Russia/Ukraine Megathread V6

[7even]

04/27/2022
Russian equipment losses in Ukraine so great it will be unable to fight again for 'years': analysts | Daily Mail Online
Russia’s military has lost so much equipment in Ukraine it will be incapable of fighting another war for ‘years’, analysts claim:

• Putin's failing war in Ukraine has seen Russia lose years' worth of kit, experts say
• That includes 939 tanks, 185 planes, 155 helicopters and 421 artillery: Kyiv army
• 'Supplies are getting low' and 'it will take years for Russia to rebuild': US analyst
• Soviet-era reserves including tanks remain - but it's unclear if they still work
• Embarrassing sinking of Black Sea flagship the Moskva prompted fury in Russia

This is unreal.

 

[SandisLL]

Assumung that western weapons stocks are depleting too much I think is just cos every media wants to get klicbait articles...

Usually in such situations are given out not fresh weapons...
Okey, with exception:: these switchblades....

Other stuff looks that is in production during long years.
All this does have expire date...
For example if missile manufactured 2012 does have storage exp date 2022, then such missile most likely is given ..
Not missile manufactured in 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021..th.

Looks that for a reason this ukraine is getting just a bit from all these available weapons types and models too....
Russia anyway is suffering and ukraine is amortisator....

While west is manufacturing new stuff, intensively preparing and ....orders to produce more and more weapons are coming in each day.....
Western countries are arming up intensively....


Russia doesn't have their own NÀTO version.
Unless these separatists in Moldova and Ukraine plus Lukashenko....

Kazahstan and Uzbekistsan ofc wants good trade with Russia but also the same with China, U.S and also with EU and U.K.
They are not dumb: even to do business with China is easier if your country is peaceful and looks that have stability.
They don't want to be Russia's lapdogs.
More might be earned if good trade and business with all countries.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

because sending those forces of troopers by armor would take longer and the basis of russian paratroopers is to go behind enemy lines and even blend in the population. Did you not know this? A drone offensive would not have looked credible you need and likely needed to tell some of the lower level guys that this was a legit offensive and to take up position. The opinion of neutral sources and former colonel macgregor and intellignce and former felon (yeah he a felon but has good analaysis and was a nuke expert) ritter is that with a force of 40k you would have to be insane to think it could take the capital of 3 million which has been heavily fortified.

Why then did the ukrainians believe this little force was going to do it? idk you ask me maybe they followed bad US intel or maybe the transport planes and movements made it seem that was the case. However, the reality is there was no real offensive on Kiev any real assault. There is a theory they planned to hold an airstrip and then bring in more by planes but were unable to hold the air strip thus gave up. The reason I don´t believe this so fully is because a force of say 100k or 300k is more needed and that force projection with the man power of SAM and equipment would of been able to surely take the air strips and hold on till now at least. The land route is still open the air route above kiev is a threat to russian forces in the immediate but yeah

Wait so the force for good is sending it's troops on suicide missions as a distraction?

 

[SandisLL]

For example Uzbekistan, while Russia is busy with Ukraine...is doing interesting things.
They are attempting to get businesses running from russia, belarus and ukraine to relocate to Tashkent.
Offered large building with offices and named this like high tech park...
Btw looks that they already had get in more than 1500 programmers, some ~30 companies at least opened offices in Tashkent.

& their target looks that is to boost country economy with everything...

 

[San Marino]

Russia's tanks in Ukraine have a 'jack-in-the-box' design flaw. And the West has known about it since the Gulf war. -- Unlike modern Western tanks, Russian ones carry multiple shells within their turrets. This makes them highly vulnerable as even an indirect hit can start a chain reaction that explodes their entire ammunition store of up to 40 shells."

Actually, it is not in the turret, it is below the turret in the form of a carousel in the body of the tank immediately under the turret. That is usually what causes the turret to blow upwards. The explosion from the incoming missile is only a small part of the explosion. There is no chance of the crew surviving. Russian T-72 tank:

We (US) carry our tank ammo in the turret. The M1A1 tank carries 40 rounds of 120mm ammunition. 34 in the turret bustle and 6 in a rear hull box.

 

[Snowblindlove]

What would be the benefit of sending paratroopers to land and blend in the population of a territory you have no intention of capturing? In fact blending in with the population (if successful) would be the complete opposite of creating a distraction, which is what you say was the objective in Kyiv.

A more practical and effective use of paratroopers is for surprise attacks and to seize strategic objectives such as airfields or bridges. Seems pretty obvious that they were trying use them to capture Kyiv's airport to use as an airhead. Would you at least agree getting sending them to get blown out of the sky was a foolish tactical mistake and not part of Russia's supposed "distraction" plan?

Inside troopers like that are agents meant to destabilize and relay information or both. Then extract or remain until an actual offensive. Surprise attack was never going to happen as zelensky was too entrenched. Of course I don´t believe they wanted the losses they got in the North of Kiev nor the downed planes but I don´t believe the 40k force was intended for an actual assault and the airbase theory while plausible I don´t believe was an intention for a full force. In my opinion and that of the strategists I am listing to they would of moved a lot more manpower and armor and SAMs to ensure taking of that base or they would of flown in people at minimum further away from Kiev SAM range. I.e., just south of belarus border or ont he border. Paratroopers after all are to be jumping out of planes

The Russians only have one poorly armed brigade in Moldova.

