Rumored *** Oliveira vs. Islam MEGA THREAD (Rumored for October 22nd) ***

[joeson]

He never revealed it, and there could be all kinds of reasons for that, including not being allowed to fight with it (see Bisping).

However, it's documented that he did have to go to Germany to treat it for a few months after the collapse.

Documented as in he said he had to? Sounds like an excuse for why he didn't make weight

on their first try using the same scales.

[/I]
Every other fighter had a pound allowance. Oliveira did not. Even then, lots of fighters complained and said they had a hard time making weight. OSP said that he went to sleep on weight and woke up heavy.

Were Oliveira stupid enough to try and sue, he'd never get past that obvious giant hole in his logic. Fighters adjusting the scales happens in every event, as most of these fighters and Dana have also pointed out. This isn't new, and a really stupid excuse on Oliveira's part.

If it isn't new why is Dana White admitting that they have to start adding security to scales now? Why are fighters complaining now but not in other events? If they admit that they have to add security now and didn't before that means that there is a new problem and they admit it is their responsibility. It is their equipment, it is their responsibility to ensure it is accurate. If they didn't provide a scale at all it would be a different story but if you provide the equipment and tell a fighter to use it to ensure your weight you assume responsibility for its accuracy.

 

[Frank Edgar]

It is absolutely the UFC's fault he didn't make weight. It was their scale that they provided under the pretense that it could be reliably used to measure his weight. The UFC would absolutely lose a court case. It's not up to Oliveira to make up for the UFC's faulty equipment or to cut more weight than needed just in case their equipment is faulty.

Nope, it's not their fault. Gaethe, Rose, and Esparza somehow miraculously still made weight. And no, he would not win a court case, stop talking out of your ass

Is it written on the fighter's contracts that the UFC is responsible for providing weight scales? Highly doubtful. It's up to Oliveira to make weight, plain and simple. It's not his job to cut more weight than needed, but it is his job to make weight by whatever means necessary. He had an extra hour to cut the rest of the weight and he couldn't

Presumably, Oliveira relied on his own weight scales to track his weight throughout the rest of his weight cut. He could have brought those scales with him to the hotel. He could fight at a higher weight class. He could have a stricter diet so that he is closer to championship weight earlier in the cutting process. He could have cut the extra weight with the extra hour

Many things Oliveira could have done to avoid what happened. It's his fault

 

[laleggenda27]

Based on merit, Dariush should get the title shot. But based on fan interest, Islam will get it. Dariush-Dustin makes the most sense to me, since neither have fought in a while and they both want to fight this summer. Otherwise, I guess Chandler would be the guy, depending on his timeline for return.

 

[Reffson]

Make weight no excuses.

Bring your own scale. You're the champ.

Stupid response.

 

[Crash Lance]

In my opinion, this entire thread is hilarious.

Imagine if Dana White and the rest of the UFC want to make Oliveira vs. McGregor for the UFC Lightweight World Championship.

That title fight could be the first time in the entire history of the UFC where both assassins (Oliveira AND McGregor) fail to make it to the Lightweight Division (which is 146 lb - 155 lb).

The reason that I mentioned McGregor is because McGregor keeps saying how difficult it is for him to make it to the Lightweight Division nowadays.

 

[SeattleFightFan]

First of all, I'm as critical of Olivera's past quits as I am respectful of his recent run of decimating the LW division's elite.

I think right now, Charles Olivera is arguably the most exciting fighter in the entire UFC roster, due to his multi-faceted ability to finish, combined with the pressure he puts out, as well as a pervasive "air of vulnerability" that hangs over every performance.

Massive credit to Olivera for his complete career overhaul.
That said, I believe Olivera's being stripped of his championship was simply unfair.

There is a major difference between Olivera missing weight – and the UFC having issues with their scales.

The former is worthy of a strip, the latter is the UFC's lack of vigilance. I believe the fiasco in the Olivera x Gaethje fight is a result of the latter.

To rob Olivera of his lifetime achievement, his Championship, when Dana knows the issues were with the scales, is summarily unfair. Unconscionable even.

