church for speaking up and helping the child?

You never drew a line. I would honestly care to know where yours is on this issue.

Is there any act heinous enough that a priest should have to report it to the authorities? Is there any act so heinous that it shouldn’t be covered by religious freedom?

There is no way to know that they wouldn’t still confess. People say things to mandatory reporters all the time. Also, mandatory reporters are supposed to report suspicion of child endangerment too.

The line is imminent threat, not confessing past sins, which is what confession is.

This isn't for victims confessing, because that's very easy to just advise them to either report it to authorities themselves, or to tell them outside of confession where they are obligated to report it.

Yes, all clergy regardless of religion. It’s pretty common

“States that include clergy as mandated reporters are Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Georgia, Illinois, Louisiana, Maine, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, South Carolina ...“

Check those laws individually, because nearly all of them exempt confession. Nobody is arguing for them to not report anything they learn outside of confession, it is specifically the 1 aspect.

 

[cincymma79]

I thought they were already obligated to report any potential criminal activity through confession. I might be thinking of psychiatrists with doctor patient confidentiality, though.

It's a pretty stupid loophole if they're not. I get privacy and all that, and confession is supposed to be between you and God, but to what end?

Because it won’t stop there. This goes under attorney client type of coverage. This is the kind of thing you hate to have to have.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Lol at the left pretending to suddenly give a flying fuck about kids after decades of demanding the right to murder babies they don't want with impunity, facilitating child trafficking across the border, and demanding to have sex talks with other people's children.

I am not avatar for all left leaning voters and politicians. None of this has anything to do with the conversation you and I are trying to have as individuals. (Also, whataboutism)

You know perfectly well the ONLY reason the left even pretend to care is when it infringes on religious liberty.

The line is imminent threat, not confessing past sins, which is what confession is.

How would them telling the authority about an imminent threat not violate their first amendment right?

You know that most molesters are serial in their actions, right? Considering how the passage of time works anything you confess will be in the past. Somebody could molested child while they are waiting in line for a confessional booth and then when they tell the priest about it the priest would have to say, “well it is in the past so I better not tell anybody”.

This isn't for victims confessing, because that's very easy to just advise them to either report it to authorities themselves, or to tell them outside of confession where they are obligated to report it.

Victims do not go to the authorities for a myriad of reasons. Are you suggesting here that you would be OK with making the mandatory reporters except when they are inside a little wooden box behind a curtain?

Check those laws individually, because nearly all of them exempt confession. Nobody is arguing for them to not report anything they learn outside of confession, it is specifically the 1 aspect.

Again- this makes no logical sense whatsoever.