Star Wars Megathread

[Crawler89]

I'm with you on the first release of High Republic, but there's so much potential that I'm looking at the future with wide eyed anticipation.

it's almost completely wide open territory, so finger's crossed they can come up with something cool to do during that time.

Next ep comes out this week, so hopefully they get on with it.

yeah im going to keep up and follow along with the high republic stuff.

I was too young/not informed/had no internets to follow the EU before the disney buy much so im keen to have a new part of the universe i can follow

But still...can feel the PC'ing going on

 

[Aegon Spengler]

 

[Mcountry]

That’s why it’s concept art my dude.

I guess but that could never pass since it's eyes are entirely different anatomicaly

 

[Steve-French]

I decided to dive back into the Star Wars universe. I resubscribed to Disney+ Because of Wandavision, so I figured I might as well dive into something else. I was born in 1980 and used to like the Star Wars stuff as a kid, but I haven't watched any thing Star Wars (Besides the Han Solo movie a couple of years ago) since I saw Episode III in the movie theater in 2005. I honestly don't remember much of it tbh.

I'm going to watch them in the order below, then dive into the Mandalorian series.

1. Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace
   
   
2. Star Wars Episode II: Attack of the Clones
   
   
3. Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith
   
   
4. Solo
   
   
5. Rogue One
   
   
6. Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope
   
   
7. Star Wars Episode V: The Empire Strikes Back
   
   
8. Star Wars Episode VI: Return of the Jedi
   
   
9. Star Wars Episode VII: The Force Awakens
   
   
10. Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi
    
    
11. Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker
    

 

[Deleted member 110072]

The problem with KK was that George worked her into the deal with the understanding she would adhere to his vision and not let Iger and Disney stray from the path he set the franchise on. Boy was he surprised when she went with her own vision for Star Wars, and the franchise paid for it.

There was one recent video by a YouTuber I like that discussed the story telling method of Star Wars. While I will never like Rian Johnson or TLJ, he makes some valid points about the way the sequel trilogy rolled out. Which leads me to believe that we wouldn't have like George Lucas directing these sequel movies any better had he gone with his plan. The old fan base is firmly entrenched with things that happened in non canon and want them to become canon. Probably why Favereau has had such a positive response with his Luke. We want fan service, not new wokeness.

I think he's seriously reaching with some of those efforts to play Rise of Skywalker is essentially the same film as ROTJ, it does lift some elements but the whole McGuffin quest that most of the film is built on really has no equivalent in ROTJ. The Palpatine plot is seriously questionable but I can't say it spoils an otherwise sucessful film for me, the film is IMHO just a really badly made formulaic peice of trash thats an embarrassment to the Starwars name, the worst film in the franchise by quite along way with almost zero redeming(maybe the Ben/Han scene) features.

I don't think I'm reaching when I say that the guy who directed and wrote 2/3rds of the ST in style we know he used previously for Trek is the main reason for their failure, especially as he set the tone/story, the decision to hire him to use his Trek formula to make a film ASAP was THE fundamental mistake in the ST IMHO. People were willing to look past it too much at the time because as I said he was being pushed as the example of "how to make great films by using simple formulaic script ideas" craze post Red Letter Media(who I'm a big fan of otherwise) videos, the anti Lucas(not that I rate the PT either). That whole culture was so primed to love TFA they gave it a free ride IMHO when really most of the problems with the sequels are there right from the start.

I'd agree with the video that the Rey/Kylo plot was by far the best element of the sequels, the only part of the films that felt like it had a reason for existing beyond making money from nostalgia which is the main reason I'm less harsh on Johnson. Again I'm more willing to believe he was fucked around with than Abrams, much smaller name with no big films previously, franchise had already been started with a certain style and the film seems to reject its own plot and tack on a generic ending.

Johnson himself has never really spoken out but I did think you kind of had a refference to the situation made in Knives Out, the way the plot introduces ring wing and liberal elements to the plot but has then as comedic irrelevant asides to a film that ends up being much more about class, there claimed politics isnt what drives the opponents the protagonist faces, greed is.

 

[Myrddin Wild]

fucking wall of text diatribe detailing how special your tastes are for wanting a unique Luke who milks cows and subverts expectations by going completely off of character to mope on an island for no particular reason what so ever.