Dana trying to laugh with it off, and saying, "Everyone considers Olivera the Champion," isn't good enough.

IMO, Dana should man-up, admit the UFC's lack of vigilance in monitoring the scales was the problem – and give Olivera the benefit of the doubt and his title back.

Olivera rightfully should have two title defenses.

Instead, he now has to start over again.

That's bull ship, plain and simple.

I got one simple question for you.

If the hotel had provided an unofficial scale the day prior to weigh-in, would his missing weight the next day be the hotel's fault?

Follow up question: then why is it the UFC's fault for providing an unofficial scale the day prior to weigh-in?

TLDR: sometimes it's better to just accept a shitty situation was shitty than spend so much life energy trying to figure out who's fault it was.

 

[Frank Edgar]

1) Dana admitted there was a scale-monitoring problem.

2) People need to shut up and put the blame where it belongs: the UFC's lack of control/vigilance on their own scales.

1) This did not deter the other championship fighters from making weight

2) People need to shut up and put the blame where it belongs: Oliveira's irresponsibility and inability to cut the extra weight once he learned he was over

 

[Post 2 Decision]

If you can't cut 0.5 lbs in 1 hour it means you are simply too big for 155.

No excuses. Oliveira is trying to weight bully and he even succeeded. So no belt for him.

He could cut 1 lbs in 1 hour easily, let alone 0.5 lbs. Its the same scale.

It means Oliveira had no water and fat left to cut anymore. Oliveira was no 155er, he was probably 10 lbs bigger than Gaethje.

Lmao.

1- DC failed in his first attempt then he come back later and tried the second attempt with holding the towel.

2- Khabib never failed in his first attempt and he didn't hold the towel.

If there was a problem they wouldn't let Khabib to pass in the first attempt as they didn't let DC and didn't let Khamzat.

Khabib haters are desperate as usual.

It's confirmed:

You are the dumbest bubble in the bathtub

Everything you said in your post is wrong, lmao unbelievable

 

[joeson]

Nope, it's not their fault. Gaethe, Rose, and Esparza somehow miraculously still made weight. And no, he would not win a court case, stop talking out of your ass

Is it written on the fighter's contracts that the UFC is responsible for providing weight scales? Highly doubtful. It's up to Oliveira to make weight, plain and simple. It's not his job to cut more weight than needed, but it is his job to make weight by whatever means necessary. He had an extra hour to cut the rest of the weight and he couldn't

Presumably, Oliveira relied on his own weight scales to track his weight throughout the rest of his weight cut. He could have brought those scales with him to the hotel. He could fight at a higher weight class. He could have a stricter diet so that he is closer to championship weight earlier in the cutting process. He could have cut the extra weight with the extra hour

Many things Oliveira could have done to avoid what happened. It's his fault

If your employer gives you a breathalyzer before you get into work and the equipment turns out to be faulty should you be fired? Could you sue them if you were? You weren't supposed to fail but you did.

The UFC provided the equipment to measure his weight. A scale that is supposed to be calibrated the same way as the official scale. Other scales can be assumed to be inaccurate because the UFC assures them that this scale is calibrated to the official scale. Now that equipment is off by several pounds.

 

[PunchyMcSplodo]

Documented as in he said he had to? Sounds like an excuse for why he didn't make weight

Documented as he was in Germany for it, you crazy conspiracy theorist.

Every other fighter had a pound allowance. Oliveira did not. Even then, lots of fighters complained and said they had a hard time making weight. OSP said that he went to sleep on weight and woke up heavy.

Gaethje, Rose, and Carla did not have a pound allowance. They made it on their first try.

Fighters who have a pound allowance often come in at the 1 pound limit for the advantage, BTW. Only one other person missed weight, which is hardly far from the norm.

If it isn't new why is Dana White admitting that they have to start adding security to scales now? Why are fighters complaining now but not in other events?

The fighters "complaining" now admit that this isn't new.

Dana also said this isn't new.

The UFC is adding security because it makes sense to do so to avoid liability bullshit.