I also don't know why the Kiev thing is always such a cope. The attack on Kiev and Kharkov almost worked- they were clearly trying for a quick knockout, but got repulsed. At one point Russia was like 15km from the center of the capital. If it wasn't for western intelligence and weapons it probably would have worked, it only appears dumb in hindsight, like all failed plans do.

To me the cope is by the western american bravado. They are so set that ´´muuuh Russia tried to capture kiev with an extremely small force of troops and failed hahah´´´

Any attempt to explain that it is highly unlikely the intension was to capture a city of that size with so few troops is discounted. When I or others mention that the Kiev fake invasion diverted masses of Ukrainian troops in several directions to head back to Kiev and split them up that is also ignored. People are in an echo chamber until this ends and then the dust can settle. Then they pivet to say oh it was the air strip and the airplane blown up. Ignoring all the other stuff missing that would of likely been moved in by armor in addition to the few planes that did get through to set up plus the huge numerical disadvantage. Then we consider how Russia operated in taking the south and far east and north east we consider they followed none of those plans it just makes no sense.

Kharkov is a much more pro russian city and they made no assaults or attempts to capture it as Ukrainain armed forces and Militas made sure to entrench there. The current logical analysis by non sensationalist people is they wont siege Kharkov but keep it surrounded until ideally all other lands east of dniper and south are taken and then try to end the war leaving only Kharkov uncaptured (as Odessa is a priority and zaporzhia, nykolaiv are not expected to be hard to take). Debate on Dniper. Ukraine manned a good offensive on the outskirts of nykolaiv but Russians have full control of kherson and incursion in Nykoaliv but aren´t moving forward at the moment only aerial strikes.

 

[Snowblindlove]

*

read this in full. Use is superior conventionally but the WMD forces are inferior as are strategic arsenal and you have corrupt congress, anti war left movement, Obama era, and then the anti trump mania to thank for a lack of progress but perhaps it is for the best as it likely decreases the desire for the US to ever go nuclear. We know from other leaks and reports the US doesn´t maintain offensive or defensive bio abilities by any real means nor chemical where as Russia and China do surely (treaties and oversight over there? naaah no way).

An interesting read with many sources and I don´t see how it isn´t all true. Let us hope we never find out put to use but given Putin and other Russian voices in the past speak of numerical superiority needed at 5 to 1 odds it makes the below plausible numbers.
https://www.realcleardefense.com/ar...clear_and_military_forces_in_2021_661111.html

 

[Snowblindlove]

Wait so the force for good is sending it's troops on suicide missions as a distraction?

It isn´t a suicide mission. Hence the retreat and the fact most lived from those areas. In war there is always losses and you have to be calculative with it and where vulnerabilities live. Sending in men to extract the downed pilots during the Somalia black hawk down crisis was sending men into a suicide mission you could argue but what is the alternative kill the entire city for a few men?

I am saying it was a distraction not even close to the numbers or logistics needed for an assault on kiev and that it worked as it legitimately sent the ukrainain army in two many directions thereby leaving open the southern and eastern flanks which they have since lost. In the meantime while they were rushing to Kiev it exposed their positions which resulted in subsequent bombing and losses.

 

[SandisLL]

Actually, it is not in the turret, it is below the turret in the form of a carousel in the body of the tank immediately under the turret. That is usually what causes the turret to blow upwards. The explosion from the incoming missile is only a small part of the explosion. There is no chance of the crew surviving. Russian T-72 tank:

We (US) carry our tank ammo in the turret. The M1A1 tank carries 40 rounds of 120mm ammunition. 34 in the turret bustle and 6 in a rear hull box.

Well, looks that USSR tanks had been designed mainly for offense: smaller, lighter and with high rate of fire for cannon...
Will there someone die or no...anyway USSR had a lot of tanks... Some 100 more or lesser....doesn't matters.

Western tanks are large and heavy, looks that mainly intended for defensive operations...
Then ofc heavier tank is better...

Btw T64/T80 autoloader is even more vulnerable than T72 th ....however USSR loved to station these T64/T80 in East Germany cos their cannons does have higher rate of fire ( rpm ).

 

[Yotsuya]

Is there any accurate information about Ukrainian casualties? Everything I'm finding seems to be propaganda. Both the Russian MoD and Ukrainian statements seem risible.

Just using common sense, with the Russians mostly having air superiority and more artillery, we would expect to see very significant Ukrainian casualties, but I understand this is a state secret.

I think it's 5000 dead at maximum. Ukrainians have had time to prepare their positions. Artillery strikes wear troops down because they can't sleep and are under constant stress and light wounds from sharpeners are common, but the actual casualties could be surprisingly low. (In Winter War Finnish casualties were only 16% of Russias.) Russians also use a lot of their artillery and air forces on civilian neighbourhoods.