No idea what you're talking about but I noticed how you conveniently left off that this was Lucas' version of Luke prior to the sale. Instead you try & roll off of that into it being "my tastes."

I clearly said that I would've enjoyed super hero luke & I explained how I let my pretense go after 1st viewing & just took the movie in for what it is, so I'm not sure what you're on about. I simply accepted what they showed on screen & found that I'm cool with it. once I got past "Not My Luke" I saw what a brilliant & beautifully made movie it really is.

all fans wanted was for him to pass the torch and go out as a hero like how ben did.

Don't look now, but he did go out like a hero

this isn't rocket science or Shawshank Redemption.

Lucas says that before all of the other things Star Wars is... the heart of it is about family. I thought they did a fantastic job in the Sequels of creating a family vibe. Even had the creepy grumpy uncle who showed in the end of TLJ that he really does love everyone.

you are absolutely allowed to like that steamy pile of shit. and I'm absolutely allowed to tell you that your tastes suck.

There's a HUGE difference between you telling me you disagree with my opinion compared to insulting me on a personal level because our opinions are different... & no you are absolutely NOT allowed to do that. I'm not going to be bullied & insulted without firing back. I let you have it pretty hard in my last post, so I'll just leave it at this for now, but if you insist on insulting me personally for liking a movie you didn't, you can just expect that I'm going to have some descriptive words for you that you won't like & you'll probably change the subject again like you did here rather than discuss the pertinent facts I brought up.

Hey, you didn't like it... that's fine. Teh fook do you need to attack me on a personal level for because I did?

 

[Myrddin Wild]

Lmao. TLJ is hot garbage by any measure. I KNOW you are trolling.

I have been a regular in these threads since before TLJ dropped expressing my honest opinions about it & all things Star Wars... & if anything since TLJ dropped, I love it more. I own it & have seen it at least half a dozen times if not more. Likely 7 or 8 by now.

Sherdog's own poll says that more Sherdoggers like the movie than dislike it. (post #516 of this thread) YOU are in the minority. How odd is your pov that "I must be trolling" when 378 people voted Neutral to Excellent. Even if you throw out the neutral people & go from "Decent to Excellent" in the poll, you still get 305 people which is OVER 100 MORE PEOPLE THAN VOTED THEY DIDN'T LIKE IT. IMDB & CinemaScores both confirm this on a larger scale.

You should try getting out of your echo chamber & wake up to the fact that people don't always have the same opinion as you.

Thank you for not insulting me on a personal level, but telling me you know I'm trolling after I've given you my honest opinion is riding that line. I'll give you a lack of experience for not being in these threads for the long haul, but anyone that's been in here for a while can tell you without a doubt that I'm 100% not trolling about my opinion. If they say otherwise... they're trolling... or they're new to these threads like you obviously are.

 

[Mcountry]

No idea what you're talking about but I noticed how you conveniently left off that this was Lucas' version of Luke prior to the sale. Instead you try & roll off of that into it being "my tastes."

I clearly said that I would've enjoyed super hero luke & I explained how I let my pretense go after 1st viewing & just took the movie in for what it is, so I'm not sure what you're on about. I simply accepted what they showed on screen & found that I'm cool with it. once I got past "Not My Luke" I saw what a brilliant & beautifully made movie it really is.

Don't look now, but he did go out like a hero

Lucas says that before all of the other things Star Wars is... the heart of it is about family. I thought they did a fantastic job in the Sequels of creating a family vibe. Even had the creepy uncle who showed in the end of TLJ that he really does love everyone.



There's a HUGE difference between you telling me your opinion & insulting me on a personal level... & no you are absolutely NOT allowed to do that. I'm not going to be bullied & insulted without firing back... & so I let you have it pretty hard in the last one & I'll just leave it at this for now, but if you insist on insulting me personally for liking a movie you didn't, you can just expect that I'm going to have some descriptive words for you that you won't like & you'll probably change the subject again like you did here rather than discuss the pertinent facts I brought up.

Hey, you didn't like it... that's fine. Teh fook do you need to attack me on a personal level for because I did?

Lucas isn't some grand master all knowing. He went kind of against his own ideology as soon as merchandising toys took over his vision. If you read interviews of him back then versus his direction and ideas now...it's night and day. Like two different people. Not sure how he went senile but he did.

