Serious Movie Discussion XLI

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Mega-Post XII: The Mega Post Strikes Back!


Me and BeardotheWeirdo chit-chat about Spaghetti Westerns made me want to rewatch Duck, You Sucker. I've seen all of Leone's other Westerns a multitude of times but I've never really felt the need to return to Sucker until now. What struck me watching it with a more mature mind was it's ambivalence towards the Zapata Western genre. Zapata westerns where populist, leftist pictures. They usually glorified revolution and propagated the theory of class-conflict, though albeit not denying the violent streak inherent in revolutions or the unlikeable features of violent men. That said, Leone's attitude towards all of this seems a lot more pessimistic than his contemporaries. He puts a lot more focus on the setbacks of a revolution. How its often the poor that bears the burden. How friends name friends under torture. How warfare leaves you alive but others dead. At the end of the movie, Rod Steiger has been galvanized into a revolution he didn't want to be a part of yet has lost all of his family and friends, leaving him a lonely, saddened man. Message-wise its actually quite a contrarian and complex film. Evil, oppersive regimes and systems abound yet fighting them will most likely not make you a happier person, and said struggle isn't excactly going to be "fair" either. It's not exactly a rallying cry for revolution, is all I'm saying.

That said, on a craftsmanship and storytelling level, this is my least favorite Leone film after the Colossus of Rhodes. I think the fundamental problem is that, especially in the second half, Leone jumps to swiftly and jaggedly between time and place. For example, after a wild and cathartic machine-gun battle we jump instantly to Steiger finding his children murdered in a cave. There is no transition shoot between these very contrasting moments -- which makes it's impact feel rather muddled and confused.



Continuing on, I thought pretty much the same of A Touch of Zen as I thought about all King Hu flicks I've seen. It was good but jarringly uneven. As always Hu deserves major props for his artistic eye and cinematic composition. It was interesting to see him work with a darker, more naturalistic style than the bright color-galore parties of his previous work. But at 3-hours the movie has an oddly episodic feel, almost as if you're hiking through genres, and as I insinuate, some half-hours are just better than others. The worst was the whole "ghost ambush" sketch and I think I liked everything with the monks the best. Another downside was that... previously King Hu has always managed to create very engaging and energetic heroes-- especially female ones. But here everyone just seems stoic and formal like chinese porcelain. Hsu Feng stole every scene in "The Fate of Khan Lee" with her wordless, regal performance. But here she just comes of as a very shallow, typical genre character devoid of any vitality or life.


Kurosawa's High and Low, now there's a movie that knows how to transition organically between episodes! I very much liked this film, though I wouldn't consider it one of Akira's best. Akira's hyper-composition almost went a bit overboard in the first half but overall I liked it, especially how it was constrained to virtually a single room. The second half feels very reminiscent of Stray Dog, in that it is a police procedual that very much feels like a time-capsule of Japan at the time. It also reminded me quite a bit of Seven Samurai, in how it's about the relationship between social classes, not just in economical terms, but in how said economical terms translated into socio-psychological impacts on people. That said, Seven Samurai illustrated this much more thoroughly, as that relationship was present in virtually every frame of the picture, and in that movie the observations felt a lot more poignant, striking and heartfelt.


Speaking of more 3 hours+ monstrosities, I also took another gander at 1963's Cleopratra. When I was a kid this was like the most epic film ever made. The productions values and set-designs still inspire an awesome sense of grandure. That said, the rest of the movie fails to do the same. The longer the film goes you the more you get the feeling that they are just moving from one grand vista to another. More problematically, Elizabeth Taylor and Richard Burton doesn't really seem to know what to do with their roles as Antony and Cleopatra. They don't try to make them humane or larger-than-life and just seem to settle on playing them as "seriously stuff" in the manner of which teenagers approach Shakespeare plays - resulting in very bland, uninspired performances (thought this is a normal issue with historical epics of the day, like Helene of Troy or Land of the Pharoes). Rex Harrison as Ceasar has fun with his role though, making his absent in the later half a major blow to the enjoyment-factor.


