Students Suspended Indefinitely For Confederate Flag

[UpaLoompa]

Even if that explains the lyric "In Birmingham they love the Guv'ner", it does not explain why he describes later speaks approvingly of the governor.

If they really are booing Governor Wallace, why do they later speak approvingly of him?

Dunno and you may well be correct.

 

[Halge]

The fucking Confederate constitution.

I quoted the part about joining states having to adopt slavery too.


You readily state this and then readily argue against it. Weird.

I never said slavery wasn't a major issue. Just far from the only major issue. You don't have to jump at every chance of misinterpretation.

 

[ncordless]

First of all: Source?

Second, every nation needs a constitution. Opposing statism does not mean you want complete anarchy. If the seceding states consented to the mandated slavery, and slavery was one of the main reasons for the the states to seek independence in the first place, in what way would mandated slavery indicate a lack of self-governance?

By that logic, the South did not lack self-governance in the union because they consented to the federal government being supreme.

 

[UpaLoompa]

I never said slavery wasn't a major issue. Just far from the only major issue. You don't have to jump at every chance of misinterpretation.

Your argument that the confederate flag is a symbol of self-governance (generally) rather than racism rests on the position that slavery was not the major issue at stake.
And, again, the confederate constitution disagrees with you on pretty much every argument you've made.

 

[UpaLoompa]

By that logic, the South did not lack self-governance in the union because they consented to the federal government being supreme.

Consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds?

 

[Halge]

By that logic, the South did not lack self-governance in the union because they consented to the federal government being supreme.

The federal government might be laid down in constitutional law. But have you ever heard of the 13th amendment?

 

[oldshadow]

Even if that explains the lyric "In Birmingham they love the Guv'ner", it does not explain why he describes later speaks approvingly of the governor.

If they really are booing Governor Wallace, why do they later speak approvingly of him?

You had to live through those times to understand the hate love relationship of the young people with George Wallace.

 

[Halge]

Your argument that the confederate flag is a symbol of self-governance (generally) rather than racism rests on the position that slavery was not the major issue at stake.

Opposition towards overbearing federal policymaking was as much an issue as the issue of slavery itself. We're going around in circles here.

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

Union states had slavery just like the south. So they're not racist because they decided to change positions before the south? That's weird.

No moran. Read what I wrote. THEY DID NOT FIGHT A WAR TO PRESERVE IT.

Do you understand this phrase or are you just trying to tapdance around this embarrassing part of Southern history?

Commit egregious acts, refute said acts, then no longer a racist. I disagree. Both sides have good/ bad stuff. To me, that's obvious. Not apparently to most.

UNION DID NOT FIGHT A WAR TO PRESERVE SLAVERY.

Big difference between just practicing slavery and FIGHTING A WAR AND KILLING PEOPLE TO PRESERVE THAT RIGHT FOR THE NOBILITY.

 

[UpaLoompa]

The federal government might be laid down in constitutional law. But have you ever heard of the 13th amendment?

The 13th amendment played zero role in secession. Zero.


Time, how does it work.

 

[Jukai]

You don't see self-governance as intrinsically good and believe someone needs to justify the desire for it?

Apologies if you're making a good-ass joke, but no, I don't see self-governance as intrinsically good because that self-governance was continuing to use blacks as fucking property

 

[ncordless]

The federal government might be laid down in constitutional law. But have you ever heard of the 13th amendment?

I have many times.

1) It wasn't in existence when the South seceded.

2) It was passed according to the rules of amending the Constitution that the South agreed to. So again, under your logic, the South had no lack of self-governance when they agreed to terms that would allow the passage of the 13th amendment.

 

[UpaLoompa]

Opposition towards overbearing federal policymaking was as much an issue as the issue of slavery itself. We're going around in circles here.

What policy? The answer is whether or not slavery was going to be allowed in territories and new states. That was the central issue at the time. Characterizing the limiting the expansion of slavery as "overbearing federal policy making" is as despicable as worrying about a transition to a "free labor economy".

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

Opposition towards overbearing federal policymaking was as much an issue as the issue of slavery itself. We're going around in circles here.

Virtually none of the Declarations of Secession list 'overbearing federal government' as a reason why they seceded.

They do list slavery though.

 

[Falsedawn]

The 13th amendment played zero role in secession. Zero.


Time, how does it work.

However damn well we want it to work!

 

[UpaLoompa]

Virtually none of the Declarations of Secession list 'overbearing federal government' as a reason why they seceded.

They do list slavery though.

Add to that the fact that the Confederacy's constitution had an identical Supremacy Clause. Add to that the fact that the Confederacy mandated slavery be legal in all confederate states and territories.

Oh wait, we're pretending that these things don't exist.

 

[Halge]

The 13th amendment played zero role in secession. Zero.


Time, how does it work.

You don't think the southern states knew it was coming?

 

[HOLA]

Why does this Swede have such a hard on for the Confederacy?

 

[UpaLoompa]

You don't think the southern states knew it was coming?

So, again, we come back to agreeing that the Confederacy was born to protect the institution. This assertion about its origins is supported by multiple lines of evidence and is demonstrated irrefutably by the constitution of the Confederacy (which you amusingly keep ignoring).

How then is the fucking battle flag of a country that existed solely to protect slavery not a symbol of slavery and therefore racism?

 

[Jukai]

So, again, we come back to agreeing that the Confederacy was born to protect the institution. This assertion about its origins is supported by multiple lines of evidence and is demonstrated irrefutably by the constitution of the Confederacy (which you amusingly keep ignoring).

How then is the fucking battle flag of a country that existed solely to protect slavery not a symbol of slavery and therefore racism?

I don't think you understand, they left the union because of SELF-GOVERNANCE, man. It just so happened that the self-governance issues were 100% about slavery. But, you know, freedom to keep others not free and all.