Here's him declaring how SFX are there to enhance the story not replace it. Years before he decide to ruin the original trilogy with added scenes that completely detract from the action with needless special effects.



Does that George sound like the one who added this to his scenes?



At the end of the day you can turn your brain off and proclaim "kids movies, yo!" and to a certain extent you would be correct. These are not suppose to be very deep story lines. They are fairy tales. So you accepting the last jedi for what it is, that's fine. It was a piece of shit and a let down...but I'm sure if you are used to disappointment then movies like this would just blend right in!

But at the end of the day, Disney spent 4b+ to own this franchise/fairy tale, and the reason they did that is because the original trilogy sparked something in a wide base of audience that these sequels shit on. both on the concept of the characters and the fans who bought them up. so in that sense, they completely fucked it up. and it shows! merch was down. interest was down. fans were pissed off, rating bombing tlj. (don't see that happening to the Mandalorian I wonder why?) Solo lost money. And nobody really talks about these characters or any kind of spin off for them now.

I'll say it again.

Know thy audience.

Nobody who is a fan of these characters who buys the toys and dresses up in cosplay wanted to see Luke come back to act like a crusty old uncle who tosses light sabers away, bitches at clouds, milks space cows and declares that the Jedi must end. It was a bad call and disrespectful to the IP. And CLEARLY by the end of the movie his "great hero sacrifice" fell short and was lost on the audience who's expectations the story just took a shit on for the past 2 hours.

I attack you personally because I recall you having defended these choices back when it first released. Like this was some bold and progressive storytelling that only those who were enlightened enough to see it for what it was would enjoy. Which clearly, I was not and still am not to this day. But I submit that it's actually YOU who can't admit that it was a piss poor choice by the writer's and directors to steer the ship so completely off course from everything it was while attacking the fan base for not liking this "new direction". So back then and now, it's fairly obvious at this point that I was correct.

A more ENLIGHTENED response from yourself regarding these films would be to declare that while you enjoyed it for what it was trying to do, it was a piss poor direction to head in and one that likely will need course correction down the road. That's what you should have said instead of suggesting that everyone who couldn't enjoy that movie for what it was simply wasn't as "woke" as you were.

So ya. You get the privilege of my coming back here to tell you to fuck off. You were wrong. Just sit on it.

 

[Crash Lance]

Holy moly. This thread became a veritable war zone. I suppose that that makes sense. After all, this franchise is called STAR WARS.

 

[GearSolidMetal]

 

[lifelessheap]

I have been a regular in these threads since before TLJ dropped expressing my honest opinions about it & all things Star Wars... & if anything since TLJ dropped, I love it more. I own it & have seen it at least half a dozen times if not more. Likely 7 or 8 by now.

Sherdog's own poll says that more Sherdoggers like the movie than dislike it. (post #516 of this thread) YOU are in the minority. How odd is your pov that "I must be trolling" when 378 people voted Neutral to Excellent. Even if you throw out the neutral people & go from "Decent to Excellent" in the poll, you still get 305 people which is OVER 100 MORE PEOPLE THAN VOTED THEY DIDN'T LIKE IT. IMDB & CinemaScores both confirm this on a larger scale.

You should try getting out of your echo chamber & wake up to the fact that people don't always have the same opinion as you.

Thank you for not insulting me on a personal level, but telling me you know I'm trolling after I've given you my honest opinion is riding that line. I'll give you a lack of experience for not being in these threads for the long haul, but anyone that's been in here for a while can tell you without a doubt that I'm 100% not trolling about my opinion. If they say otherwise... they're trolling... or they're new to these threads like you obviously are.

I'm not a hardcore. My wife got 3 years of Disney+ for 36 bucks. I recently watched TLJ.

Horrible. Absolutely horrible.

All your words can't change that. LoL.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Lucas isn't some grand master all knowing. He went kind of against his own ideology as soon as merchandising toys took over his vision. If you read interviews of him back then versus his direction and ideas now...it's night and day. Like two different people. Not sure how he went senile but he did.

Here's him declaring how SFX are there to enhance the story not replace it. Years before he decide to ruin the original trilogy with added scenes that completely detract from the action with needless special effects.



Does that George sound like the one who added this to his scenes?



