Ryan Hall - An Open Letter to the Martial Arts Community

Einarr said:
Aren't TLI and fifty/50 each other's main competition in the same area? Hmmm . . .
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Most people from the area would not consider them to be direct competitors. They are about an hour's drive away from each other in DC traffic, and they attract different groups of people.

Switching between those schools is pretty rare.
 
Balto said:
Most people from the area would not consider them to be direct competitors. They are about an hour's drive away from each other in DC traffic, and they attract different groups of people.

Switching between those schools is pretty rare.
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Yeah, guy obviously doesn't know that Ryan trained at TLI, and then for reasons (at that time) unknown, left TLI. Ryan stayed really mum about it til now.
 
I've been thinking a lot about how the jiu jitsu community can respond to this tragedy in a positive way, even more so after reading Hall's letter. After talking with some teammates, I think we came up with a pretty good idea that I would like to run by you guys. If people are interested, I will make a separate thread so as not to take away from this one.

Our idea is to hold coordinated tournaments where all the proceeds from registration fees would go to charities that support rape victims or help educate the public about sexual assault. In the spirit of valuing integrity over "success," these would be more exhibition matches than an actual tournament, and instead of medals, all competitors would get a "Proud to be a part of the 97%" gi patch. I think it would be especially cool if this took place all across the country, preferably on the same day. Press releases could be made to further draw attention to the issue and to present a united front against rape culture, and the win at all costs attitude that Hall, Callos, the Gracie brothers, and others have spoken out against. It would take quite a bit of time and effort, but I think it would send a very strong message. Thoughts?
 
Makhno said:
I've been thinking a lot about how the jiu jitsu community can respond to this tragedy in a positive way, even more so after reading Hall's letter. After talking with some teammates, I think we came up with a pretty good idea that I would like to run by you guys. If people are interested, I will make a separate thread so as not to take away from this one.

Our idea is to hold coordinated tournaments where all the proceeds from registration fees would go to charities that support rape victims or help educate the public about sexual assault. In the spirit of valuing integrity over "success," these would be more exhibition matches than an actual tournament, and instead of medals, all competitors would get a "Proud to be a part of the 97%" gi patch. I think it would be especially cool if this took place all across the country, preferably on the same day. Press releases could be made to further draw attention to the issue and to present a united front against rape culture, and the win at all costs attitude that Hall, Callos, the Gracie brothers, and others have spoken out against. It would take quite a bit of time and effort, but I think it would send a very strong message. Thoughts?
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I dig it.

But then, what if TLI showed up at one and won? That would be morose...
 
Leify said:
I dig it.

But then, what if TLI showed up at one and won? That would be morose...
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Well, with no medals and the 97% gi patch, I doubt any of those guys would be interested. But honestly, if some TLI guy's showed up, I think that would make the message even stronger.
 
100% truth. And I disagree that its just "common sense". His whole point is that its easy to see once you're disconnected from it (ie all of us on teh interwebs), but when you're in it, its hard to see (or admit to yourself) and pull away.

If anything, it was a SCATHING assessment of TLI and that LI is basically pure concentrated evil.
 
Disappointed that someone didn't make a "Proud to be part of 97%" shirt already.
 
While I agreed with everything Ryan hall said, I just want to point out that the timing of the letter is not quite as "courageous" as people are making it seem. I mean, the whole world is basically kicking tli in the balls right now. Not that he doesn't deserve it, but something about kicking a man when he is down doesn't sit with me. Group think itself is the problem, whether its jumping on a bandwagon or jumping in a lynch mob. Still, I think hall made some fabulous points. My favorite thing he wrote was "don't fall into the trap of thinking someone is a great human being just because he took a few seconds to show you a detail on a guard pass." That is something I have done myself, I know. Also, he's completely right that the mentality that glorifies success and puts character in the backseat is a real plague in our culture.
 
luckyshot said:
While I agreed with everything Ryan hall said, I just want to point out that the timing of the letter is not quite as "courageous" as people are making it seem. I mean, the whole world is basically kicking tli in the balls right now. Not that he doesn't deserve it, but something about kicking a man when he is down doesn't sit with me. Group think itself is the problem, whether its jumping on a bandwagon or jumping in a lynch mob. Still, I think hall made some fabulous points. My favorite thing he wrote was "don't fall into the trap of thinking someone is a great human being just because he took a few seconds to show you a detail on a guard pass." That is something I have done myself, I know. Also, he's completely right that the mentality that glorifies success and puts character in the backseat is a real plague in our culture.
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Are you kidding me??

