Should the steel industry be subsidized?

Rod1

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Basically US steel got their tariffs slapped on, as a result steel price has increased dramatically among the US and all its trading partners. Making everyone poorer.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/timwors...oorer-with-anti-dumping-tariffs/#108c2aceba03

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36319141

I understand that steel is an strategic industry that a country may not want to lose, but still, hurting the little people like that, specially the poor trading partners of the US like Mexico is insane.

Agricultural industries are subsidized through the roof because of their strategic importance, steel could be done the same and allow this key industrial metal to remain on rational prices.
 
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Why can't mexico get it's steel directly from China or Germany?

And what does that article have to do with anything steel related?
 
Why can't mexico get it's steel directly from China or Germany?

And what does that article have to do with anything steel related?

Because Mexico at this point is basically an US territory, and since we have NAFTA every steel company is sending their productiong abroad.

Mexico just mirrored the US decision to slap tariffs on Chinese steel.

Why should be pay extra money for a commodity just to please one industry? if steel is an strategic industry, then dont let it go under, but dont twist the market just to please them.

Something similar is happening to meat, prices went through the roof thanks to American imports.
 
mind linking the relevant article, the one you linked is an opinion piece that talks about the fight between gmo's and organic agri companies

Done
 
Because Mexico at this point is basically an US territory, and since we have NAFTA every steel company is sending their productiong abroad.

Mexico just mirrored the US decision to slap tariffs on Chinese steel.

Why should be pay extra money for a commodity just to please one industry? if steel is an strategic industry, then dont let it go under, but dont twist the market just to please them.

Something similar is happening to meat, prices went through the roof thanks to American imports.


US Steel cant compete with foreign markets - US produces 1/4 of the tonnage and its overhead cost is way higher to do so. I agree they shouldn't put tariffs on it and let companies go after whichever market allows them to purchase it the cheapest while still maintaining the proper grade.

Right now, even with transport cost - American made carbon steel - whether it be bar, plate, coil or rod can't compete with the nordic, asian, indian or european markets

Did Mexico put tariffs just chinese steal or all oversea production?
 
US Steel cant compete with foreign markets - US produces 1/4 of the tonnage and its overhead cost is way higher to do so. I agree they shouldn't put tariffs on it and let companies go after whichever market allows them to purchase it the cheapest while still maintaining the proper grade.

Right now, even with transport cost - American made carbon steel - whether it be bar, plate, coil or rod can't compete with the nordic, asian, indian or european markets

Did Mexico put tariffs just chinese steal or all oversea production?

At this point i have no idea, considering the corruption in Mexico and how the steel cartel tends to play, they may as well enter into price collusion on consumer level steel.
 
It looks like they only placed a tariff on one form of rolled steel from china and that was because china was selling well under market value.

The 522% tariff is needed. China was dumping all their surplus rolled steel because world wide demand has been slowing. Once that surplus is gone it shouldn't be an issue but I think steel, like auto factories and agriculture should have some form of subsidy, especially if other countries are subsidizing it.
 
At this point i have no idea, considering the corruption in Mexico and how the steel cartel tends to play, they may as well enter into price collusion on consumer level steel.

Well i wouldnt be surprised if China undercuts market prices because: A, Its China. B, The make sooo much steel and C, they can make it for much, much cheaper (raw material acquisition and manufacturing) but just goig by the average markets (the numbers we get to see) nordic steel prices are comparable to Asian - while the US has a 25% mark up on all different categories.

So the question i would ask is: which sectors of the steel business deserve their needs met more - I think Americans companies dealing in automotive, structural designs (buildings, bridges, ect) and other miscellaneous products need cheap steel more than the US Steel market needs to sell.

Like that article says - tariffs just makes everyone poorer
 
Well i wouldnt be surprised if China undercuts market prices because: A, Its China. B, The make sooo much steel and C, they can make it for much, much cheaper (raw material acquisition and manufacturing) but just goig by the average markets (the numbers we get to see) nordic steel prices are comparable to Asian - while the US has a 25% market up on all different categories.

So the question i would ask is: which sectors of the steel business deserve their needs met more - I think Americans companies dealing in automotive, structural designs (buildings, bridges, ect) and other miscellaneous products need cheap steel more than the US Steel market needs to sell.

Like that article says - tariffs just makes everyone poorer

I agree, if the Chinese want to give us cheap steel on their dime let them.

But i also believe some capacity of steel production should be kept in order to avoid the chinese suddenly becoming the OPEC of steel.

I think steel industry deserves some sort of tax breaks.
 
