Social Push to end “nice racism”

[Scerpi]

It looks like robin deangelo has done it again. In her new book, she tackles “nice racism” which she argues is even more harmful than overt racism. She claims that nice racism may be accidental but the racial bias has longer impacting issues.

Really? So trying to be super nice to a person because they are black is worse than driving by and screaming the n word at someone? This bitch is seriously unhinged-yet people, especially corporations and academia, listen to her.

Here is her example that she opens the book with. She had zero black friends when she was in her thirties and met a couple for dinner where she proceeded to tell all these stories where her family said racist things and she thought it was so wrong. She was so desperate to show she wasn’t racist that she committed the crime of nice racism and caused more harm than if she had been purposefully racist.

Soo.. she's basically calling out all White Progressives suffering from white guilt...

 

[rob mafia]

it was an example and obviously, I disagree

...i was pointing out that it wasn't a valid example.

that is exactly my policy in dealing with people and I resent being told to treat someone different because of whatever group they belong to

i guess i don't understand why this thread exists, then

 

[nhbbear]

Soo.. she's basically calling out all White Progressives suffering from white guilt...

it is a contest to see who is the most woke

 

[nhbbear]

...i was pointing out that it wasn't a valid example.

, I don’t think so. The example of the coat thing was being so deferent as to be offensive and treating someone differently

 

[ultramanhyata]

that is exactly my policy in dealing with people and I resent being told to treat someone different because of whatever group they belong to. In real life, I am kind to everyone and very polite.

So why did you have such an angry reaction to a person saying that BOTH "mean" and "nice" racism are unacceptable?

 

[nhbbear]

So why did you have such an angry reaction to a person saying that BOTH "mean" and "nice" racism are unacceptable?

it goes back to her assuming all white people are inherently and without exception racist on some level.

 

[Ultra O’Dia]

treat everyone equally until they, personally, give you a reason to not do so.

 

[Ultra O’Dia]

it goes back to her assuming all white people are inherently and without exception racist on some level.

not if she is ok with white people ignoring strangers of all colors like we do with strangers who are white.

im cynical as to this person’s real feelings on racism, but, in a vacuum, not treating people differently due to skin color is bang on the right way to go about everything.

 

[BFoe]

No, it's that "have a discussion" is never actually having a discussion, it's some creepy code for "shut up while I scold you for my own racial hangups". It's not a discussion if only 1 side is allowed to talk.

Often times the problem is that one side refuses to talk, and in fact, refuses to acknowledge there is an issue. It’s a pretty common theme to run into a brick wall when trying to talk about issues of race with many conservatives, and it’s often done out of stubbornness, or a sort of fear. Not fear of the other race, but fear that they may be viewed as a racist person when that’s not the intent. No matter how nicely I try and phrase it, trying to explain to most conservatives why the phrase “We Back the Badge” (or “All Lives Matter” is insensitive is likely to be met with a wall of defense.
Frankly, there’s been so much trolling behavior that it’s gotten difficult to tell when there’s a legitimate misunderstanding, or if someone is trolling. For example, there’s been threads on Voter ID laws. I honestly can’t tell if “libs think black people are too stupid to figure out ______” is a real attempt at an argument, or a troll.
Likewise, I find the following extremely tiresome (I’ll put this in spoiler tags, so I don’t take up too much space):

Spoiler

• The insistence that there’s no systemic problem with race in this country even though we know from multiple studies that people with “ethnic” sounding names are more likely to face housing discrimination, we know that African Americans are more likely to receive harsher sentences than whites when their records and charges are equivalent, we know that minorities who “Americanize” ethnic-sounding names are more likely to get calls back when applying for a job, we know that African Americans are more likely to be pulled over, and almost twice as likely to be searched, as their white peers, and so forth. I’d love to work together to solve these things, but it’s not possible as long as conservatives refuse to acknowledge it exists. These are not issues caused by one bad racist over here, and one over there—these are widespread issues present in our systems.
• Endless victim shaming when police are the aggressors. There’s been some really nasty things said (re Floyd, Trayvon, Garner, and more) that are pretty unconscionable. And FFS, if a medical examiner says something is a homicide and not an overdose, there’s no reason to persist in calling a death an overdose other than to be an asshole. Simple as.
• Responding to a statue being taken down, even if done through proper channels, as “erasing history” followed by the requisite out of context-repetition of a George Orwell quote.