 

[Post 2 Decision]

1) This didn't need to be its own thread

2) It's not the UFC's fault that he missed weight. People need to stop trying to spin this narrative that Oliveira got screwed. He got an extra hour to cut the extra weight and he didn't. Besides, nobody forced him to be at exactly 155 the night before. He could have been at 154 one or two days before fight night. In other words, if he had accounted for a margin of error with the scale he would have still made weight. He chose to cut it as close to the weight limit as possible for max weight advantage and it backfired

Dana never admits that something is the UFC's fault

Guess what,

He admitted the scale incident was the UFC's fault

 

[Alpha-Q-Up]

Not a single issue was ever found to be wrong with the scales

And 3 other fighters made championship weight without a hitch. He missed weight for the 5th time in his career, get the fuck over it tbh.

 

[joeson]

Documented as he was in Germany for it, you crazy conspiracy theorist.





Gaethje, Rose, and Carla did not have a pound allowance. They made it on their first try.

Fighters who have a pound allowance often come in at the 1 pound limit for the advantage. Only one other person missed weight, which is hardly far from the norm.




The fighters "complaining" now admit that this isn't new.

Dana also said this isn't new.

The UFC is adding security because it makes sense to do so to avoid liability bullshit.

Why would the UFC need to avoid liability if it isn't their fault?

 

[PunchyMcSplodo]

If your employer gives you a breathalyzer before you get into work and the equipment turns out to be faulty should you be fired?

Except in your analogy, Oliveira really was too drunk, and all the other employees passed the same breathalyzer test and were fine.

 

[JonJonesNeedle]

Common thread here, Ali Manages Gaethje, Islam and Beneil


Ali probably is telling his fighters to not predict against his own. Privately Beneil may have thought Oliveira all day but who knows.

I think both Islam and Khabib favored Oliveria to beat Gaethje

 

[Frank Edgar]

If your employer gives you a breathalyzer before you get into work and the equipment turns out to be faulty should you be fired? Could you sue them if you were? You weren't supposed to fail but you did.

The UFC provided the equipment to measure his weight. A scale that is supposed to be calibrated the same way as the official scale. Other scales can be assumed to be inaccurate because the UFC assures them that this scale is calibrated to the official scale. Now that equipment is off by several pounds.

You're trying so hard to argue like a lawyer but your arguments are so terrible. In a hypothetical situation where a company provides a breathalyzer is it to measure Blood Alcohol Content? Because in this scenario you are presumably able to avoid an inaccurate reading simply by not drinking before work lol

And why are you assuming that the UFC "assured" anybody that the scales were accurate? Did they state ANYWHERE IN WRITING that the scales they provide were guaranteed to be in sync with the official scales provided by the athletic commission? If not, then there is no assurance

 

[SeattleFightFan]

Except in your analogy, Oliveira really was too drunk, and all the other employees passed the same breathalyzer test and were fine.

heh, that's pretty good

 

[PunchyMcSplodo]

Why would the UFC need to avoid liability if it isn't their fault?

A multi-billion dollar corporation doesn't need to be "at fault" to eatablish rules to mitigate the risk of frivolous lawsuits.

 

[joeson]

Not a single issue was ever found to be wrong with the scales

“We have this issue where guys come out and they’ll start checking the scale the night before and all the Europeans and guys from other parts of the world do kilos, so they all start f****** with the scale to look at kilos and, who knows... ,” White told reporters after the pay-per-view event at Footprint Center in Phoenix. “There’s so many moving parts to this beast of a machine that we run every week, and we’ve got to have a security guard in there where the scale is now. It’s something we’re going to have to do.”

 

[PunchyMcSplodo]

“We have this issue where guys come out and they’ll start checking the scale the night before and all the Europeans and guys from other parts of the world do kilos, so they all start f****** with the scale to look at kilos and, who knows... ,” White told reporters after the pay-per-view event at Footprint Center in Phoenix. “There’s so many moving parts to this beast of a machine that we run every week, and we’ve got to have a security guard in there where the scale is now. It’s something we’re going to have to do.”

Even there he's saying this isn't anything new. It just became an issue because Charles

Oliveira trying to use this as an excuse is utter bullshit, but now the UFC will install a guard because Charles made such a public issue about it.