At the end of the day you can turn your brain off and proclaim "kids movies, yo!" and to a certain extent you would be correct. These are not suppose to be very deep story lines. They are fairy tales. So you accepting the last jedi for what it is, that's fine. It was a piece of shit and a let down...but I'm sure if you are used to disappointment then movies like this would just blend right in!

But at the end of the day, Disney spent 4b+ to own this franchise/fairy tale, and the reason they did that is because the original trilogy sparked something in a wide base of audience that these sequels shit on. both on the concept of the characters and the fans who bought them up. so in that sense, they completely fucked it up. and it shows! merch was down. interest was down. fans were pissed off, rating bombing tlj. (don't see that happening to the Mandalorian I wonder why?) Solo lost money. And nobody really talks about these characters or any kind of spin off for them now.

I'll say it again.

Know thy audience.

Nobody who is a fan of these characters who buys the toys and dresses up in cosplay wanted to see Luke come back to act like a crusty old uncle who tosses light sabers away, bitches at clouds, milks space cows and declares that the Jedi must end. It was a bad call and disrespectful to the IP. And CLEARLY by the end of the movie his "great hero sacrifice" fell short and was lost on the audience who's expectations the story just took a shit on for the past 2 hours.

I attack you personally because I recall you having defended these choices back when it first released. Like this was some bold and progressive storytelling that only those who were enlightened enough to see it for what it was would enjoy. Which clearly, I was not and still am not to this day. But I submit that it's actually YOU who can't admit that it was a piss poor choice by the writer's and directors to steer the ship so completely off course from everything it was while attacking the fan base for not liking this "new direction". So back then and now, it's fairly obvious at this point that I was correct.

A more ENLIGHTENED response from yourself regarding these films would be to declare that while you enjoyed it for what it was trying to do, it was a piss poor direction to head in and one that likely will need course correction down the road. That's what you should have said instead of suggesting that everyone who couldn't enjoy that movie for what it was simply wasn't as "woke" as you were.

So ya. You get the privilege of my coming back here to tell you to fuck off. You were wrong. Just sit on it.

Really I think the issue is that after ROTJ Lucas spent a great deal of time essentally running a VFX company for other peoples films, he did have a creative role in the Indy sequels of course but I think thats really what shifted his perspective. I think he'd have been better off remaining in those roles for the prequels, provide the technical knowhow needed, come up with basic plot idead and set pieces/settings whilst letting someone else write and direct.

Alot of the reason for the direction Disney went IMHO is that the culture around hatred of Lucas reached absolute fever pitch in the late 00's and early 10's to the degree I suspect they felt having him involved with the films at all would be a PR negative,

I feel the problem with Luke in The Last Jedi wasnt just the nature of the plot but also the general tone of the franchise. Again I think you see it in TFA were a neo empire is back and destorys the New Republic in an offhand fashion whilst a character like Han Solo shifts right back to his state in ANH. Making a film based on nostalgia and having respect for what your making films about are two very different things.

I can see a version of that Luke plot handed a bit differently, it was mentioend so often but the "Grey Jedi" idea I think could have worked so much better. You even have a few hints at it in TLJ which makes me think Johnson might have been looking to do that originally but the idea that Luke failed with Ben because he just outright rejected the Darkside seems far better than trying to kill him in his sleep based on a "feeling". That Luke has backed off from the conflict to try and perfect that kind of ideology were negative feelings are acknowledged more I think fans would have been much more accepting of.

 

[BisexualMMA]

I can see a version of that Luke plot handed a bit differently, it was mentioend so often but the "Grey Jedi" idea I think could have worked so much better. You even have a few hints at it in TLJ which makes me think Johnson might have been looking to do that originally but the idea that Luke failed with Ben because he just outright rejected the Darkside seems far better than trying to kill him in his sleep based on a "feeling". That Luke has backed off from the conflict to try and perfect that kind of ideology were negative feelings are acknowledged more I think fans would have been much more accepting of.

There were all kinds of versions of a Luke story like this that could have worked great...like Eastwood in Unforgiven, like Newman in The Color of Money, like Stallone in Creed or Rambo 4, like Bridges in Tron: Legacy...

