So much for the " A-Level " athlete...

Miiiiiiighty said:
You are actually the one not grasping it , as what is commonly referred to here on Sherdog as being " A Level " is having good " League sports stats " ( NFL combine to name it, or the BBall equivalent ).
Many people here have been trying to explain the fact that there is no universal " A Level " athlete package that translate to any sport, especially MMA, that requires such a versatile package.
Even if having added speed, power etc can't hurt of course, provided you have all the rest.

What I'm pointing at here is this endless flow of " Said A Level athlete would be UFC champ in two years " threads we have been facing for ages now.
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Sorry man, I think we agree then. I assumed your usage of a level in your post meant that you believed in the bullshit.
 
The more complicated a sport and the more facets it has, the harder it becomes to be dominant purely on athleticism. Same with soccer, there are so many factors there that just being big or athletic doesnt really mean shit.

Athleticism also doesnt equal skill. Uriah Hall is maybe one of the most athletic MW’s ever, but the dude just doesnt have the natural skill to be a champ level fighter.
 
Miiiiiiighty said:
Exactly.
And NFL like athlecism doesn't transfer well.
What is the average NFL play ? Less than 10 seconds or in that range...? With massive breaks ratio wise...
How can this transfer to a sport with 5 minutes rounds...???
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I've always thought this too. While it's not impossible (Schuab, Lesnar, Mitrione, etc) It really is a completely different set of skills, training style, and genetic gifts that would make someone successful in MMA vs the NFL. There's actually very few athletes that have been truly elite in multiple sports.

Another example is Mariusz Pudzianowski, strong, fast, powerful for short bursts being a professional strong man, but despite going into mma full time he still struggles with endurance, durability, punching power, etc.
 
DrunkMonkMeth said:
Let me rephrase... 98% of nfl players are not a level.. and hardy wasnt one of them.
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no, youre still wrong buddy. that level of speed strength and hand eye coordination while being 2 to 3 hundred pounds isnt a-level?. you dont know what you're talking about. have a seat bud.
 
jjresq said:
Both Gane and Francis are "A-level" athletes and they both dominate the Hw division. If you're skilled and athletic you're going to be better than fighters that are just as skilled but not as athletic. Also being athletic gives you a steeper learning curve than someone who's not. Greg Hardy has actually done pretty well for someone who is older and has only been training MMA for 5 years with no previous experience in any other martial art. But if we are being honest what triggers people is that Rogan said it's only a matter of time before blacks dominate MMA and we know that doesn't sit well with racist MMA fans.
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I didn't even know he said that.
And what does racism have to do with it ? This is ridiculous, people are actually pretending " A Level " athletes, which are mostly black by league sports standards would dominate in 6 monthes to 2 years.

Truth is they wouldn't, as you said Hardy has been training for 6 years and is barely a journeyman.
There is way more to fighting than raw " athlecism " and this is the exact point of this thread.
As far as Hardy doing well, not so much.
Francis who started from 0 and wasn't much younger ( 27 when he started vs 29 for Hardy ) already had made his way to a TS by 5 years...
 
Lol Shertards still comparing fighters to NFL athletes to legitimize their interest and $75. The pseudo-racial angle to the whole thing and constant anger/emotion is very telling.
Enjoy your BMF toy belt sport. Two MMA champs got KOd by a YouTuber in a year lol
 
NationWideNinja said:
The more complicated a sport and the more facets it has, the harder it becomes to be dominant purely on athleticism. Same with soccer, there are so many factors there that just being big or athletic doesnt really mean shit.

Athleticism also doesnt equal skill. Uriah Hall is maybe one of the most athletic MW’s ever, but the dude just doesnt have the natural skill to be a champ level fighter.
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Yep, that's why being " A Level " when it comes to strength and power will not help you much in tennis or golf unless your technique is on par.
On the other hand in all forms of sprinting, less technical lifting like powerlifting, you could be world class in a few years because it is in great part genetics that define your potential.
 
Miiiiiiighty said:
Where are the cohorts that were explaining to us " A Level " athletes from NFL or NBA would be UFC HW champ in 6 monthes to two years of training ???

Is Greg Hardy not big enough at 6'5" 265+ ??? Not A-Level enough maybe ???
And this is happening why the HW talent pool is at an all time low too... with Bam Bam being ranked #3...

I hope, at least, we don't have to hear this bullcrap now that several..

Seems like becoming a UFC champ requires more than just being a gifted athlete, like tons of technique work, decent fight IQ, good cardio, and many intagibles like chin, grittiness, courage...
Things anyone who actually ever trained knew from the start.

Being "explosive" seems to not be enough when you are trying to land on trained worldclass fighters, not your wife.
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This is really stupid.

Will the comparisons ever stop? No! Of course not! Why would they? It's sports. Lebron still gets talked about as a wide receiver.

But you're out of your damn mind if you don't think some of the greatest athletes in the world couldn't compete in MMA.

Quit getting your feelings hurt when people talk about great athletes competing in other sports.

There are so many wrestlers and football players who TODAY could win fights in the UFC. They're not doing it because of pay and/future circumstances.
 