I could list more, but you get the point. The bottom line is that I’m tired of conservatives seeing these discussions as personal attacks, rather than being willing to form a partnership to eliminate these things. I’m also tired of hearing that these issues shouldn’t be brought up because they are “divisive.”
Why does it have to be divisive? Imo, we should all be in agreement that racism is an awful thing, that it still exists in many areas of our society with very harmful effects, and we should work together to try and eliminate it. Far too often, one side refuses to even acknowledge these plainly obvious things because doing so would cause them to have to be introspective as to their own words and behavior and they are simply unwilling to do so.

Feel free to post a few things that you feel are tiresome from liberals. Maybe we’ll actually be able to have a discussion.

 

[lifelessheap]

I don’t know who this person is—but she’s actually not making a bad point. In her example, she’s talking about how in her desire to be seen as progressive and not racist, she actually made race an issue in a setting where it wasn’t an issue previously. Tbh, I think there are many well-meaning people, myself probably included, and also including non-progressives, who do things that are harmful in some way or another but it happens outside of their awareness. One of my great frustrations when discussing race issues with conservative-leaning people is that they often seem deathly allergic to even having the discussion. They want to believe that racism is a thing of the past, they don’t seem to understand why it’s even being discussed, and they often refuse to examine their own behaviors and actions even when no one is accusing them of being a racist person in general.

Or you could move the fuck on. Obsessing about race is retarded. Just treat people like people.

 

[ultramanhyata]

it goes back to her assuming all white people are inherently and without exception racist on some level.

So you don't think there's a difference between meeting a black person and telling them all the racist things your family used to say (which is what she claimed she regretted having done) and meeting a black person and telling them about your dogs?

You think DiAngelo's book says any time a white person is friendly with a POC it's inherently racist?? That was your takeaway??

 

[BFoe]

Or you could move the fuck on. Obsessing about race is retarded. Just treat people like people.

But in many facets of society, people aren’t treated like people (i.e., not treated equally), that’s the point. As long as groups of people are wrongly treated differently than other people, we’re not living up to the ideals that the country was founded on, we’re not living up to what is set forth in the Declaration or Constitution, and thus there’s more work to be done. Pointing out issues that are unfair or unconstitutional and trying to fix them is hardly “obsessing.”

 

[rob mafia]

But in many facets of society, people aren’t treated like people (i.e., not treated equally), that’s the point. As long as groups of people are wrongly treated differently than other people, we’re not living up to the ideals that the country was founded on, we’re not living up to what is set forth in the Declaration or Constitution, and thus there’s more work to be done. Pointing out issues that are unfair or unconstitutional and trying to fix them is hardly “obsessing.”

and as long as you're pulling out some sort of color wheel/flow chart/whatever to determine how to treat someone based on what color/sex/imaginary gender/etc, we'll never get there.

it's ironic, because you're advocating the same behavior you just complained about.

for maximum irony - i'm a staunch egalitarian and get called a racist/sexist/transphobe/nazi/etc all the damn time for not treating people differently and just treating people the same... if one thinks that racism is the problem, lolz @ the same genius concluding that racism is the answer.

 

[Jake the Muss]

Ok. I can see how being overly deferent is pandering or treating people differently because of their race. Some want it, many do not. I will continue to treat people the same and if someone has issue with that, it’s their issue not mine

Aversive racism can be a veneer for colorblind racism.