Any of those would have been fine or even great. Eastwood wasn't humiliated in Unforgiven for an hour and half before he saddled up to avenge Ned. He was an old guy getting back in the groove. Unforgiven would have been a piece of shit if the first hour and a half was Clint molesting his horse, pooping his pants and sucking on pig nipples.

 

[Myrddin Wild]

Lucas isn't some grand master all knowing.

You completely missed the point I was making. You specifically called me out insulting me personally about how I think my tastes are special (lol) because I'm okay with "Not my Luke."

Lucas aside, & everyone & everything in the universe for that matter... I'm not trying to be special... I'm just okay with it. <deal with it> I was confused after my first viewing. I sat with it for a few days before I was able to move beyond my pretense & recognize what they were going for. I went back to the theater & watched it again, & I started enjoying the movie for how it was presented. I sat with that for a few days & on my 3rd theater viewing a week later I was completely over "not my luke" & had full acceptance of the movie how it is. That's not me being special. That's me sharing with you my real life experience. It's very honest of me to come out & tell you haters things like this because you guys surely don't give me even a fucking inch of anything but disdain. You exaggerate everything way beyond reality as well as trying to exaggerate & twist the things I say. I would think you'd find it refreshing that I'm sharing my legit experiences even when they sort of favor your pov. I evolved from siding with your pov in a week's time, but it's reality, & so I'm sharing it.

Beyond my personal pov... I pointed out that Lucas actually wrote him out to be that way to show you that it wasn't "my special pov that makes me special."

Beyond that, it is a fact that I'm in a very large group (the majority) who are okay with "Not my Luke" so that depletes my specialness even more. I seriously don't even know where you came up with that specialness thing which is why I started out my reply with "I don't know what you're talking about." You seem to be just throwing anything against the wall to see what sticks.

I'll even go even another step further to say that I personally enjoy the throw back reference to blue milk. FTW I love that scene. That's my statement.

Thank you for acknowledging that Lucas created "not my Luke" in this post though. I don't agree with the things you're saying, but I'm glad you're not ignoring it. Our differences aside for just a brief moment... thank you for sharing that interview with OT Lucas. If I had seen it I'd forgotten about it. Okay, back to our differences.

He also says in other interviews that his budget for the first movie didn't allow him to realize his full vision & that those ad-ons were his way of finishing out his original vision.

Also, I don't see Lucas adding a few special effects in there as being contrary to what he said. He said you don't have to spend too much film time on that stuff. He doesn't say "zero time." He's mentioning that to say that other film makers actually slow the story down just to show off their beautiful settings. So adding a few things in here & there to scenes that are already in the movie are not contrary to what he's saying imo. In fact it supports it, because he's adding something interesting to what would otherwise be just a "background" shot. The added Jabba scene isn't just to throw in some CGI... it actually enhanses the story & doesn't slow it down. iow... Jabba's not in there just to show off CGI or whatever your pov is. (thank god they didn't go with the fat guy they hired initially)

BTW, just so you know... you're talking to a guy who has gone through extensive lengths to now own my own copy of the original Star Wars as close to as it was in the movie theater originally as I could get... with the fooking screen dirt & all. So I do appreciate the original "film." I do however also appreciate Lucas' final "vision." We're allowed to appreciate both. The CGI add-ons don't bother me in the slightest like they do others, in fact I enjoy the contrast. I do like going back & watching the naustalgic original crackling dirty screen version of it too though where Han shot first! even though I'm missing the Jabba scene I so love. One of these dayz I'll rock up & get that fooking 80GB "project 4k77" version of A New Hope. That looks amazing. Anywayz... I'm rambling... lets see what else you want to talk about. You're probably already cuing up your comments about how long this reply is.

Actually, I'll make this a separate post from the rest cause I know how grumpy you get when it gets too long.

You're welcome
Your buddy
Wildo

 

[Myrddin Wild]

It was a piece of shit and a let down...but I'm sure if you are used to disappointment then movies like this would just blend right in!

Again, you have this insatiable need to make it out like it's something other than the fact that I just enjoy it. You're making it out like "I'm used to disappointment" LMAO. You're a piece of work bro. You can't even get close to imagining that this is just a great piece of cinema for some people. Get over yourself bro. There's almost 8 billion people other than yourself on this planet for your communistic viewpoint to have any validity.

