Rewatch Shogun v Forrest

[TheBulge]

It's a real damn shame we never saw prime Shogun in the UFC. Those dam CL injuries robbed us of watching his ballet of violence in the cage and the rematch vs the best/uninjured version of Rampage.

Pride haters like to say he wasn't that good cuz he lost to Forrest in the debut while ignoring the injury which prevented him from training any cardio.

He made a career of fighting 10 min rounds but here you can see he got tired and was flat footed after being on top for a few minutes. He also threw naked strikes and barged in thinking he'd blast thru B league UFC comp



In the rematch while not in his peak but at least without an active acl injury we saw what shogun could do to Forrest. Too bad this wasn't the first fight

You did see prime Shogun in the UFC, in fact the Rua who had his comeback and won the title is the best version of this fighter you'll ever see.

 

[Mike]

Forrest has a great resume and many really good wins over big names. Most his loses were against legends. Never understood the Shit Forest gets. He beat many great fighters.

I think it's just because LHW had so many flashy and exciting fighters, especially back then. Forrest gets lost in the shuffle and people forget he actually accomplished a lot in a short timeframe.

He's just one of those guys that lost a couple notches once he lost the belt. Never looked the same or seemed to have the same level on confi in his abilities again.

 

[FreddieRoachsVoice]

Ur factoid about khabib is false. Objectively

 

[Streeter]

To be absolutely clear, there is no version of reality where Chael Sonnen is a "big win" in the light heavyweight division.

Keith Jardine knocked Forrest out in the first round. Thats how bad Forrest was. I can't seem to figure out how you have it the other way around?

Bonnar was a .500 UFC fighter and its not like he was fighting the best. This is not a meaningful win for quality of opponent.

He went 1-1 with Shogun and most sane fans will say Rua looked like cooked cat shit in that debut. Not a lot to unpack here, he casually murdered Griffin when they rematched.

I like Forrest. He seems like a good dude and he's certainly a hard worker. He did not have the athleticism, speed or skill to be an elite fighter.

I meant Franklin not Jardine . Was thinking of Jardine for some reason my fault there.

When he fought Sho Sho was still in 20s I realize he was hurt but so was Griffith.

His fight with Bonnar was one of most important fights in UFC history . Bonnaroo may of been a journeyman but that fight was legend.

Chael might not of been as big a/win as the others but still a good one.

Is he on the mount Rushmore of LHW. No but he did accomplish alot . An should be considered a great.

 

[Streeter]

I think it's just because LHW had so many flashy and exciting fighters, especially back then. Forrest gets lost in the shuffle and people forget he actually accomplished a lot in a short timeframe.

He's just one of those guys that lost a couple notches once he lost the belt. Never looked the same or seemed to have the same level on confi in his abilities again.

In Forests day the LHW. Was the glamour division of MMA or at least UFC. An stayed that till Bones cleaned it out . Was a really fun era

Yeah after Evans he had a few good wins after against Tito n Ace but yeah never the same..

 

[SuperAlly]

News at 10: Local Sherdogger learns time moves linearly

News at 11:00 Local Sherdogger claims time moves exponentially quicker in the US than Japan

 

[SuperAlly]

As a War shogun guy its always bugged me Forrest never gets the credit he deserves. He beat us that night fair and square, it sucked but what ever it happens.

Forrest as a fighter gets downplayed alot iv noticed. He comes up in the "who over achieved" threads and such. Look at forrest wins, then watch him fight. One of the guys whos good every where. Well rounded enough to throw kicks at rampage, out pace and out volume strike tito the wrestler, and his cardio was damn good.

Getting matrixed by Anderson probably sees him unfairly maligned

 

[Mike]

In Forests day the LHW. Was the glamour division of MMA or at least UFC. An stayed that till Bones cleaned it out . Was a really fun era

Yeah after Evans he had a few good wins after against Tito n Ace but yeah never the same..

Lot of larger than life type of fighters with very distinct styles. And a LOT of dream matchups were finally coming to fruition. I remember the general feeling of excitement for years on here regarding the matchmaking. Seemed like there was always a highly anticipated fight about to happen. Really was a golden age for the ufc. Every time it looked like they might lose momentum they'd just absorb another org too lmao. Really worked out for them and us as fans at the time.

 

[BowserJr]

You did see prime Shogun in the UFC, in fact the Rua who had his comeback and won the title is the best version of this fighter you'll ever see.

Gimme what your smoking bro! No one with multiple CL treats and surgeries is in their prime lol

 

[BowserJr]

I'm a huge Shogun fan as well, but let's not pretend that Shogun was washed up or complete trash during the time of the Forest fight. I mean he did go on afterwards to become UFC champion while beating Machida when no one had Machida figured out.

He literally had a torn acl during the fight and weeks prior so he didn't train cardio. Your gonna pretend that makes no difference a d there is no difference between fighting 10 min rounds without gassing and fighting for 3 min and being gassed?

 

[BowserJr]

I love how coincidentally all the pride guys were "out of their primes" when they got to the UFC lol.

I love how coincidentally all the UFC stars from the same era declined at the same time

 

[volcom5]

Again with this prime Shogun shit. The best Shogun has ever looked in his entire career were the Machida bouts. It isn’t hard to just admit Forrest was the better that night. Shogun & Forrest are from the same generation and both started fighting at the same time. Jesus you fucks on here are irritating, every fighter who losses is out of their prime because you clowns can’t cope that maybe just maybe the other fighter is just better.

