Opinion Now we have a polio outbreak.

PhitePhan said:
You should write abc and tell them that they shouldn’t cast aspersions if you feel so strongly about it, as I simply posted the article, which to my knowledge, is entirely factual.

Funny, I’ve never seen a person more agitated than a vaccine zealot once you bring up any information that is not absolutely glowing about vaccines… weird.
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It's ironic that you're calling me a zealot when you're the one with the agenda. Your intent was very clear.

I have no issue discussing side effects of vaccines, and it's important to be informed about them as well.
 
Halifax said:
Ahhh the old "vaccines cause Autism" thing. Yeah I remember that still being something talked about in the 2002-13's. Its funny how Demographics change. The typical anti vaxxer back then was a vegan, all natural hippie type
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It's still a lot of the same players. It seems to be people who feel weak and powerless, with an external locus of control, who are disconnected from society and unhappy with their circumstances. Anyone who's been on Sherdog can remember all the endless NaturalNews and PrisonPlanet threads promoting various conspiracy theories... fake moon landings, young earth, flat earth, chemtrails, fluoridation, 9/11 inside job, vaccines and autism, Sandy Hook, Mosanto/GMO... The same people who would post all that shit before moved on to posting about stolen elections, pizzagate, Epstein, COVID, trannies, and now polio. PhitePhan and friends will move on to whatever the new conspiracy theory is next week. Guaranteed.
 
Lubaolong said:
It's still a lot of the same players. It seems to be people who feel weak and powerless, with an external locus of control, who are disconnected from society and unhappy with their circumstances. Anyone who's been on Sherdog can remember all the endless NaturalNews and PrisonPlanet threads promoting various conspiracy theories... fake moon landings, young earth, flat earth, chemtrails, fluoridation, 9/11 inside job, vaccines and autism, Sandy Hook, Mosanto/GMO... The same people who would post all that shit before moved on to posting about stolen elections, pizzagate, Epstein, COVID, trannies, and now polio. PhitePhan and friends will move on to whatever the new conspiracy theory is next week. Guaranteed.
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So I guess all those Peet reviewed studies and Pfizers own data that are posted in the covid topic are just all conspiracy theories?

I'd bet money almost all of us that don't want this jab have every other vaccine. Excuse those of us that smelt the BS and said I'll wait for more info like we do for other vaccines.
 
Halifax said:
Ahhh the old "vaccines cause Autism" thing. Yeah I remember that still being something talked about in the 2002-13's. Its funny how Demographics change. The typical anti vaxxer back then was a vegan, all natural hippie type
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Well, the head of then CDC admitted the the MMR is associated with “autism-like symptoms” in “rare” cases, and children who developed autism after MMR have been compensated by the government…

 
Halifax said:
Its strange to me when COVID vaccine defenders go ape defending over the Polio vaccine like it was some miracle without bumps in the road considering the rush rollout of polio vaccines were considered an unmitigated disaster because it actually gave hundreds of thousands of kids polio, paralyzed and killed a bunch of them instead of preventing them from getting it.
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Yep, and that’s on top of the fact that nearly a hundred million people in the US alone were exposed to SV40 through tainted polio vaccines which is associated with various cancers… accidents happen, but our govt continued to administer tainted vaccines well after they found out about the contamination.

http://www.sv40.org/

Halifax said:
As for the measles MMR vaccine.....Errrrr, it took time and understanding and a lot of pain before they realized "don't give this to pregnant women, or give it to women who might get pregnant in the next 4 months, or people with weak immune systems, or people with bleeding disorders, or anyone who got a blood transfusion in the past 3 months"
They didn't magically know not to give this vaccine to those people. it took years and suffering of a lot of people before they were able to make the correlations.
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The administration of the MMR leads to thousands of febrile seizures and hundreds of chronic epilepsy cases EACH YEAR in the US alone.

“Furthermore, a large 2004 Danish epidemiological study published in JAMA found that the risk of febrile seizures after MMR vaccination is 1 in 640[4] —a five-fold higher risk of febrile seizure than the risk of seizure from measles.[5] Vestergaard et al. studied the association between MMR and seizures in about 537,000 Danish children 0 to 14 days following MMR vaccination and found 1.56 MMR-related febrile seizure cases per 1,000 vaccinated children aged 15 to 17 months (95% CI, 1.44 to 1.68). Vestergaard’s results are based on 973 febrile seizures within two weeks of MMR vaccination, a robust database containing about 18,000 febrile seizures, and a nonvaccinated control group of about 98,000 children. Applying the 1 in 640 risk of febrile seizure to the 3.64 million U.S. children (91% vaccination rate applied to 4 million children[6]) vaccinated with MMR every year results in about 5,700 annual MMR-related seizures.