Often times the problem is that one side refuses to talk, and in fact, refuses to acknowledge there is an issue. It’s a pretty common theme to run into a brick wall when trying to talk about issues of race with many conservatives, and it’s often done out of stubbornness, or a sort of fear. Not fear of No matter how nicely I try and phrase it, trying to explain to most conservatives why the phrase “We Back the Badge” (or “All Lives Matter” is insensitive is likely to be met with a wall of defense.
Frankly, there’s been so much trolling behavior that it’s gotten difficult to tell when there’s a legitimate misunderstanding, or if someone is trolling. For example, there’s been threads on Voter ID laws. I honestly can’t tell if “libs think black people are too stupid to figure out ______” is a real attempt at an argument, or a troll.
Likewise, I find the following extremely tiresome (I’ll put this in spoiler tags, so I don’t take up too much space):

Spoiler

• The insistence that there’s no systemic problem with race in this country even though we know from multiple studies that people with “ethnic” sounding names are more likely to face housing discrimination, we know that African Americans are more likely to receive harsher sentences than whites when their records and charges are equivalent, we know that minorities who “Americanize” ethnic-sounding names are more likely to get calls back when applying for a job, we know that African Americans are more likely to be pulled over, and almost twice as likely to be searched, as their white peers, and so forth. I’d love to work together to solve these things, but it’s not possible as long as conservatives refuse to acknowledge it exists. These are not issues caused by one bad racist over here, and one over there—these are widespread issues present in our systems.
• Endless victim shaming when police are the aggressors. There’s been some really nasty things said (re Floyd, Trayvon, Garner, and more) that are pretty unconscionable. And FFS, if a medical examiner says something is a homicide and not an overdose, there’s no reason to persist in calling a death an overdose other than to be an asshole. Simple as.
• Responding to a statue being taken down, even if done through proper channels, as “erasing history” followed by the requisite out of context-repetition of a George Orwell quote.

I could list more, but you get the point. The bottom line is that I’m tired of conservatives seeing these discussions as personal attacks, rather than being willing to form a partnership to eliminate these things. I’m also tired of hearing that these issues shouldn’t be brought up because they are “divisive.”
Why does it have to be divisive? Imo, we should all be in agreement that racism is an awful thing, that it still exists in many areas of our society with very harmful effects, and we should work together to try and eliminate it. Far too often, one side refuses to even acknowledge these plainly obvious things because doing so would cause them to have to be introspective as to their own words and behavior and they are simply unwilling to do so.

Feel free to post a few things that you feel are tiresome from liberals. Maybe we’ll actually be able to have a discussion.

Here's the thing. Conservatives are named conservatives because they want to conserve what they already have.

Unfortunately, the argument to eliminate the division can't be made from a moral perspective. It needs to be transactional. The desire to eliminate the divisions needs to be greater than the perks of maintaining the status quo.

If you can paint a realistic picture of a more prosperous world for everybody, then be prepared to be assassinated.

 

[Ultra O’Dia]

all people will discriminate within themselves, forever, and about all things.

browbeating people about race only makes race a bigger problem.

resentment and entitlement will always occur when one is treated differently from the other.

all that can be asked is that the laws are equal.

 

[GoldenWolf87]

What is nice racism? A canandian ku klux klan meeting?

Apparently in Robin's racist mindset its racist to be nice to a POC. Not sure why the Biden admin has given so much attention to her.

 

[GoldenWolf87]

I would imaingine the end goal is to create more SJWs who are always angry?

 

[BFoe]

Here's the thing. Conservatives are named conservatives because they want to conserve what they already have.

Unfortunately, the argument to eliminate the division can't be made from a moral perspective. It needs to be transactional. The desire to eliminate the divisions needs to be greater than the perks of maintaining the status quo.

If you can paint a realistic picture of a more prosperous world for everybody, then be prepared to be assassinated.

This is a good post, and tbh it is something I struggle with. To my liberal-leaning brain, the idea that all people should be treated equally or should have equal opportunities are such fundamental American values that they should be reason alone. And it’s difficult for me to understand sometimes why that isn’t sufficient reason to act. You mentioned conservatives wanting to conserve what they have, and I often get the sense that they feel like rights or liberty are like slices of pie: “God forbid someone else’s slice gets a little bigger, because it must mean my slice is getting smaller.”
And it’s just not that way.