Moving over to films of a more reasonable running-time, I watched Network as well! Another one of the films that illustrated what a master Sidney Lumet was at giving actors the Lebensraum to shine. I think Faye Dunaway won the acting-war overall, though anyone in that movie could be a reasonable winner. Also, I love how it's basically a sci-fi movie about the news. Network didn't only foresee reality TV, it foresaw that reality TV would be faked.:D


While snooping around High and Low's IMDB page, I read that My Darling Clementine was a film that Akira thought "all other films should aspire to be". So naturally, I had to see it:cool:. This was probably John Ford's most mature Western. And I'm not referring to maturity as in sex and violence but in wholesomeness and emotional sensitivity. There's some real humanity infused in the characterizations of this film, and none of that hokey, family-melodrama balderdash that weight down some of his other westerns like The Searchers or The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance. Still I probably enjoyed those more. Clementine presents an intresting contrast with those particular pictures by the way. Often the taming of the west motif is presented as done by hard, rugged, uncivilized individuals. In both Searchers and Liberty Valance the hero that conquers the western spirit are roughneck that (tragically) has no place in the future, civilized society that they helped to create. In Clemintine though, the passification is done by a sensetive, well-adjusted man with urbane manners and outlook. It's the civilized man, bringing civilization with him to the frontier (and Henry Fonda is really perfect for playing such a character).


French Connection was just awesome. Another testament to how superb William Freidkin can be. Urban grime really was the theme of 1971 -- with this and movies like Get Carter and Shaft being marched into the theaters. The cold, gray, grimey New York that Friedkin crafts his plot around really heightens the tension and identity of the story. You just didn't see movies where policemen where nasty and casually racist like this back then. Gene Hackman's obsessed, mad-dog performance works splendidly in tune with all this. You really believe he's the kind of cop that would go on a mad train chase (which was an amazing action set-piece I must say).


On the martial art front, I saw The One-Armed Boxer. It... was very unlike The One-Armed Swordsman I must say. It had none of the heart that the aftomented film had. Instead it went for a very slapdash, heavily speed-up narrative that almost made it feel like a very straight-faced, trollish parody of Shaw Brother genre pictures. Everything about it is ridiculous but played totally straight. There is literally a Spanish-inquisition moment where someone bad-mouths Tibetan martial arts -- and two Shaolin Monks burst through the roof-top and screams "Nobody bad-mouths Tibetan martial arts!":D That said, the fights are awesomely fun. It has the classic style-vs-style match up that is a classic as old as time but always work. And there's a moment where the wounded, de-armed hero is crawling away while the freaking Shaft theme plays! So yeah, ludacris and fun.


On a short note, Quatermass and the Pit was one of Hammers finest. It's one of those movies that at its climax is intense, weird and psychedelic yet the movie perfectly builds this up by establishing the sense of normalcy that is slowly eroded through the film. Great Hammer-styled horror flick.


Lastly, I never thought I'd see a throwback-film to the Italian cannibal wave of the 70's/80's -- but damit Green Inferno came out, meaning I'm pretty much obliged to see it. It was really funny. Eli Roth's morbid humor really went hand-in-hand with the subject matter (with a few missteps). A bit surprisingly it didn't really try to one-up the levels of gruesomeness, even though its pretty gnarly by modern standards, but nothing really like say Cannibal Holocaust vs Cannibal Ferox. The cinematography I also thought was very well done, capturing the greenness and lushness of the jungle.

And Lorenza Izzo is just insanely gorgeous, which is the sentance that every proper mega-post should end with.
 
Guys, I am really really excited to see Civil War this weekend. Pissed that I missed out on the free early screening in Boston last month because I was in class while they were giving out the passes online, but now the wait is finally coming to an end.
 
Guys, I am really really excited to see Civil War this weekend. Pissed that I missed out on the free early screening in Boston last month because I was in class while they were giving out the passes online, but now the wait is finally coming to an end.
Let me save you the trouble of anticipation and let you know how the film plays out

Some bullshit is brought up
One set of heroes sees one side, other super heroes see it the other way around
they fight
they make up
Avengers 3 teaser

End.
 
Guys, I am really really excited to see Civil War this weekend. Pissed that I missed out on the free early screening in Boston last month because I was in class while they were giving out the passes online, but now the wait is finally coming to an end.

Seeing it this weekend as well. Definitely seems like there is an overall very favorable reaction to it- almost on par with The Winter Soldier.
 
Let me save you the trouble of anticipation and let you know how the film plays out

Some bullshit is brought up
One set of heroes sees one side, other super heroes see it the other way around
they fight
they make up
Avengers 3 teaser

End.