Measles surveillance in the 1980s and 1990s revealed that there are 3 to 3.5 times more measles seizures than measles deaths.[5] Therefore, because the measles case-fatality rate is 1 in 10,000, the seizure rate from measles is 3 to 3.5 in 10,000 (mean 1 in 3,100). Although 1.56 MMR-related febrile seizures in 1,000 (about 1 in 640) is a small risk, it is five-fold higher than the 1 in 3,100 risk of seizures from measles.[5] In addition, a significant portion of febrile seizures have permanent sequelae. A large 2007 epidemiological study found that 5% of febrile seizures result in epilepsy.[7]”
https://www.bmj.com/content/359/bmj.j5104/rr-13
 
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Sano said:
This is stupid. The only reason why polio has been almost entirely eradicated is because of vaccines. We're talking a few dozen or so cases of vaccine derived polio on a continent of over a billion people. With that said, it's something that should be taken seriously if not only to prevent it from becoming a problem. Polio cases caused by the vaccine comes from the oral kind called OPV2, which was pulled in most of the world in 2016. They are developing a new kind of oral vaccine which should eliminate the risk.

Polio used to kill thousands and paralyze tens of thousands a year in the US alone. The vaccine outroll is responsible for ending that. Have whatever gripe you will with the covid vaccines, valid or not, but don't attempt to cast aspersion on the polio vaccines by using their effectiveness against them.
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Ever consider that polio was nearly eradicated because it was generally poorly defined prior to 1955 and over-diagnosed (often noted to be “flu-like symptoms”) and/or possibly because the diagnosis was made much more stringent after 1955 (literally the same year the vaccine was introduced)?

“The original diagnostic criteria for polio came from the World Health Organization and included:

“Signs and symptoms of nonparalytic poliomyelitis with the addition of partial or complete paralysis of one or more muscle groups, detected on two examinations at least 24 hours apart.”

It changed in 1955 to include residual paralysis 10 to 20 days after onset of illness and again 50 to 70 days after onset.”

https://vaxopedia.org/2018/07/25/th...ecause-they-changed-the-way-it-was-diagnosed/

After this diagnostic change was made, ~99% of cases would be eliminated because nearly all polio cases resolve on their own.

“Non-paralytic aseptic meningitis occurs in 1% to 5% of polio infections in children. The clinical presentation includes stiffness of the neck, back, or legs, usually following several days of a prodrome similar to that of minor illness. Increased or abnormal sensations (e.g., pain in the limbs, back, or neck), headache, and vomiting can also occur. Typically, symptoms last 2 to 10 days and are followed by complete recovery.

Less than 1% of all polio infections in children result in flaccid paralysis.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/polio.html
 
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PhitePhan said:
Ever consider that polio was nearly eradicated because it was generally poorly defined prior to 1955 and over-diagnosed (often noted to be “flu-like symptoms”) and/or possibly because the diagnosis was made much more stringent after 1955 (literally the same year the vaccine was introduced)?

“The original diagnostic criteria for polio came from the World Health Organization and included:

“Signs and symptoms of nonparalytic poliomyelitis with the addition of partial or complete paralysis of one or more muscle groups, detected on two examinations at least 24 hours apart.”

It changed in 1955 to include residual paralysis 10 to 20 days after onset of illness and again 50 to 70 days after onset.”

https://vaxopedia.org/2018/07/25/th...ecause-they-changed-the-way-it-was-diagnosed/

After this diagnostic change was made, ~99% of cases would be eliminated because nearly all polio cases resolve on their own.

“Non-paralytic aseptic meningitis occurs in 1% to 5% of polio infections in children. The clinical presentation includes stiffness of the neck, back, or legs, usually following several days of a prodrome similar to that of minor illness. Increased or abnormal sensations (e.g., pain in the limbs, back, or neck), headache, and vomiting can also occur. Typically, symptoms last 2 to 10 days and are followed by complete recovery.

Less than 1% of all polio infections in children result in flaccid paralysis.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/polio.html
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Sigh... Do we really need to go through all this?

Your own link is a website debunking the claim that polio was eradicated because of changing definitions. Did you read it? It's crazy how everything has to be this giant conspiracy. Polio needed to be more accurately diagnosed as a means to prevent spread, as children still sheds the vira in their stool and can spread it weeks afterwards. It was adjacent to combatting the endemic.

