Prime Cro Cop annihilates Jon Jones at 205

[MMACro]

I understand you can't just say Jones takes down every fighter because he took down DC, but it does show his level of it. Jones uses leverage very well and Cro Cop isn't a tall HW. It's not apples to apples, but we saw many take Cro Cop down when he did hit the cage.

Its in the open where Mirko's tdd was valnurable,at the fence he was like a wall and thats where Jon would struggle as well and Jon's takedowns later in his career werent sth special especially in the open as well.Was hard for him to establish control in most fights.
If i see his chances with takedowns its actually how he got Stipe down,trips(improvising or not) and thats where Fedor had success vs Mirko as back then no way he would double/single leg Mirko.He knew how to sprawl but clinch takedowns with trips were harder for him and you need to be a bit higher level for that then just sprawling on guys

 

[jpenwell14]

I understand you can't just say Jones takes down every fighter because he took down DC, but it does show his level of it. Jones uses leverage very well and Cro Cop isn't a tall HW. It's not apples to apples, but we saw many take Cro Cop down when he did hit the cage.

It’s not just the getting him down, it’s the keeping him down that makes it nuanced. Cro cop has some of the most incredible static strength of any human I’ve ever seen. He also has ridiculously strong legs for just pushing people off him and getting back up. Like even with dc right it’s like ya Jon got him down but he didn’t keep him down and also I saw rampage sit up out of mount with Jon on his chest.

Listen having Jon on you is one of the worst things that could potentially happen to you, and I’m not diminishing how great he is at it. I am saying this conversation becomes worlds different if that particular aspect of his game doesn’t work out for him in this match up.

 

[Tweak896]

Its in the open where Mirko's tdd was valnurable,at the fence he was like a wall and thats where Jon would struggle as well and Jon's takedowns later in his career werent sth special especially in the open as well.Was hard for him to establish control in most fights.
If i see his chances with takedowns its actually how he got Stipe down,trips(improvising or not) and thats where Fedor had success vs Mirko as back then no way he would double/single leg Mirko.He knew how to sprawl but clinch takedowns with trips were harder for him and you need to be a bit higher level for that then just sprawling on guys

It’s not just the getting him down, it’s the keeping him down that makes it nuanced. Cro cop has some of the most incredible static strength of any human I’ve ever seen. He also has
ridiculously strong legs for just pushing people off him and getting back up. Like even with dc right it’s like ya Jon got him down but he didn’t keep him down and also I saw rampage sit up out of mount with Jon on his chest.

Listen having Jon on you is one of the worst things that could potentially happen to you, and I’m not diminishing how great he is at it. I am saying this conversation becomes worlds different if that particular aspect of his game doesn’t work out for him in this match up.

That is true. We'll never know. The game was different while Cro Cop fought, and what worked back then is different than the knowledge we have now. Makes me think about Chuck Liddell being similar in regards to TDD.

Would Chuck get up from Jones? We've seen the game evolve. Wrestlers shoot differently than they used to, TDD has evolved to use cage more. Back then people would shoot from center and defend there. Now we see more cage work and chain wrestling. Cro Cop was a beast, actually the guy who got me super into MMA way back then. He seemed to have natural intuition like Aldo did with balance and speed to stay on the feet.

I never hear people bring this up, because they are obsessed with the kick Gonzaga landed, but Gonzaga took Cro Cop down and kept him there the first round. This was less than a year after Cro Cop won the GP. Then he was controlled by Kongo next fight for 3 rounds. Schaub controlled Cro Cop for 3 rounds. I think Jones would keep him down worse than Gonzaga, Kongo, Nelson, and Shaub. There I said it. We'll never know, because prime Cro Cop never made it to UFC, we could only match them with a time machine prime for prime in our heads, so no one is right.

 

[jpenwell14]

That is true. We'll never know. The game was different while Cro Cop fought, and what worked back then is different than the knowledge we have now. Makes me think about Chuck Liddell being similar in regards to TDD.