I attack you personally because I recall you having defended these choices back when it first released. Like this was some bold and progressive storytelling that only those who were enlightened enough to see it for what it was would enjoy.

That's ridiculous. I actually like it for the continuation of the story. Being subversive or bold & progressive has nothing to do with it. That's the exact same Luke from the OT. The only thing progressive about it would be if you deny that self-defeatist Luke wasn't clearly shown in the OT. yes, he did rock up on several occasions, but it's in his nature. That's why Yoda didn't want to train him. He was too tainted... & the frustrated hermit luke we see in TLJ is an exact extension of that.

Only the Enlightened can see it? lol... those are your words not mine.

Did it ever occur to you that I actually am just telling you how I feel? I wasn't just doing this for some sort of social media shine. I simply enjoy talking Star Wars. In fact Dragon called me out because he knew I went to opening night, but then I didn't come rushing into the thread to post about it for a few days. One of my very first posts about TLJ was to him about how I had to sit it out for a few days & watch it a second time before I was able to get past my pretense to see what the film was actually saying before I could comment. Once I did, I came in here & told exactly the process I went through & exactly what my true feelings were. Is it so hard for you to understand that my pov is authentic? I've been saying the same fucking thing since TLJ dropped. it's not an act.

I'd like to point out again, that you're in the minority. So how is it so hard for you to wrap your head around the fact that I actually & authentically like it too just like the rest of the majority?

I submit that it's actually YOU who can't admit that it was a piss poor choice by the writer's and directors to steer the ship so completely off course from everything it was while attacking the fan base for not liking this "new direction". So back then and now, it's fairly obvious at this point that I was correct.

accept that the writting was on the wall for this back in the OT the moment Luke grumpily scuffed off because "I'll never get out of here." & when Yoda said he was too old & tainted. This is 100% an exact extension of the same Luke we saw from the beginning. he fucking gave up on saving Leia after one fucking try to get his Xwing out of the swamp! Fuck it, I tried once, I guess they'll just die.

A more ENLIGHTENED response from yourself regarding these films would be to declare that while you enjoyed it for what it was trying to do, it was a piss poor direction to head in and one that likely will need course correction down the road. That's what you should have said instead of suggesting that everyone who couldn't enjoy that movie for what it was simply wasn't as "woke" as you were.

This whole "enlightened & woke thing" is something your dumb ass is making up. (I read your next comment before writing this part & so I may as well not hold back since we're back to that shit.)

So ya. You get the privilege of my coming back here to tell you to fuck off. You were wrong. Just sit on it.

How about you blow me you commie jerk off & get real about your pov not being a direct dissension from god herself. Not everyone thinks like you do. Is that so hard to understand? I've layed out precisely my authentic pov for you as clearly as I can. YOU are in the minority with your pov, so how about you kindly fuck off.

or we can just keep calling each other names & shit.

 

[Myrddin Wild]

trying to kill him (Ben) in his sleep based on a "feeling".

Just chiming in here that it was a series of prophetic "Force Visions" from multiple occasions, not just a single "feeling" he got that one night. Force Visions are not absolute in their content and could be left up to much interpretation, with the emotions of the witness potentially clouding their judgement on the issue or otherwise causing them to misread the vision.

That said, these have been coming in for years and on top of that he had been feeling the dark side growing in Ben for years. To this point also was that Snoke was fucking with him for years with the intent of turning him... so Luke's reaction was not unfounded.

We don't need to hash out between you & I whether or not that was worthy of him freaking out that night for a couple seconds before coming to his senses, but if you're going to talk about that, you should be aware of the difference between what I said here & how you described it in that quote. You make it out like it was just a feeling that night & everything was happy & jolly before that.

 

[Myrddin Wild]

I'm not a hardcore. My wife got 3 years of Disney+ for 36 bucks. I recently watched TLJ.

Horrible. Absolutely horrible.

All your words can't change that. LoL.

What gave you the impression I was trying to change your mind?

I was simply fielding your accusation ABOUT ME... that "I must be trolling" if I liked that movie.

Read my reply just above to that Commie jerk off with the same pov for more on that. I'm not calling you that, but he's really ate up with that shit. I feel like a reasonable person like yourself might relax your pov a bit when I point out not only that there are almost 8 billion other people than yourself on earth & that we don't all think alike, but also that it's a fact that more people like TLJ than dis-like it.