Polio cases saw a gradual but sharp decline after the vaccine was introduced and wasn't eliminated in the US before the late 1970's. Per your own link:
polio-report-1960s.jpg


And from your second link:

"The incidence dramatically decreased after the introduction of inactivated polio vaccine (IPV) in 1955 and continued to decline following oral polio vaccine (OPV) introduction in 1961. From the more than 21,000 paralytic cases reported in 1952, only 2,525 cases were reported in 1960 and 61 cases in 1965."

What's more important is, we were talking about paralytic cases as is highlighted above, which isn't just a cough or a sore throat. It doesn't matter that "only" 1% of all polio infections results in paralytic polio, as polio is highly contagious. Outbreak saw near entire cities infected during certain outbreaks. In 1952 for example, there were 21.000 cases of paralytic polio, which means we can assume that at least 2.210.000 were infected that year alone given that many probably weren't diagnosed. But polio had been a devastating disease hundreds of years before that.

From your second link, fatality rates for paralytic polio is also very high: "The case fatality ratio for paralytic polio is generally 2% to 5% among children and up to 15% to 30% among adolescents and adults. It increases to 25% to 75% with bulbar involvement."

So, considering that paralytic polio as well as deaths decreased after vaccine administration over the next few decades from tens of thousands to zero, which would have nothing to do with the diagnostic criteria changes, as well as the science of how the vaccine works, it's pretty much irrefutable that polio was eradicated because of the vaccines.
 
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badascan said:
but we got rid of the old flu, that's a positive...

just get your vaccines boosted and watch tv... and remember, if you die from a heart attack it's probably because of the heat or excitement or loneliness or gout or naps or cold showers or you know, all these things that now give otherwise healthy people heart attacks...
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When did we ever get rid of the "old flu"?
 
Wow. Funny how posts have a habit of just disappearing when it comes to some people. Too bad that's not all that would disappear.
 
Sano said:
Sigh... Do we really need to go through all this?

Your own link is a website debunking the claim that polio was eradicated because of changing definitions. Did you read it? It's crazy how everything has to be this giant conspiracy. Polio needed to be more accurately diagnosed as a means to prevent spread, as children still sheds the vira in their stool and can spread it weeks afterwards. It was adjacent to combatting the endemic.
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Who is claiming a giant conspiracy and what is your point in painting well-accepted and documented history as such?

The website “debunking” the claim does no such thing, and I used it exactly because it is a provax source that shows that exactly the same year the vaccine was introduced the diagnostic criteria was made MUCH more stringent… your and the author’s obfuscation is not a “debunking,” and claiming that polio needed to be “more accurately diagnosed” is a non-sequiter, as if it DIDN’T need to be “accurately diagnosed” before?

The fact is, a whole host of conditions prior to 1955 that were diagnosed as “polio” were thereafter diagnosed as other conditions when the new more stringent criteria (developed the exact same year as the vaccine) was no longer met. Do you dispute this fact?

You can’t acknowledge the impact that changing the diagnosis has on decreasing incidence for some reason, thats weird and tells me you are too emotionally invested in the official narrative to have a productive conversation.

For the record, I’m not saying vaccines had NOTHING to do with a decrease, can you at least admit that the changes to diagnostic criteria guaranteed a significant decrease in cases (including paralytic) regardless of the vaccine?
 
PhitePhan said:
Ever consider that polio was nearly eradicated because it was generally poorly defined prior to 1955 and over-diagnosed (often noted to be “flu-like symptoms”) and/or possibly because the diagnosis was made much more stringent after 1955 (literally the same year the vaccine was introduced)?

“The original diagnostic criteria for polio came from the World Health Organization and included:

“Signs and symptoms of nonparalytic poliomyelitis with the addition of partial or complete paralysis of one or more muscle groups, detected on two examinations at least 24 hours apart.”

It changed in 1955 to include residual paralysis 10 to 20 days after onset of illness and again 50 to 70 days after onset.”

https://vaxopedia.org/2018/07/25/th...ecause-they-changed-the-way-it-was-diagnosed/

After this diagnostic change was made, ~99% of cases would be eliminated because nearly all polio cases resolve on their own.

“Non-paralytic aseptic meningitis occurs in 1% to 5% of polio infections in children. The clinical presentation includes stiffness of the neck, back, or legs, usually following several days of a prodrome similar to that of minor illness. Increased or abnormal sensations (e.g., pain in the limbs, back, or neck), headache, and vomiting can also occur. Typically, symptoms last 2 to 10 days and are followed by complete recovery.

Less than 1% of all polio infections in children result in flaccid paralysis.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/polio.html
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Ever known anyone who had Polio?
 
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