You should watch Batman vs. Superman if you haven't, I think you'd like it. It's very different than the Marvel movies in both good and a few bad ways, but mainly the stylistic difference I think would appeal to you
 
Watched 10 Cloverfield Lane last night and loved it! Just when I thought I had everything figured out they kept hitting me with twists! Best movie I've seen in awhile honestly.
 
Watched 10 Cloverfield Lane last night and loved it! Just when I thought I had everything figured out they kept hitting me with twists! Best movie I've seen in awhile honestly.

I did not like Cloverfield but I've seen so many good recommendations of this I might have to watch it
 
Watch The Invitation if you haven't yet.
One of this years big surprises with a mostly unknown cast.
It has some Elements of Martha,Marcy,May,Marlene in it.
A really tense Thriller.
You guys are probably gonna be hot or cold on the last 15mins.
 
Watch The Invitation if you haven't yet.
One of this years big surprises with a mostly unknown cast.
It has some Elements of Martha,Marcy,May,Marlene in it.
A really tense Thriller.
You guys are probably gonna be hot or cold on the last 15mins.
FINALLY someone else who watched The Invitation. Fucking awesome film.
 
hey, just an fyi as some of you might remember hunsterscreed, who is referenced in every OP. He passed away recently from a motorcycle accident.

condolences for any friends he had in the thread.
 
hey, just an fyi as some of you might remember hunsterscreed, who is referenced in every OP. He passed away recently from a motorcycle accident.

condolences for any friends he had in the thread.


whattttttttt


wow RIP my fellow hunter
 
I watched Mulholland Dr the other day. It was a good movie. IDK, I feel like I need to watch it several times and read a lot about it. It definitely made me feel many different things and I think the fact that I watched it in a couple sittings detracted from the experience (it's hard for me to sit and watch a 2+ hour movie in one sitting anymore).

I liked it. I'm not sure I saw the Black Swan comparisons or what Black Swan got from that movie, and I've seen many people reference it as something that Aronofsky drew from, but still, it was good.
 
R.I.P. HuntersCreed. Really sad to hear about his accident.

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hey, just an fyi as some of you might remember hunsterscreed, who is referenced in every OP. He passed away recently from a motorcycle accident.

condolences for any friends he had in the thread.

Fuck.How old was he?
 
Condolences to you guys. Didn't know him, but that's just sad as hell.....
 
Had a lot more beef with Civil War the second time around. Almost feel like I shouldn't have watched it again. Ruined it a bit for me.
 
Had a lot more beef with Civil War the second time around. Almost feel like I shouldn't have watched it again. Ruined it a bit for me.


Do you feel like when you notice things later in a movie that you should have seen them originally and that your later opinion is more valid than your original one? Like, when I saw the latest Star Wars movie, I was like OK, good popcorn flick, not exactly what I wanted out of a Star Wars movie, it lost some soul, but it was good. I went and watched it again and have tried another time and both of those times I didn't make it through the first 30 minutes and I realized: this movie sucks. And I feel like, THAT is the right opinion and I was just blinded by nostalgia/some nifty editing the first time I saw it. That my real opinion about the movie is that it isn't good at all and I just missed that the first time I saw it.


I don't know how far I take that, though. Like, how many times is a movie supposed to be rewatchable? Is that how I determine how good a movie is? (It's one of the main ways, for sure, but is that right or wrong?) etc.
 
Do you feel like when you notice things later in a movie that you should have seen them originally and that your later opinion is more valid than your original one? Like, when I saw the latest Star Wars movie, I was like OK, good popcorn flick, not exactly what I wanted out of a Star Wars movie, it lost some soul, but it was good. I went and watched it again and have tried another time and both of those times I didn't make it through the first 30 minutes and I realized: this movie sucks. And I feel like, THAT is the right opinion and I was just blinded by nostalgia/some nifty editing the first time I saw it. That my real opinion about the movie is that it isn't good at all and I just missed that the first time I saw it.


I don't know how far I take that, though. Like, how many times is a movie supposed to be rewatchable? Is that how I determine how good a movie is? (It's one of the main ways, for sure, but is that right or wrong?) etc.
I think the first experience is the true test of a film.

If you watch it a second time, knowing exactly what is coming, a lot of the story devices will be ineffectual - tension, suspense, conflict, mystery, etc.
 
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