So since the majority like it... then I would think a person of sound mind & judgement wouldn't be completely baffled when they meet one such person in a discussion forum.

Do you still think I'm trolling? or more to the point... with me completely out of the equation... do you feel like there are people who authentically enjoy TLJ, or are we all just trolling?

I'm not even fucking around. I chatted with someone the other day that ranks TLJ as his favorite Star Wars movie, having bumped Empire to 2nd. He's an OG fan who knows a lot & meant it to. I'm incapable of making a heirarchy & have never made a list, but I thought that was interesting.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Just chiming in here that it was a series of prophetic "Force Visions" from multiple occasions, not just a single "feeling" he got that one night. Force Visions are not absolute in their content and could be left up to much interpretation, with the emotions of the witness potentially clouding their judgement on the issue or otherwise causing them to misread the vision.

That said, these have been coming in for years and on top of that he had been feeling the dark side growing in Ben for years. To this point also was that Snoke was fucking with him for years with the intent of turning him... so Luke's reaction was not unfounded.

We don't need to hash out between you & I whether or not that was worthy of him freaking out that night for a couple seconds before coming to his senses, but if you're going to talk about that, you should be aware of the difference between what I said here & how you described it in that quote. You make it out like it was just a feeling that night & everything was happy & jolly before that.

We don't see any of that actually shown on screen do we though? to show a character who is previously shown as being able to forgive Vader being willing to kill someone in their sleep I think needs alot more than what we got.

 

[Myrddin Wild]

We don't see any of that actually shown on screen do we though? to show a character who is previously shown as being able to forgive Vader being willing to kill someone in their sleep I think needs alot more than what we got.

Oh, you're one of them "it only counts if it's in the movie" folks. That's fine. Hold on, let me take a look.

Either way, that's how it went down is that it was a series of visions & he had been feeling the darkside building in him for years. Hold on though... I'm thinking that was in the movie... let me check it out & get back to you.

 

[Myrddin Wild]

We don't see any of that actually shown on screen do we though? to show a character who is previously shown as being able to forgive Vader being willing to kill someone in their sleep I think needs alot more than what we got.

I typed out this dialog straight from the movie, from when Luke gave Rey the short version about what happened between him & Kylo. (about an hour into the movie)

"by the time I realized I was no match for the darkness rising in him... it was too late. I went to confront him & he turned on me."

This alone tells us that Luke had been sensing the darkness in Kylo rising before that night & had realized that he might be too far gone to save. After that... Luke went to confront him.

That rainy scene when Luke tells Rey the whole story.

"I saw darkness. I'd sensed it building in him. I'd seen it in moments during his training."

Right here once again, he verifies that he had sensed the darkness prior to this night, & then goes further to say that he saw it playing out physically in his training.

That scene cont:

"When I looked inside it was beyond what I could ever imagine. Snoke had already turned his heart. He who would bring destruction & pain & death and an end to everything that I loved because of what he will become, and for the briefest moment of pure instinct, I thought I could stop it. (light saber drawn) It passed like a fleeting shadow." Kylo wakes up.

Aside from these verifications that Luke recognized the darkness building prior to this night.... we also see that he actually went inside Kylo's mind & not only saw more darkness than he could ever imagine, but saw that Snoke had already successfully turned his heart. This was mind reading... not a "feeling." He got Force Visions of everything he loved being destroyed & you can hear the people he loves in the back ground howling in pain. (or however you want to describe the noises they were making... that's the jist of it.)

This is what you said to describe all that:

trying to kill him in his sleep based on a "feeling"

I hope you can see how massively under-simplified that statement is. Pretty much to the point of inaccuracy since there was so much more to it.

1. There was Luke's obvious feeling prior to this night of the dark side rising,
   
2. there was the physical things he saw in his training.
   
3. There was his mind meld/reading where he was shocked by the darkness inside him.
   
4. There was the force vision of his loved ones screeming in pain.

Your statement makes it seem like everything was happy & jolly & then one night luke just got a feeling & pulled his saber on Kylo.

You must understand at least my point that if you're going to describe that moment accurately that saying he did it simply "based on a feeling" doesn't come close to describing all that stuff.

Full canon goes further, but if we're doing "Just Movie" then that's where we're at.