Royce Gracie is underrated by hardcore fans.

This. I came from a boxing background, and traveled 80 miles, 3x week, to take "Gracie Jiu-Jitsu" from Royce, personally, after watching UFC 1, back in the early 90s. Royce had 2 co-instructors at the time, Fabio Santos and Lowel Anderson. Got my blue belt directly from Royce.

That said, MMA took off after that, and left the Gracies behind. While actual MMA athletes continued to be open to learning new techniques, incorporating elements that fit their aptitudes and style, the Gracies just pushed their system and teaching regimen, which may be suitable as a self-defense, but is no longer suitable in elite MMA.

Eerily similar here. Boxed as well, trained with Rorion and Royce in Torrance prior to the first UFC. Got my blue belt from Rorion and followed Fabio Santos over to San Diego, got my purple from him. Neat guys, great instructors.
 
Is he?? Seems pretty overhyped to me. People literally place him in the Mount Rushmore of MMA when he has maybe two significant wins on his resume, competed during by far the most talent devoid time period in MMA, and got absolutely decimated when he faced a next generation MMA fighter.
Founding Father tho. Ain't that what Mt Rushmore is about?
 
Small world brother! haha

Indeed!

At the time, I lived in Lancaster, CA.

My kid brother told me about "Gracie jujitsu" ... and, as a boxer, I didn't believe in "martial arts" as being very effective in a real fight, as I thought MA was basically just "play fighting in a gi."

My brother told me I was wrong, that BJJ was the real deal, and he drove up from San Diego to show me.
Repeatedly and consistently, my kid brother (whose @$$ I had beat-up my whole life, including when we boxed together) would quickly and efficiently take me down and submit me, every GD time <45>

I was instantly "a believer," and as such, I could no longer walk the earth with my kid brother able to beat my ass <Lmaoo> ... so I traveled from Lancaster to Torrance, 3x a week, and trained with the Gracies for about three years.
When I learned about Rickson Gracie, I started to train there in, Santa Monica, but Rickson never personally taught one single class. I forget the name of his instructors, because I didn't stay that long, but they were sloppier in their technique then were Fabio Santos and Lowell Anderson, who were very clean and their techniques

Later, I moved to San Diego, and so had Fabio Santos.
I trained with Fabio for about a year, which was right before Dean Lister turned pro.
Fabio is a great dude and so was Dean, who was a purple belt at the time and really good, but as I said hadn't turned pro.
With more time invested, Dean became a master at leg locks, and ultimately had a pretty decent MMA career

Now I'm an old man who lives in AZ, I no longer train, except for a home weightlifting gym, but still a big-time fan.

Cheers and nice to meet you,

Jack
 
Indeed!

At the time, I lived in Lancaster, CA.

My kid brother told me about "Gracie jujitsu" ... and, as a boxer, I didn't believe in "martial arts" as being very effective in a real fight, as I thought MA was basically just "play fighting in a gi."

My brother told me I was wrong, that BJJ was the real deal, and he drove up from San Diego to show me. Repeatedly and consistently, my kid brother (whose @$$ I had beat-up my whole life, including when we boxed together) would quickly and efficiently take me down and submit me, every GD time <45>

I was instantly "a believer," and as such, I could no longer walk the earth with my kid brother able to beat my ass <Lmaoo> ... so I traveled from Lancaster to Torrance, 3x a week, and trained with them for about three years.
When I learned about Rickson Gracie, I started to train there in, Santa Monica, but Rickson never personally taught one single class. I forget the name of his instructors, because I didn't stay that long, but they were sloppier in their technique then were Fabio Santos and Lowell Anderson, who were very clean and their techniques

Later, I moved to San Diego, and so had Fabio Santos.
I trained with Fabio for about a year, which was right before Dean Lister turned pro.
Fabio is a great dude and so was Dean, who was a purple belt at the time and really good, but as I said hadn't turned pro.
With your time invested, Dean became a master at leg locks, and ultimately had a pretty decent MMA career

Now I'm an old man who lives in AZ, I no longer train, except for a home weightlifting gym, but still a big-time fan.

Cheers and nice to meet you,

Jack

Shit, I wonder if we actually may have rolled back in the day. I trained with Dean Lister a few times when we were both blue belts at Fabios academy. His leg attacks were wicked even then. haha

Ricksons main underling instructor back in those early days was David Kama if memory serves me correctly. He fought a couple of challenge matches in the back rooms against other styles.
 
Eerily similar here. Boxed as well, trained with Rorion and Royce in Torrance prior to the first UFC. Got my blue belt from Rorion and followed Fabio Santos over to San Diego, got my purple from him. Neat guys, great instructors.

Fabio really is a world class instructor, so well versed, super funny, and a super nice guy. My former school in Nebraska was affiliated with him (my lead instructor was one of Fabio's black belts), so he'd come out about once a year and it was always a can't miss event.
 
Shit, I wonder if we actually may have rolled back in the day. I trained with Dean Lister a few times when we were both blue belts at Fabios academy. His leg attacks were wicked even then. haha
Ricksons main underling instructor back in those early days was David Kama if memory serves me correctly. He fought a couple of challenge matches in the back rooms against other styles.

You know what, maybe so! <45>

I was there from June, 1997 to maybe March of 1998.

As you said, small world brotha!
 
Agree with OP wholeheartedly. Not much left to say. You will notice a lot of those who discredit him are old school fans moreso than hardcore fans. Truthfully i doubt there are many people left here who watched it unfold contemporaneously. I did, and i really loved Royce. The fact that he’s arrogant doesn’t bother me. The sport naturally progressed quickly, but he still holds impressive wins over Shamrock, Severn, and Kimo, amongst some others.

It was much different back then.
 
Fabio really is a world class instructor, so well versed, super funny, and a super nice guy. My former school in Nebraska was affiliated with him (my lead instructor was one of Fabio's black belts), so he'd come out about once a year and it was always a can't miss event.

Yeah, he and Rorion are easily the two greatest instructors I've even had. Meticulous breakdowns of techniques. And like you said, Fabio is funny AF. He often times had the whole class in stitches.
 
Gracie in modern day MMA:

1252897568.jpg

@Nathan LaMontagne

is not imprezzed wit hiz performanse


Nate via straight arm-lock
 
Yeah, he and Rorion are easily the two greatest instructors I've even had. Meticulous breakdowns of techniques. And like you said, Fabio is funny AF. He often times had the whole class in stitches.

All of this, spot-on.

It's not just being clean "in their" techniques; it's the ability to communicate the intricate details, that set them both apart in my experience as well.
 
Good for the time but MMA evolved so insanely fast in the 90s that he was surpassed very quickly. Imagine him trying to fight Randy or Kerr.
 
I don't think he is underrated at all.

Numerous elite martial artists look to him as primary inspiration for learning to fight.

But, the other side of the coin applies.
He had a cheat code that everyone else didn't. And good for him and his family for figuring out the cheat code. That changed EVERYTHING and can't be overstated in terms of the importance.

But once MMA, mixed martial arts, became MIXED martial arts, his family and their refusal to continue to evolve, could no longer compete. Which is fine I would imagine they are quite happy with their prominent placement within the foundation of modern martial arts and lucrative worldwide business franchise.
 
I actually think Royce is one of the easiest legends of the game to evaluate because his strengths, weaknesses, and accomplishments are super straightforward.
 
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