I agree, if the Chinese want to give us cheap steel on their dime let them.

But i also believe some capacity of steel production should be kept in order to avoid the chinese suddenly becoming the OPEC of steel.

I think steel industry deserves some sort of tax breaks.

I agree you should look into initiatives that keep US steel in business - but at the same time, have to favor the myriad of other sectors that benefit from cheap steel cost.

I dont like subsidies because then that product because politicised and then decisions on it are made based on votes rather than whats best

Tax breaks could be a good tool - i also have no idea if US government building / construction projects are forced to use Domestic Steel? Im not in structural engineering - so i have no idea if firms have to include US steel in their RFP/bid/ quote.
 
Isnt this good for US Steel Makers?

It is hurting Mexico, but is about time we getting some of our own business back. I guess this is one avenue for Trump to get Mexico to pay for a wall.
 
Because Mexico at this point is basically an US territory, and since we have NAFTA every steel company is sending their productiong abroad.

Mexico just mirrored the US decision to slap tariffs on Chinese steel.

Why should be pay extra money for a commodity just to please one industry? if steel is an strategic industry, then dont let it go under, but dont twist the market just to please them.

Something similar is happening to meat, prices went through the roof thanks to American imports.

Does Mexico not have its own steel production?
 
I'll just leave this here...............


China has created a steel monster and now must tame it: Andy Home

PRICES DOWN, PROFITS DOWN, DEBTS UP

Not only is China producing far too much of the stuff relative to what it needs, but all those years of rapid expansion have left a legacy of huge excess capacity.

National steel-making capacity is thought to be around 1.25 billion tonnes, of which at least 300 million tonnes or so are surplus to requirements, even allowing for that export stream.

Steel prices in China have been heading south for a long, long time under the weight of all that surplus, both active and inactive.

In 2009, when the Shanghai Futures Exchange first launched its steel rebar contract <0#SRB:>, the price recorded a high of 6,903 yuan per tonne. Today the construction-grade steel is trading under 1,800 yuan, having fallen in almost a straight line over the last couple of years.

Hardly anyone is making money. The country's own steel body, the China Iron and Steel Association, said the largest producers had combined losses of 28.12 billion yuan ($4.43 billion) in the first nine months of 2015.

And evidence of that financial strain is accumulating: witness the scare about state-owned Sinosteel extending the redemption date for its bonds.

What is happening in the smaller-capacity part of the sector is anyone's guess, including CISA, but it is probably uglier still.

CISA has been vociferous in calling for production cuts and capacity closures.

The government itself, as Xi told UK reporters, has been trimming what it calls outdated capacity but up to now it has been using a scalpel when it should have been wielding an ax.

But then again, no one wants to see their local steel mill close with all the resulting collateral damage in terms of jobs, taxation revenues and associated industries.

Chinese local authorities are no different from those in Britain in this respect.

But the added complication is the opaque debt structure underpinning the Chinese steel industry. Closing a loss-making mill means someone has to take the debt write-off, whether it be the local bank, the local government or a combination of the two in the form of an off-balance-sheet financing vehicle.

And that's China's Catch 22.

The longer it defers closing steel capacity, the weaker the market, both in China and everywhere else, and the bigger the debt mountain.

But forcing closures, particularly among state-owned producers, comes with the risk of unpredictable debt events and social backlash.

China has created a steel monster, which is now devouring the rest of the world. But the real worry is what it might do to China itself.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-steel-ahome-idUSKCN0SN2H420151029
 
I really don't know much about the steel industry, is China's level of production sustainable? If it is then I am having trouble understanding the issue? Is China subsidizing it? Is China dumping or just overproducing and pushing volume?

I don't see answers to any of the important questions.
 
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I really don't know much about the steel industry, is China's level of production sustainable? If it is then I am having trouble understanding the issue? Is China subsidizing it? Is China dumping or just overproducing and pushing volume?

I don't see answers to any of the important questions.
China is winning in the global capitalistic free market. That's why some countries are imposing ridiculous tariffs to protect their lazy, inefficient, non-competitive steel industry.
 
China is winning in the global capitalistic free market. That's why some countries are imposing ridiculous tariffs to protect their lazy, inefficient, non-competitive steel industry.

I dont see how the chinese subsidizing stuff we buy is "winning" unless the chinese are trying to destroy foreign steel industry.

I deal construction materials here in Mexico mainly portland cement and reinforcing steel, this shit is killing me, although it may reactivate the Arcerlormittal mine we have so it may lead to more jobs.
 
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