No more Mattis soon.

[VivaRevolution]

you mean "was" in the concept that he was subject to it 5 years ago right? he hasnt been in the military for a long time.



wait, do you think the SECDEF is under the UCMJ?

You know what? You are completely right, and I am completely wrong. I have no issue with Mattis criticizing this, or resigning.

Who says education doesn't change anyone's mind on anything?

Thank you.

 

[VivaRevolution]

I think it was always seeing him in uniform that confused me.

 

[Fluffernutter]

Brett McGurk is gone too.

 

[VivaRevolution]

Wonder if this was the plan all along

I don't know what I would do if Trump resurrects the east india trading company and marauding private armies.

That could not make it any clearer to me and my tin-foil hat, who Trump is beholden to.

 

[VivaRevolution]

I don't understand how this is even up for debate.

I do. What is the alternative to leaving Iraq?

What was going to change, so that the second we leave, Sunnis don't welcome their Wahhabi friends?

 

[My Spot]

To be fair, you could be mumbling to a rotten banana while wearing a plastic sack shirt and still think you're winning......

 

[My Spot]

You don't like Mattis?

He's overrated. Don't like how he abandoned those Green Berets in Afghanistan and his shitty treatment of Joe Dowdy during OIF.

 

[MicroBrew]

Bolton's dumb ass has been itching to bomb Iran and China since the Bush II administration

Bolton is rabid !
He needs to be committed to an asylum.

 

[MiniCraque]

Oh Christ

Syria has 3 countries fighting ISIS. We have done nothing but get in the way. Shit, we fucking were arming these radicals

The Taliban are fighting ISIS

The fact you keep comparing these 2 wars to Iraq is nuts

You were talking about Iran, not Syria. My post was addressing an hypothetical occupation of Iran, and then you switched back around to Syria. How long is your attention span, 2 minutes?

As for Syria, the reason Mattis (and every other adult in the room, however few of those are left) was against bailing out was because of previous commitments to allies in Israel and Turkey. Same principle applies: maybe going in wasn't the best choice but, once in, it'd be better to think things through before declaring victory (a lie) and going home.

But this is a far more complicated topic and I realize that the nebulous concept of fostering alliances and not sticking your middle finger to everyone for no reason somehow escapes the limited grasp of Trumptards.

 

[Mike Hagger]

He's overrated. Don't like how he abandoned those Green Berets in Afghanistan and his shitty treatment of Joe Dowdy during OIF.

Fair enough, I like what he has done as Sec Def - canceling some of the PC things, his resistance to certain programs and plans initiated during the Obama years. I suppose my overall research into the man has been limited though, mostly based on his stratosphere decisions and reputation.

 

[Ophydian]

Absolutely. You shouldn't go in, but if you do, then you shouldn't just gtfo and leave a total mess behind.

Has Iraq and the creation of ISIS not taught any lessons?

I’d add to this has Afghanistan and the creation of the Taliban not taught us a lesson.

 

[Grenz]

There's two types of people in this world.. those who appeal to authority(grenz) and those who think for themselves(not grenz).

Or the type who believes stars are angels (TCK) and moonlight is deadly (TCK), and those who don’t (rational people).

But please go on, your posting volume has been a bit low as of late, at this rate you might not even win worst poster in the WR in next year’s election (again).

 

[VivaRevolution]

You were talking about Iran, not Syria. My post was addressing an hypothetical occupation of Iran, and then you switched back around to Syria. How long is your attention span, 2 minutes?

As for Syria, the reason Mattis (and every other adult in the room, however few of those are left) was against bailing out was because of previous commitments to allies in Israel and Turkey. Same principle applies: maybe going in wasn't the best choice but, once in, it'd be better to think things through before declaring victory (a lie) and going home.

But this is a far more complicated topic and I realize that the nebulous concept of fostering alliances and not sticking your middle finger to everyone for no reason somehow escapes the limited grasp of Trumptards.

Hold up. This is an absurd statement. Turkey was literally threatening to attack US troops in Syria.

If US interests and the status quo/world order is your concern, then keeping Turkey as an ally at any cost should be your number 1 concern.

I don't think most people have a grasp of what a disaster it would be if Turkey aligned with Iran, or Russia, or China. If any of those things happen, we better go isolationist the following day, because the world will go to hell in a hand basket, right quick. It would be a shift in world power not seen since WWII.

 

[Farmer Br0wn]

People seem to forget that President Trump and Mattis have two different jobs.

Mattis's advice was likely very good in the context of the narrow scope of his job. At the same time, his advice at this time may not be very helpful in the much wider scope of President Trump's job.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

I don’t understand how everyone isn’t against this. Yet again we have troops on the ground, inside a sovereign country, uninvited, in opposition to that government, and likely in opposition to the people of that country.

Some Americans are okay with that for no other reason than Trump opposes it and Mattis supports it?

How would they feel if another country put their troops on American soil? Pretty sure that is an act of war.

Not only that, but remember that Obama was going to go to Congress (because England's Parliament voted against intervention) but couldn't get the votes.... so he went in anyhow. You cannot win with these people.

They shit on the GOP (rightfully so) when they keep a vote on ending our support of KSA in the Yemen debacle -- an attempt at Congress reigning in the President's ability to wage perpetual war willy nilly, and then they shit on Trump when he announces he'll end our illegal intervention in Yemen, and our wasted time and treasure in Afghanistan. Imagine the mental gymnastics involved in pretending leaving fucking Afghanistan is some horrific FP disaster waiting to happen.

Its really disgusting to see how either side will support a war if their team is the one conducting it. Of course this has been clear since Obama got elected. I say Obama and not W, because at least W had 911 to build his propaganda around. Obama ran against that administration's FP, but wound up doubling down on it and instantly converted most of the peace movement into a bunch of drooling cultists.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

I don't understand how this is even up for debate.

Afghanistan and Syria were messes before we got involved in either country.

 

[LangfordBarrow]

Further proof you know fuck all about Mattis.

If Mattis were a dram queen he'd have resigned 6 months into the job when Trump was already not listening to him.

We leave Syria after all we've done to help turn it into a shithole and we'll just have another ISIS... only in Syria instead of Iraq.

Maybe not but it will be Russia and Iran holding sway in that region.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

Maybe not but it will be Russia and Iran holding sway in that region.

Russia always held sway in Syria and Iran owned Iraq as soon as we toppled Saddam. Time to recognize the consequences of our actions and move on. We've spent over $6,000,000,000, wait for it - 000, killed over 1,000,000 innocent people, and caused incalculable damage on the region and the world while our infrastructure and moral at home has disintegrated. Time to fold this hand, its a loser.

 

[M3t4tr0n]

No, but that is how the system works. Trump is the commander and chief. Perhaps folks that have never been in the military don't understand the significance of that, but just to try to help you understand, command structure is everything in any military. Believe it or not, you are expected to follow stupid orders without question.

Mattis should be ashamed of himself.

So just be happy following the idiot who doesn't know what he is doing while criticizing the guy who knows more?

 

[LangfordBarrow]

It would. If Putin wants to deal with all the problems in Syria, let him.

Being a global power doesn't mean that you have enough nukes to destroy the world. It's called diplomacy.