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NFL Discussion: Full Retard

Who shit the bed more?

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FLYOVER BOSSMAN said:
I take both of your points and agree with the first completely.

In the case of the 2018 playoffs, I put some of that on Reid not firing Sutton after the 2017 collapse against the Titans. That was two years in a row (2016 against the Steelers) that the team got completely steamrolled by the run in the playoffs and had no answer for it. And also remember that they were up 38-10 at one point against the Colts in the 2013 playoffs! There were a ton of people calling for Sutton's job after 2017- he absolutely refused to make adjustments to his scheme or scheme specifically for an opponent. It was unbelievable. You could have HoF talent at every position and if the offense knows what your assignments are they're going to be able to impose their will. I guess Andy didn't want to bring in so much change for Mahomes' first year as a starter, but loyalty to friends even when they're underperforming is something that Reid has had trouble with.
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Before 2018 IMO Chiefs and Reid never had the right horses for Reid's system, his best players usually were defensive or runners. Even in 2017 Hill was basically a baby. Alex Smith really limited what they could do. While Tennessee was lucky to win, Indy in 2013 had the better offense. Even in Philly where he had McNabb outside of TO and DeShuan Jackson one year each never had the players that fit Reid's strategy. Bowe was pretty much done by the time Reid got there and Gonzalez was gone. Westbrook, Dawkins, Alex Smith, Jaamarl Charles these were the sorts of guys whose talents didn't really fit with Reid's strength. When your best players are running backs and on defense that system isn't utilizing your talent properly.

Every time Reid got to the NFC championship game he lost his opponents were simply better at what he did. Rams had Bruce and Holt, Panthers had Smith and Muhammad, Bucs had Kewashan Johnson and McCardell(and the better defense obv). Cardinals had Fitzgerald and Boldin. At least half those guys are/going to be Hall of Famers and the rest were perennial pro bowlers. Reid was never going to win a shootout with any of those offenses. Remember in 2008 when Eagles were pretty close to winning and the Cardinals did what the Chiefs did this playoffs cause the game Reid wanted to play was one the Cards were better at.

What's really ironic other hand those mid to late 2000s Chiefs would have been a great fit with Reid. So would the Eagles roster Chip Kelly had after Reid left. He was just always in the wrong place at the wrong time before he got Mahomes, Kelce and Hill.
 
ferrisjso said:
Before 2018 IMO Chiefs and Reid never had the right horses for Reid's system, his best players usually were defensive or runners. Even in 2017 Hill was basically a baby. Alex Smith really limited what they could do. While Tennessee was lucky to win, Indy in 2013 had the better offense. Even in Philly where he had McNabb outside of TO and DeShuan Jackson one year each never had the players that fit Reid's strategy. Bowe was pretty much done by the time Reid got there and Gonzalez was gone. Westbrook, Dawkins, Alex Smith, Jaamarl Charles these were the sorts of guys whose talents didn't really fit with Reid's strength. When your best players are running backs and on defense that system isn't utilizing your talent properly.

Every time Reid got to the NFC championship game he lost his opponents were simply better at what he did. Rams had Bruce and Holt, Panthers had Smith and Muhammad, Bucs had Kewashan Johnson and McCardell(and the better defense obv). Cardinals had Fitzgerald and Boldin. At least half those guys are/going to be Hall of Famers and the rest were perennial pro bowlers. Reid was never going to win a shootout with any of those offenses. Remember in 2008 when Eagles were pretty close to winning and the Cardinals did what the Chiefs did this playoffs cause the game Reid wanted to play was one the Cards were better at.

What's really ironic other hand those mid to late 2000s Chiefs would have been a great fit with Reid. So would the Eagles roster Chip Kelly had after Reid left. He was just always in the wrong place at the wrong time before he got Mahomes, Kelce and Hill.
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Care to elaborate a little?
 
Poon Goon said:
Care to elaborate a little?
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Did I forget someone?

Saying his best players would have tended to be better in a conservative running and defense system. These last few years are the first time where his best players are ones whose talent his system highlights. For example in 2007 Westbrook a running back caught 90 usually well over 50 because their receiving core was suspect. Westbrook only ran for 1,000 yards twice despite averaging 4.6 a carry because running the ball wasn't a priority. In the years the Eagles were making those conference title games he wasn't even getting 200 carries and even later on only passed 250 once. In 03 and 04 for example he was doing 5.2 and 4.6 a carry but didn't get 200 carries despite being McNabb's best weapon by far when TO wasnt there.

You see this to a lesser extent with Jaamarl Charles in KC, guys averaging 5 a carry, 259 and 206 carries. In 2013 Charles caught 70 passes(more than Bowe) and had more receiving yards too, Bowe started 15 games not like he was hurt or something. Seemed if his most talented skill player was a running back Reid tried to make them as much of a pass catcher as possible.
 


Imagine being in literally any scenario and knowing you’re the best athlete in that room.

Julio is the next step in human evolution.
 
ferrisjso said:
Did I forget someone?

