Submission Holds Are A More Definitive Ending To A Fight Than KOs

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Blackjack

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When you make your opponent say "I quit" that's the most definitive ending to a fight you could possible have. Even after being KOd may fighters have wanted to continue after regaining consciousness but the referees don;t allow them to continue. They're depending on a 3rd person to decide the fight should end. When a fighter has to say "I quit" that is a 100% definitive ending to a fight. It doesn't rely on a referee's judgement or that of the judges. It's the only finish in The UFC that is entirely definitive.
 
I respectfully decline to take that position. A walk off KO is the bees knees.
 
I agree. The absolute 100% clean KO's like Hendo/Bisping and Hall/Cella are almost as decisive though
 
This post is even better if you zoom the page in to 250% and pretend TS wrote it in crayon.
 
If the person is still cognizant enough to communicate that he surrenders, you're a pussy and don't know how to finish a fight.
 
Ko - tko - submission - dominant point win - split decision win - robery

In that order
 
I strongly prefer watching submissions in MMA and LOVE the transitions that get them to that point. I would not go so far as to say that makes it more definitive, just more interesting to me.
 
Uhhhh....how can anyone say "I quit " when they're unconscious?
 
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Yes because in real fights when you're choking a person unconscious or breaking a limb, you stop when they ask.

Relieving a man of his consciousness is about as definitive as it gets when the goal is to stop your opponent.
 
Blackjack said:
When you make your opponent say "I quit" that's the most definitive ending to a fight you could possible have. Even after being KOd may fighters have wanted to continue after regaining consciousness but the referees don;t allow them to continue. They're depending on a 3rd person to decide the fight should end. When a fighter has to say "I quit" that is a 100% definitive ending to a fight. It doesn't rely on a referee's judgement or that of the judges. It's the only finish in The UFC that is entirely definitive.
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I can fight back with a broken arm or leg. May not work very well, but it can be done.

You know what you can't do? You can't fight back if you knocked out cold. You are basically a corpse.

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sure.

just ask Ken Shamrock.
 
You're lumping controversial KOs together with coma-inducing KOs. This only happens in fightfinder. In many cases, after a fighter KTFO his opponent, he could take his opponents back, wake him up, then force him to submit.

Also, there are some cases where the tapout is controversial, Rousey had one of these in Strikeforce.

I will agree though that many fighters would prefer to go out like a G than to tap (and go out like MacG)
 
Frode Falch said:
Ko - tko - submission - dominant point win - split decision win - robery

In that order
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I would say KO=Sub - tko - dominant decision win - close unanimous decision win - fluke injury win - split decision win - Robbery - DQ - Officials error.

The two stupidest FUGGed up victories IMO were Johnson winning by breaking AA jaw six minutes into the five minute first round, followed by Mighty Mouse winning on an elementary school arithmetic error!
 
UNANIMOUS DECISIONS ARE MORE DEFINITIVE THAN SUBMISSIONS.

in a submission, 1 guy says "you won".

in a UD, 3 guys said "you won".
 
The only thing that stops them from being literally killed after a KO is the REF there to stop him by pushing the agressor out of the way, othersiwe the KOed guy would just be brutally killed, there´s nothing more definitive than that.
 
J. Bernie Cunningham said:
Yes because in real fights when you're choking a person unconscious or breaking a limb, you stop when they ask.

Relieving a man of his consciousness is about as definitive as it gets when the goal is to stop your opponent.
Click to expand...

Momentarily taking a man's consciousness away isn't nearly as debilitating to the soul and the spirit of the man as forcing him to say he quits. A bruise or concussion from a knockout heals a lot sooner than the broken pride of a man forced to tell his opponent he quits.
 
Everybody is jumping the gun here

I think TS is referring to TKOs (think Martin Kampmann vs. Paul Daley)

in many cases (aka any Hendo fight aside from Vitor) Hendo gets ktfo 2 or 3 times then comes back and merks lol

Plus submissions do really make the guy say "I quit"

However, with all that being said, when someone is laid out cold, it is equally as dominant. Flash KO's are much more common than "flash subs" so theres an argument for that but still its pretty even

As we've seen over the years, standing TKOs or "early stoppages" don't always mean the fight is over and thats what TS is probably rambling about. Where as subs are basically decisive
 
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