 

[nostradumbass]

Often times the problem is that one side refuses to talk, and in fact, refuses to acknowledge there is an issue. It’s a pretty common theme to run into a brick wall when trying to talk about issues of race with many conservatives, and it’s often done out of stubbornness, or a sort of fear. Not fear of the other race, but fear that they may be viewed as a racist person when that’s not the intent. No matter how nicely I try and phrase it, trying to explain to most conservatives why the phrase “We Back the Badge” (or “All Lives Matter” is insensitive is likely to be met with a wall of defense.
Frankly, there’s been so much trolling behavior that it’s gotten difficult to tell when there’s a legitimate misunderstanding, or if someone is trolling. For example, there’s been threads on Voter ID laws. I honestly can’t tell if “libs think black people are too stupid to figure out ______” is a real attempt at an argument, or a troll.
Likewise, I find the following extremely tiresome (I’ll put this in spoiler tags, so I don’t take up too much space):

Spoiler

• The insistence that there’s no systemic problem with race in this country even though we know from multiple studies that people with “ethnic” sounding names are more likely to face housing discrimination, we know that African Americans are more likely to receive harsher sentences than whites when their records and charges are equivalent, we know that minorities who “Americanize” ethnic-sounding names are more likely to get calls back when applying for a job, we know that African Americans are more likely to be pulled over, and almost twice as likely to be searched, as their white peers, and so forth. I’d love to work together to solve these things, but it’s not possible as long as conservatives refuse to acknowledge it exists. These are not issues caused by one bad racist over here, and one over there—these are widespread issues present in our systems.
• Endless victim shaming when police are the aggressors. There’s been some really nasty things said (re Floyd, Trayvon, Garner, and more) that are pretty unconscionable. And FFS, if a medical examiner says something is a homicide and not an overdose, there’s no reason to persist in calling a death an overdose other than to be an asshole. Simple as.
• Responding to a statue being taken down, even if done through proper channels, as “erasing history” followed by the requisite out of context-repetition of a George Orwell quote.

I could list more, but you get the point. The bottom line is that I’m tired of conservatives seeing these discussions as personal attacks, rather than being willing to form a partnership to eliminate these things. I’m also tired of hearing that these issues shouldn’t be brought up because they are “divisive.”
Why does it have to be divisive? Imo, we should all be in agreement that racism is an awful thing, that it still exists in many areas of our society with very harmful effects, and we should work together to try and eliminate it. Far too often, one side refuses to even acknowledge these plainly obvious things because doing so would cause them to have to be introspective as to their own words and behavior and they are simply unwilling to do so.

Feel free to post a few things that you feel are tiresome from liberals. Maybe we’ll actually be able to have a discussion.

If you think there's an issue of "institutional racism", why don't you direct the complaints at the people in charge of the institutions instead of trying to browbeat people who aren't in charge of any of them? Why would they be directed at conservatives when conservatives don't run the education system, the media, the entertainment industry, nearly the entire government bureaucracy, almost every corporation, the tech industry the majority of publishing companies?

Do you think anybody is going to take it seriously when Michelle Obama, Megan Markle, and Oprah are sitting around at a chateau talking about how privileged those gross peasants working 9-5s are?

Jesus, Robin DiAngelo and Ibram Rogers charge more for a 2 hour speaking engagement than the people they're denouncing as privileged racists make in an entire year. The left used to pretend to be against "punching down", but that is all they do now and then your book is removed from Amazon, you're banned from social media and fired from your job if you object to being berated.

 

[djacobox372]

I agree that robin deangelo is a "nice racist," her mistake is believing that all white people are like her, or even the majority.

She's trying to excuse her racism by claiming it's because she's white, not because she's an ignorant and elitist person.