Did you even read what he wrote? That was like a term paper. You don't write that shit overnight. It would've taken me at least a week or more to write what he wrote.
 
Incredible read. I found alot of myself in the way Ryan spoke of himself, and I believe that is a very good thing. Too many people in general sacrifice their integrity for false senses of glory and accomplishment, or riches. I am glad to count myself as one who remains true to himself and stands by my moral code in all walks of life. More people need to speak out against clearly unsavory actions, and further investigate the people they surround themselves with. Great, great read and good job for Ryan to speak his mind so eloquently.
 
People are asking Meerkatsu on his Facebook page to make a patch and shirts already. I would defintely get one of those if made available.

I love the tourney idea BTW.
 
Nomad Nemesis said:
this is why you have to sit at the kid's table during thanksgiving in iceland
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>thanksgiving in Iceland
>thanksgiving
>Iceland

you-went-full-retard-never-go-full-retard.jpg
 
A. Identified a lot with consciously following a moral and selfless path, to be a good guy. But so much better than I could put it.

B. Called it! Called it in the first thread, I knew the old rape case was why he left.

C. Everyone read fucking all of it.

D. Was always going to stop in for a bit at 50/50 as he is my favourite instructor (DVDs based anyway) and has probably helped my game more than anyone. Now I will dedicate a trip to it.

D. I downloaded his DVDs because I'm poor. For that I am sorry, and although I doubt he will ever read this, I promise I will hand him the $625 I owe him when I first book in, hopefully in October this year.

Thanks for everything ryan
 
luckyshot said:
While I agreed with everything Ryan hall said, I just want to point out that the timing of the letter is not quite as "courageous" as people are making it seem. I mean, the whole world is basically kicking tli in the balls right now. Not that he doesn't deserve it, but something about kicking a man when he is down doesn't sit with me. Group think itself is the problem, whether its jumping on a bandwagon or jumping in a lynch mob. Still, I think hall made some fabulous points. My favorite thing he wrote was "don't fall into the trap of thinking someone is a great human being just because he took a few seconds to show you a detail on a guard pass." That is something I have done myself, I know. Also, he's completely right that the mentality that glorifies success and puts character in the backseat is a real plague in our culture.
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Kicking a man when he's down? Dafuq? Nobody is bashing TLI because its popular. They're bashing him because he's fucking evil. This isn't a case of people overreacting or going overboard and dishing out unjustified level of punishment. Nobody is calling him with death threats. Nobody is throwing bricks through his window or crank calling his house or his business.

What they ARE saying is that they won't do business with Lloyd Irvin, or anyone else who is a douche. That's not kicking anyone. Its choosing how you spend your money. I do this shit every day - I don't go to restaurants that suck, repeat business with plumbers that rip me off. And I'll never give a penny to Lloyd Irvin or any asshole that defends him.
 
Einarr said:
>thanksgiving in Iceland
>thanksgiving
>Iceland
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um...this was exactly my point and why I included "in iceland" as that part was the joke. i am going to pretend that you were just being sarcastic and i missed it.
 
Meerkatsu said:
As powerful a statement from Ryan as one could possible imagine.
I read the whole document - it's not THAT long. One person commented to me that what he wrote is the kind of common sense that every adult should already know. True. But a lot do not know, or are not aware of cultish behaviours. Ryan just blew the lid open.
Lots of respect to him and I was profoundly moved by his essay.
I hope one day he'll write the true story in graphic detail of his experiences under the cult.
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That comment reminds of one of the concepts discussed in The Power of Persuasion: How We're Bought and Sold by Robert V. Levine. An entire chapter was dedicated to the discussion of people who believe they are impervious to manipulation and persuasion. The irony is that these people are actually more susceptible to it because the feeling of invulnerability can cause them to be less guarded. It is easy to spot manipulation when you are looking at it from the outside but the most skillful manipulators are people who have already somehow garnered your trust and respect or perhaps your fear. Ryan's letter isn't just applicable to full blown cults. A lot of people allow their integrity to be jeopardized by their boss, a friend, a business associate or even a family member.
 
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