Would Chuck get up from Jones? We've seen the game evolve. Wrestlers shoot differently than they used to, TDD has evolved to use cage more. Back then people would shoot from center and defend there. Now we see more cage work and chain wrestling. Cro Cop was a beast, actually the guy who got me super into MMA way back then. He seemed to have natural intuition like Aldo did with balance and speed to stay on the feet.

I never hear people bring this up, because they are obsessed with the kick Gonzaga landed, but Gonzaga took Cro Cop down and kept him there the first round. This was less than a year after Cro Cop won the GP. Then he was controlled by Kongo next fight for 3 rounds. Schaub controlled Cro Cop for 3 rounds. I think Jones would keep him down worse than Gonzaga, Kongo, Nelson, and Shaub. There I said it. We'll never know, because prime Cro Cop never made it to UFC, we could only match them with a time machine prime for prime in our heads, so no one is right.

My claim is he stopped being juiced to the gills like everyone was in pride and it affected him significantly. Which is why I don’t care if he and Jon are both on juice for this hypothetical fight.

You know who didn’t have a drop off? Chronic steroid user Josh Barnett who cro cop rag dolled in the most absurd way possible.

 

[jpenwell14]

That is true. We'll never know. The game was different while Cro Cop fought, and what worked back then is different than the knowledge we have now. Makes me think about Chuck Liddell being similar in regards to TDD.

Would Chuck get up from Jones? We've seen the game evolve. Wrestlers shoot differently than they used to, TDD has evolved to use cage more. Back then people would shoot from center and defend there. Now we see more cage work and chain wrestling. Cro Cop was a beast, actually the guy who got me super into MMA way back then. He seemed to have natural intuition like Aldo did with balance and speed to stay on the feet.

I never hear people bring this up, because they are obsessed with the kick Gonzaga landed, but Gonzaga took Cro Cop down and kept him there the first round. This was less than a year after Cro Cop won the GP. Then he was controlled by Kongo next fight for 3 rounds. Schaub controlled Cro Cop for 3 rounds. I think Jones would keep him down worse than Gonzaga, Kongo, Nelson, and Shaub. There I said it. We'll never know, because prime Cro Cop never made it to UFC, we could only match them with a time machine prime for prime in our heads, so no one is right.

And also rampage sat up out of mount from Jon jones, and I’ve seen too many people out wrestle rampage badly at this point to make the assumption that because someone else could do it, Jon could do it better.

 

[Tweak896]

My claim is he stopped being juiced to the gills like everyone was in pride and it affected him significantly. Which is why I don’t care if he and Jon are both on juice for this hypothetical fight.

You know who didn’t have a drop off? Chronic steroid user Josh Barnett who cro cop rag dolled in the most absurd way possible.

You are arguing Jones who joined UFC in 2008 was juiced to the gills and Cro Cop who joined UFC in 2007 wasn't. Personally I assume they were juiced to the max and ignore it, considering Jones didn't join until a year after cro cop. If you say Pride let you do more, then Jones would have been even more juiced than we've ever seen.

And also rampage sat up out of mount from Jon jones, and I’ve seen too many people out wrestle rampage badly at this point to make the assumption that because someone else could do it, Jon could do it better.

Rampage is pretty underrated, NGL. But it's clear if you watch the fight, Jones gameplan was to beat him standing.

 

[jpenwell14]

Yes I w

You are arguing Jones who joined UFC in 2008 was juiced to the gills and Cro Cop who joined UFC in 2007 wasn't. Personally I assume they were juiced to the max and ignore it, considering Jones didn't join until a year after cro cop. If you say Pride let you do more, then Jones would have been even more juiced than we've ever seen.


Rampage is pretty underrated, NGL. But it's clear if you watch the fight, Jones gameplan was to beat him standing.

Yes I would say that’s accurate for a myriad of reasons.