 

[SuperAlly]

Again with this prime Shogun shit. The best Shogun has ever looked in his entire career were the Machida bouts. It isn’t hard to just admit Forrest was the better that night. Shogun & Forrest are from the same generation and both started fighting at the same time. Jesus you fucks on here are irritating, every fighter who losses is out of their prime because you clowns can’t cope that maybe just maybe the other fighter is just better.

When is a fighters prime = when he's winning
When is he out of his prime = when he loses

If only it were that simple

 

[TheBulge]

Gimme what your smoking bro! No one with multiple CL treats and surgeries is in their prime lol

It's not a math equation bro. "This dude got dis and dat surgery so it must mean he is finished". Doesn't work like that. What exactly do you think surgery is, is the intent to actually ruin the athlete or can it actually fix everything like intended?

Shogun in the Chuck and Machida fights looked fast, athletic, powerful, both with his footwork and strikes. In fact he kicked the shit out of Machida's legs so Rua's foundation was spot on.

He was much better than he was in Pride because he worked a lot on his boxing and the improvements showed in the UFC.

Now obviously he had one too many injuries after the second Machida fight which wrecked his knee again, and then Jon Jones ruined him completely. A beating so vicious it still causes PTSD in all Pride fanboys worldwide.

 

[volcom5]

It's not a math equation bro. "This dude got dis and dat surgery so it must mean he is finished". Doesn't work like that. What exactly do you think surgery is, is the intent to actually ruin the athlete or can it actually fix everything like intended?

Shogun in the Chuck and Machida fights looked fast, athletic, powerful, both with his footwork and strikes. In fact he kicked the shit out of Machida's legs so Rua's foundation was spot on.

He was much better than he was in Pride because he worked a lot on his boxing and the improvements showed in the UFC.

Now obviously he had one too many injuries after the second Machida fight which wrecked his knee again, and then Jon Jones ruined him completely. A beating so vicious it still causes PTSD in all Pride fanboys worldwide.

I’ve been saying that for the longest that Shogun Rua who fought Machida was the best he ever looked in his career, people bring up his 05 run like that’s his best, I don’t agree. He was reckless & fighting on pure talent.

Against Machida, he put everything together. His boxing looked great, his kicks, footwork, defense. What really stood out was his IQ, something I thought he was lacking throughout his career. He knew what strikes to throw, when to blitz and burst and understood control of the octagon. That Shogun I’d pick against anyone of his generation, even the stylistically bad matchups like the Ortiz’s, Coutures & Evans.

PrideFC fanboys on here are becoming more senile with their nostalgia, they set the precedent of why today, anytime a top fighter losses the fans always rush to the excuse of “out of their prime.” Which is just sloppy and just an inability to cope with your favorites losing.

Jose Aldo is a example of why I don’t believe in that shit, he was supposedly out of his prime close to decade now after his loss to Mcgregor, yet still beat and was competitive against ranked fighters, losing to eventual champion in Volkanovski. Moved to a different weight gets thrown against number 1 Moraes & arguably won to the point even though he loss he still got a title shot, losses to another champion in Yan but gave Yan a competitive fight until the later rounds towards a loss, and beat 3 ranked fighters and then losing to another eventual champion in Merab. He did all this 8yrs after people were saying he was done. Just because he never captured gold didn’t mean he wasn’t great anymore, his fight with Munhoz was S Tier striking on Aldo’s end. People and fans were so quick to say he was done as a fighter after Mcgregor that when Aldo beat Moicano, dude burst into tears imo proving the doubt in himself that he wasn’t done.

 

[moreorless87]

I love how coincidentally all the UFC stars from the same era declined at the same time

This tends to be whats often forgotten, MMA in that time especially did tend to have "eras" because you had periods were the sport was much richer drawing in talent.

Around the turn of the millennium especially was probably the biggest era like that, Japan was obviously booming with Pride, Rings, etc but the US scene was also picking up again so you ended up with a lot of fighters getting drawn in during a sport spell and then a lot of them exiting their primes around the same time as well.

 

[volcom5]

I love how coincidentally all the UFC stars from the same era declined at the same time

Yet, you rarely see threads of [insert UFC fighter] prime threads, but you see PrideFC stars “prime” threads 1-3x a week. People have moved on and accepted those UFC stars losing, seems like the PrideFC fans can’t even let go of Shogun losing to Forrest who captured GOLD his very next fight, like Forrest is some bum.

 

[BowserJr]

Yet, you rarely see threads of [insert UFC fighter] prime threads, but you see PrideFC stars “prime” threads 1-3x a week. People have moved on and accepted those UFC stars losing, seems like the PrideFC fans can’t even let go of Shogun losing to Forrest who captured GOLD his very next fight, like Forrest is some bum.

Not that he's a bum. We just know what happened when Shogun was healthy and it's sux cuz we missed out on Rampage vs Shogun 2

Its also just being bummed out that the crossover happens like a year or 2 too late but all the Dana stand act like UFC was always better when though again all the stars from that era declined in sync

 

[KO Shotz]

He literally had a torn acl during the fight and weeks prior so he didn't train cardio. Your gonna pretend that makes no difference a d there is no difference between fighting 10 min rounds without gassing and fighting for 3 min and being gassed?

I'm not disagreeing with any of that. I'm just saying that Shogun losing to Griffin did nothing negative to his career. & how it is straight up amazing & fucking legendary that Shogun was so injury prone, but still held gold, was an elite fighter all the way til the end, & was at the top of the division essentially his ENTIRE career.

 

[dog y]

Griffin was huge and had a huge gas tank. He was also good at everything, just not excelent at anything. Jack of all trades. And his chin was Ok.
Griffin did ok in the UFC.