Out of the 4 GOATS, is Fedor the only one who deliberately engaged his opponents at their strengths?

[BFoe]

Dat Brett Rogers gif looks stoppage worthy, damn he made a comeback.

It was a scary moment watching live, but Rogers missed most of those shots. Fedor was fine and trapped an arm for an armbar attempt, McCarthy was right not to stop it. Rogers didn’t even win that round imo.

 

[1King]

If you engage in bad strategy, that makes you a worse fighter, not better. Even if it’s more entertaining.

 

[mixmastermo]

If you engage in bad strategy, that makes you a worse fighter, not better. Even if it’s more entertaining.

Best display of fight IQ ever

 

[ThunderStruck]

Best display of fight IQ ever

Of IQ loss maybe Bolth fighters losing neurons every seconds.

 

[HHJ]

Christ you Fedor cucks never stop.

Fedor had massive power and was a Grandmaster of Sambo and an International Master of Judo.

No fucking shit he didn't care if they fought standing or on the ground.

"Herrp a derp you Fedor cucks never stop!'

:: Accidentally goes into every thread about our lord and Savior ::

 

[MartinGibson86]

When you don’t realize that Sylvia is one of the greatest HWs of all time, you know you’re a noob.

Which of these men does he rank higher than:
Nog, JDS, Reem, Francis, Werdum, DC, Cain, Mir, AA, Fedor, Barnett, Stipe, Couture....those are just the champuons save for Reem

How bout Volkov, Kharironov, Blaydes. Pavlivich, Aspinall, CroCop, Gonzaga, etc


He fought for the belt off a win over cabbage

 

[mkt]

Which of these men does he rank higher than:
Nog, JDS, Reem, Francis, Werdum, DC, Cain, Mir, AA, Fedor, Barnett, Stipe, Couture....those are just the champuons save for Reem

How bout Volkov, Kharironov, Blaydes. Pavlivich, Aspinall, CroCop, Gonzaga, etc


He fought for the belt off a win over cabbage

To use Fedor fan logic, Tim Sylvia was "post prime" and not a meaningful win for Fedor, because before they fought:

• Sylvia lost his belt to a 44-year old Couture who moved up from LHW. He lost to an old, small guy.
• Lost to a "past prime" Big Nog

I'm being a little facetious, but do think the best version of Sylvia was the one who beat Arlovski in back-to-back fights along with Ricco, Monson, etc. But the point is you can't have it both ways. If all of Fedor's losses are excused because he was "past prime" at age 33 after his first loss, then Sylvia and Arlovski were also past their UFC champion days and not elite competition either.

 

[IIIIIIII]

GSP is pretty much a safe fighter predominately through his career.

Anderson Silva stayed in his lane most of the time. Leaned on his advantageous.

Probably Jon Jones has done it a few times, but not as often and deliberate as Fedor.

And if Fedor seems the most daring and most risk taking when it comes to fighting and beating his opponents at their strengths. Does that increase his value as a fighter in the GOAT conversation or it doesn't?

What say you?

this is going to sound very unfair, but gsp is the worst of the, "goats". gsp initially did not fight safe. he was a very aggressive fighter to begin with. it was when matt serra knocked him out that he realized, "oh crap, i can actually get knocked out and lose". that realization is what changed him and his approach to fighting. instead of fighting to finish he fought to not lose. hence, why all his fights post serra 1 became incredibly boring. you knew gsp was never going to go for the finish. winning on points like a wuss. i'm sorry, but real fighters fight to finish. that wasn't gsp post serra.

 

[moreorless87]

Yes, 8 exactly. and 4 of those where when CroCop clinched up, and 2 when CroCop tried to take Fedor down.

R1: 5.27 - CroCop falls or tries a takedown, hard to really tell. Makes him end up on his knees in front of Fedor.Leads to Fedor taking him down without even trying.
R2 : 4.45 - CroCop tries to take Fedor down(with full body lock), Fedor reverses and tries a trip.
R2: 2.52 - Fedor tries a throw after CroCop clinches up with doubble underhooks.
R2: 2.20 - CroCop clinches again. Fedor trips CroCop.
R3: 4.40 - CroCop tries to take Fedor down and gets reversed.
R3: 2.23 - CroCop tries to take down Fedor(with doubble underhooks), fedor takes him down instead.
R3: 0.26 - Fedor takes down CroCop.



If you can watch this fight and come away thinking Fedor seemed to be afraid of CroCops striking, or that he did not engage in the striking, there is no helping you. Same if you think Fedor was hunting takedowns.

I think really what you see is that Fedor didnt go looking for takedowns but rather put the pressure on Mirko to the degree that he would start to make mistakes and give him openings for takerdowns.

 

[Oddmonster]

What you see is that Fedor didnt go looking for takedowns.

I agree. And not going looking for takedowns against the consensus best HW striker of the time is my exact point - Fedor was fine with it being a striking match.
It is still a MMA match, and he will use his tools, but he simply does/did not care where the fight was taking place, hence what I said in my op - Fedor stands with strikers, and grapples with grapplers.

 

[MartinGibson86]

Yea, Jon really proved that in the Gane fight, right?

On Fedor I agree. Fedor simply did not care what his opponents strengths was.

He initiated a clinch 30 seconds into the Hunt fight.

He didn't shoot one TD against Coleman or Randleman in three fights.

Jesus Christ...i hear his punches are being used in clinical trials to blast tumors

 

[moreorless87]

I agree. And not going looking for takedowns against the consensus best HW striker of the time is my exact point - Fedor was fine with it being a striking match.
It is still a MMA match, and he will use his tools, but he simply does/did not care where the fight was taking place, hence what I said in my op - Fedor stands with strikers, and grapples with grapplers.

I this case as well I think he realised focusing on takedowns would be playing into Mirko's game, the threat of them could still be there but Fedor wouldnt actually be wearing himself down or potentially getting countered going for them until Mirko started to get desperate and tired.

Generally though I think Fedor's wrestling was very efficient though compared to a lot of modern fighters, even other guys with Judo backgrounds often tend to just muscle people down were as he tended to work via catching them off balance chaning takedowns into his striking.

Thats a style which really should have been picked up on way more than it has been IMHO, it makes it very hard to shut someones wrestling down entirely because its not possible to always be setup to deal with it AND its not nearly so cardio intensive, a lot of modern fighters I feel when there wrestling is "shut down" what really happens is they give up on it because it costs more energy to carry out that it does their opponent to escape the ground. A well timed throw though costs way less energy than going ultra deep on a single leg or the clinch against the cage for 10-20 secs before you actually get someone down