Saying his best players would have tended to be better in a conservative running and defense system. These last few years are the first time where his best players are ones whose talent his system highlights. For example in 2007 Westbrook a running back caught 90 usually well over 50 because their receiving core was suspect. Westbrook only ran for 1,000 yards twice despite averaging 4.6 a carry because running the ball wasn't a priority. In the years the Eagles were making those conference title games he wasn't even getting 200 carries and even later on only passed 250 once. In 03 and 04 for example he was doing 5.2 and 4.6 a carry but didn't get 200 carries despite being McNabb's best weapon by far when TO wasnt there.

You see this to a lesser extent with Jaamarl Charles in KC, guys averaging 5 a carry, 259 and 206 carries. In 2013 Charles caught 70 passes(more than Bowe) and had more receiving yards too, Bowe started 15 games not like he was hurt or something. Seemed if his most talented skill player was a running back Reid tried to make them as much of a pass catcher as possible.
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Lmao you fucking moron. Ain’t nobody ready a second wall of text
 
ferrisjso said:
Before 2018 IMO Chiefs and Reid never had the right horses for Reid's system, his best players usually were defensive or runners. Even in 2017 Hill was basically a baby. Alex Smith really limited what they could do.

What's really ironic other hand those mid to late 2000s Chiefs would have been a great fit with Reid. So would the Eagles roster Chip Kelly had after Reid left. He was just always in the wrong place at the wrong time before he got Mahomes, Kelce and Hill.
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I don't think this is too far off. If you're running a west coast offense, you need receivers that are good players and the best receiving performance from a Chief WR in Reid's era before Tyreek Hill was Jeremy Maclin's 2015 season. Like you mentioned, Dwayne Bowe was done by the time Reid got to KC, Maclin fell off a cliff in 2016, and it took Tyreek Hill's transition to primarily work as a WR in 2017 to be able to open up Reid's scheme.

And Reid personally picked Alex Smith to come to KC and they eventually gave him a contract extension. Like...some of that is pride on Reid's part. "Oh, I can get a smart, game manager QB and if they limit their mistakes then we're going to be a playoff/SB contender no matter what the talent level on offense is or how the defense plays". That's not good enough. Glad things turned around.
 
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-Magua- said:
I watched that earlier today and loved it. Gonna miss Sammy since he most likely heading out.

Dude Goes Awol/Witsec for most of season, then balls out with Stud/Clutch catches post season and shows worth. I like Sammy, as he just comes off as a chill/affable dude.
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Sammy was money in the yoffs. I'd love it if he would stay for a little less money but I don't blame him wanting to get paid.
 
FLYOVER BOSSMAN said:
I don't think this is too far off. If you're running a west coast offense, you need receivers that are good players and the best receiving performance from a Chief WR in Reid's era before Tyreek Hill was Jeremy Maclin's 2016 season. Like you mentioned, Dwayne Bowe was done by the time Reid got to KC, Maclin fell off a cliff in 2016, and it took Tyreek Hill's transition to be primarily work as a WR in 2017 to be able to open up Reid's scheme.

And Reid personally picked Alex Smith to come to KC and they eventually gave him a contract extension. Like...some of that is pride on Reid's part. "Oh, I can get a smart, game manager QB and if they limit their mistakes then we're going to be a playoff/SB contender no matter the talent level on offense or the defense plays". That's not good enough. Glad things turned around.
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Well Alex Smith stats certainly benefited cause while a game manager is better suited to hand it off, he's still the one throwing. It's not like a running back where he was going to be used less. And Alex not being a gunslinger cut down on turnovers. In 2018 Alex Smith threw only 5 picks. And a QB who can manage the game is useful in a fast pace system, issue is Smith's limitations meant he couldn't really take full advantage. But Mahomes is still great at managing the game while still having a cannon, usually those 2 things don't come together. It's possible Alex deserves some of the credit for that since he supposedly did a really good job mentoring Mahomes so it worked out.
 


Congrats to my friend, GOATsay
 
FLYOVER BOSSMAN said:
I don't think this is too far off. If you're running a west coast offense, you need receivers that are good players and the best receiving performance from a Chief WR in Reid's era before Tyreek Hill was Jeremy Maclin's 2015 season. Like you mentioned, Dwayne Bowe was done by the time Reid got to KC, Maclin fell off a cliff in 2016, and it took Tyreek Hill's transition to primarily work as a WR in 2017 to be able to open up Reid's scheme.

And Reid personally picked Alex Smith to come to KC and they eventually gave him a contract extension. Like...some of that is pride on Reid's part. "Oh, I can get a smart, game manager QB and if they limit their mistakes then we're going to be a playoff/SB contender no matter what the talent level on offense is or how the defense plays". That's not good enough. Glad things turned around.
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You need good route runners and blockers.
 
85009994_113164140250988_8662988717234847744_n.jpg
 
Dizzy said:


Imagine being in literally any scenario and knowing you’re the best athlete in that room.

Julio is the next step in human evolution.
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lol @ that Buccaneer near the end. He's like, who the fuck is that catching up to me? OH SHIT IT'S JULIO!
 
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