 

[SandisLL]

One thing is that Russia always will sit in Crimea and it is impossible to kick them out.
Plus politically to allow Crimea not to be in russia will be suicide for any party.

Big stuff is this Sevastopol and these curorts.

Stalin, when get lesson from Hitler, after war ended...
Immediately ordered to expand tunnels and bunkers network, to build even underground warehouses, like 2-3 floors above ground, 2-3 floors below ground and under this...shelters.
Also a lot shelters under buildings...
Underground warehouses, storages.
1945-1980 was 35 years long period with really huge investments to build warehouses, bunkers, shelters and nuclear shelters...
It isn't Azovstal plant, it is....far more difficult target to deal with.
Almost impossible...
USSR turned Sevastopol in gigantic weapons warehouse + with shopisticated shelters and bunkers, tunnels network.

In fear from nuclear war USSR ordered in Crimean curort cities to build shelters and nuclear shelters.

They also does have huge sentiment about Crimea: it was place where Soviet elite had villas...
It was area with hotels and sanatoriums for, let's say priviliged social class in USSR.
Casuals, if they get to spend vacation in Crimea were proud and it was...some special thing.

 

[Yotsuya]

Russian concentration camps in Mariupol: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61208404

 

[SandisLL]

Interestingly that even in USSR era soviets attempted to get curorts in Tuapse, Sochi, Georgia etc more popular and invested a lot.
The mental stuff for russians still was: Crimea:No1 choice.

Maybe because Stalin ordered to build for him large villa in crimea and to build elite level sanatorium and pioneer camp ( very high living standards even by these times western measurement..!) for elite ppl.
Also to rest there were allowed ppl highly valued by Moscow, party, poineer orgs etc.

With this trend: Crimea is elitary place in Russia started...
Some maybe 85 years ago.
Nothing changed...

 

[Yotsuya]

Dolphins have formed an alliance with another well known gang of child murdering rapists, the Russian army. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/apr/27/russia-black-sea-military-dolphins-crimea

 

[Yotsuya]

UN idiot gets played and described his encounter with Putin as “very useful.” https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live...s-04-28-22/h_bdd6df679c5e939798181ecf71567207

 

[idrankyourbeer]

im fucking drunk

 

[12ga.]

This is unreal.

Thats because it's not true. Check out USMC officers armchairwrlords twtter. where he debunks all the ukraine tanks posed as Russian

One thing is that Russia always will sit in Crimea and it is impossible to kick them out.
Plus politically to allow Crimea not to be in russia will be suicide for any party.

Big stuff is this Sevastopol and these curorts.

Stalin, when get lesson from Hitler, after war ended...
Immediately ordered to expand tunnels and bunkers network, to build even underground warehouses, like 2-3 floors above ground, 2-3 floors below ground and under this...shelters.
Also a lot shelters under buildings...
Underground warehouses, storages.
1945-1980 was 35 years long period with really huge investments to build warehouses, bunkers, shelters and nuclear shelters...
It isn't Azovstal plant, it is....far more difficult target to deal with.
Almost impossible...
USSR turned Sevastopol in gigantic weapons warehouse + with shopisticated shelters and bunkers, tunnels network.

In fear from nuclear war USSR ordered in Crimean curort cities to build shelters and nuclear shelters.

They also does have huge sentiment about Crimea: it was place where Soviet elite had villas...
It was area with hotels and sanatoriums for, let's say priviliged social class in USSR.
Casuals, if they get to spend vacation in Crimea were proud and it was...some special thing.

Why is it impossible? Nothing is impossible.

Sorry just triggered..a few words not in my vocabulary. cant, impossible, or wish.

 

[DespicablePeep]

It isn´t a suicide mission. Hence the retreat and the fact most lived from those areas. In war there is always losses and you have to be calculative with it and where vulnerabilities live. Sending in men to extract the downed pilots during the Somalia black hawk down crisis was sending men into a suicide mission you could argue but what is the alternative kill the entire city for a few men?

I am saying it was a distraction not even close to the numbers or logistics needed for an assault on kiev and that it worked as it legitimately sent the ukrainain army in two many directions thereby leaving open the southern and eastern flanks which they have since lost. In the meantime while they were rushing to Kiev it exposed their positions which resulted in subsequent bombing and losses.

Why the armored column stuck, how do you explain that?

 

[jimbob27]

Actually, it is not in the turret, it is below the turret in the form of a carousel in the body of the tank immediately under the turret. That is usually what causes the turret to blow upwards. The explosion from the incoming missile is only a small part of the explosion. There is no chance of the crew surviving. Russian T-72 tank:

We (US) carry our tank ammo in the turret. The M1A1 tank carries 40 rounds of 120mm ammunition. 34 in the turret bustle and 6 in a rear hull box.

The Abrams has blow out panels which can make ammo detonation survivable if they function correctly. Crew survival rate on US tanks has always been way higher than with Russian Lada tanks.

 

[Limbo Pete]

im fucking drunk

Name checks out