Mattola said:
I always found the A level athlete narrative a bit weird. Rogan used to push it all the time, talking about how a guy like Michael Jordan could easily be champion with some training. Like all it takes to be a world-class fighter is athleticism, and averything else comes naturally.
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the thing that Rogan and the rest of the A level athlete group fail to realize is, at the very top levels of every single sport the athleticism that those athletes have are extremely specific. they're essentially specialists. it's like saying Shaq could've been the best gymnast in the world with 6 months training or had he done it since he was a kid. but it's not true he's just not built to ever be the best gymnast no matter how much time you give him.

every sport requires specific physical attributes. that's why no matter how athletic you are, if you're 4'11 and 85lbs you'll never be a world class NFL player, ever. Rogan doesn't understand this because in his manlet brain he thinks being fast, strong, and big is the pinnacle of athleticism and it's not.
 
welldone said:
no, youre still wrong buddy. that level of speed strength and hand eye coordination while being 2 to 3 hundred pounds isnt a-level?. you dont know what you're talking about. have a seat bud.
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I agree with you on that, most of them are definitely are " A Level " in the strength/speed/power divisions.
IBeLurkin said:
This is really stupid.

Will the comparisons ever stop? No! Of course not! Why would they? It's sports. Lebron still gets talked about as a wide receiver.

But you're out of your damn mind if you don't think some of the greatest athletes in the world couldn't compete in MMA.

Quit getting your feelings hurt when people talk about great athletes competing in other sports.

There are so many wrestlers and football players who TODAY could win fights in the UFC. They're not doing it because of pay and/future circumstances.
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WTF are you on ? Lay off drugs buddy .
I never said some of them couldn't be good, the whole point is that their NFL raw athlecism doesn't instantly trasfer to UFC Gold as we have read here for years.
Btw this is a typical american thing to think the parangon of athlecism is NFL.
Ever heard of track and fields ( especially the throws ) or oly weightlifting ?

Like someone mentionned we saw the limits of athlecism when Wilder got starched by a way less athletic Fury, or Joshua got stopped by a short fat mexican.
Of course having athlecism on top of the rest will make yourself better, but the rest > athlecism in all the sport that require a vast spectrum of technique work + physical qualities
 
Pancake Sprawl said:
the thing that Rogan and the rest of the A level athlete group fail to realize is, at the very top levels of every single sport the athleticism that those athletes have are extremely specific. they're essentially specialists. it's like saying Shaq could've been the best gymnast in the world with 6 months training or had he done it since he was a kid. but it's not true he's just not built to ever be the best gymnast no matter how much time you give him.

every sport requires specific physical attributes. that's why no matter how athletic you are, if you're 4'11 and 85lbs you'll never be a world class NFL player, ever. Rogan doesn't understand this because in his manlet brain he thinks being fast, strong, and big is the pinnacle of athleticism and it's not.
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Exactly, what defines as " A Level " is completely specific to the sport.
I already mentionned it earlier but you can have A Level genetics for marathon and it will be completely different athletics qualities than to throw the hammer or do the long jump...
 
Miiiiiiighty said:
Exactly, what defines as " A Level " is completely specific to the sport.
I already mentionned it earlier but you can have A Level genetics for marathon and it will be completely different athletics qualities than to throw the hammer or do the long jump...
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yes, Rogan doesn't understand that. he believes in the "ubermensch" type shit and it doesn't exist. you can't be the biggest and the fastest, you have to choose. you can't be the strongest and have the best cardio, you have to choose.
 
Pancake Sprawl said:
yes, Rogan doesn't understand that. he believes in the "ubermensch" type shit and it doesn't exist. you can't be the biggest and the fastest, you have to choose. you can't be the strongest and have the best cardio, you have to choose.
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Yes, I've heard Rogan talk a lot of nonsense about NFL athletes supposedly being the world's best athletes, but he's using a lot of tunnel vision to reach this conclusion. He draws parallels with apex predators (tigers, lions, crocodiles, etc) excelling at short, explosive and powerful bursts of energy and people that can emulate this are "top of the food chain human beings".
 
Daniel_LaRusso said:
Yes, I've heard Rogan talk a lot of nonsense about NFL athletes supposedly being the world's best athletes, but he's using a lot of tunnel vision to reach this conclusion. He draws parallels with apex predators (tigers, lions, crocodiles, etc) excelling at short, explosive and powerful bursts of energy and people that can emulate this are "top of the food chain human beings".
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the problem is if he even paid attention for more than 5 secs he'd realize lions and tigers are some of the most unsuccessful hunters in all of the world. and it's largely due to their enormous size. sure they're fast, but they're only fast compared to humans. it's not like they're fast for even other cats. they're fuckin slow. being in excess of 400-500lbs they don't have the cardio to run animals down for miles the way wolves do.

the most successful hunters in the world are wild dogs, African black footed cats, house cats. all very small animals.

being big is a detriment to predators. you're strong sure, but that doesn't mean shit if you can't inflict your strength upon the prey. you're slower, need more calories, and have less cardio. being big is way more of a benefit to prey animals than it is predators.
 
welldone said:
no, youre still wrong buddy. that level of speed strength and hand eye coordination while being 2 to 3 hundred pounds isnt a-level?. you dont know what you're talking about. have a seat bud.
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Football isnt A level sport. American love it So they think it is. Some positions and some players are A level athletes.. most positions and players arent.
 
This was always a stupid argument that usually falls apart when we look at our own experience. Just looking back at high school or college most of us knew it who the best athlete was in football basketball etc and we also knew plenty of others who could give them a good ass kicking. Gameness and savagery aren't revealed by having 6 pack abs or a good 40 time
 
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