Newaza with BJJ experience

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by EE6_TBOIO_MATb, Mar 21, 2008.

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  1. EE6_TBOIO_MATb

    EE6_TBOIO_MATb Blue Belt

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    Hey,

    I'm cross-training a lot of stuff, among which BJJ and Judo.

    I'm not good at BJJ, but enough to give the judo blackstrouble while Newaza.

    They seem to be looking for subs way less than positioning, and I have the feeling that they're not used to getting subbed while they're pinning the opponent.

    It's just a different approach, it seems...

    Anyways I'll play by theirrules, and avoid the temptation of subbing blackbelts, since I don't want to get my face smashed on the floor while standing-up sparring...:icon_conf

    Is that normal for Newaza ? Or is it just the culture of my judo club ?
     
  2. Deloitte

    Deloitte Blue Belt

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    That's because they can't get subbed whiel they are going for the pin, pins are when they are in side control.

    Yea typically they are looking for the submission before they get stood up. Newaza in judo is boring as hell. If you pass them they will turtle up hard, and judo turtles are insanely defensive. I wouldn't be surprised if you gave blacks trouble. They aren't really that good.
     
  3. PSJJJJ

    PSJJJJ Guest

    That really depends on the BB. I've rolled with some weak ones, and I've rolled with some who've embarassed me so badly I wouldn't wish it on anyone.
     
  4. Deloitte

    Deloitte Blue Belt

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    I've rolled with some solid BB's that regularly place in national tournaments. Seriously they just don't focus enough on it.
     
  5. Delbjj

    Delbjj Green Belt

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    This whole topic on how Judo black belts suck on the ground except for 2 guys in the country is retarded.

    I hold ranks in both and can say that i have learned alot on the ground from both styles. Pins and escapes in Judo are very high level, and even the basics are highly effective at any level, against grapplers from any style.
     
  6. Mr. Switch

    Mr. Switch TALLY HO!

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    ...here we go again...

    Allow me to sum this whole thing up:

    BJJ good for ground
    Judo good for standing

    Here is where the opinions fly in:
    Some Judo guys are good on the ground.
    No one who does BJJ seems to care care about being good standing from just training BJJ- that's what cross training's for.
    Some Judo guys are DESPARATE to blurt out that some Newazza specialists could make Roger Gracie cry.

    ... and still I can't seem to care about this whole argument (not that my opinion is the be all and end all but I don't think I'm the ONLY one).

    /thread
     
  7. EE6_TBOIO_MATb

    EE6_TBOIO_MATb Blue Belt

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    To the attention of these 2 last guys who don't like my thread:

    1) don't feel obligated to post
    2) this is in no way the useless Judo Vs BJJ thread that u're trying to turn this into
     
  8. Delbjj

    Delbjj Green Belt

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    Then what exaclty was it?

    Your way of saying that you beat Judo Black Belts?
     
  9. EE6_TBOIO_MATb

    EE6_TBOIO_MATb Blue Belt

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    Nice try, but no.

    Just seeking confirmation that the focus is not the same. U're being a dick
     
  10. NPNL

    NPNL Banned Banned

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    It depends on what kind of club you go to, if it's purely tournament... they're probably not going to give a rats ass about submissions. They'd rather get osaekomi and wait it out.
     
  11. Delbjj

    Delbjj Green Belt

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    So your not trying to start a thread that has been done 24934 times, your looking for a pat on the back and confirmation....

    Good job, they have a different focus, you are the man.
     
  12. EE6_TBOIO_MATb

    EE6_TBOIO_MATb Blue Belt

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    Yeah they're pretty involved in competitions.
    So why do they do that ? Cause it's less risky to keep someone pinned ?
     
  13. PSJJJJ

    PSJJJJ Guest

    Yes.

    If you keep someone in a tight Osekomi it's an easy way to rack up points or get Ippon. If you start attempting subs without great success the ref will call matte and stand you up.

    Yoko Sankaku Jime ftw!!!
     
  14. NPNL

    NPNL Banned Banned

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    That, and it's relatively easier to hold position. My Judo club had more of a Kosen influence, which meant we were doing nearly as much ground work as my current BJJ gym does.
     
  15. Acexwanderer

    Acexwanderer Blue Belt

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    I sort of have the same experience as you, it seems they dont have the BJJ fundamentals but rather rely on speed and strength to try and get by rather than solving problems and being technical.

    I always hear Judokas say how BJJ sucks in stand up and some people say that BJJ is as good on the ground as Judokas are standing up, but then as mentioned in this thread you will hear a Judoka say that some Judokas are just as good as BJJers on the ground.

    Seems arrogant of Judo guys to say that without saying that there are some BJJ guys who are just as good as some Judokas standing up.
     
  16. gracie_barra**

    gracie_barra** Purple Belt

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    nothing is more annoying than ignorant judo guys who claim judo is just as good as bjj on the ground. bjj guys are more than ready to admit that we aren't as good standing (nowhere even close), why can't they just use common sense and see that they're just not as good on the ground, period. no matter how much your school spends on newaza, theres just no way you will have as good ground game as the top bjj academies. and theres no way the top bjj schools have the as same standup as the olympic judo guys.
     
  17. Happy Boy

    Happy Boy Silver Belt

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    The best exponents exponents of each discipline would destroy the other in crossover comps with their own rules, so Rickson Gracie wouldnt last 10 seconds on a judo olympic mat, and Inoue would probably have a similar result if he entered the BJJ world champs.

    Down the scale however there is space for comparison, and its my experience that a judoka is better on the ground than a BJJ'er is on the feet.

    Flame away, but thats what I personally experienced. Every judo black belt Ive trained with is solid on the ground, not special or even dangerous, but has basic fundamentals and can do most things to some level of competency, whereas the best BJJ'ers Ive seen dont have the same in comparison on the feet and usually have next to nothing on the feet other than pulling guard with a pretend tomoe-nage and a couple of basic throws and wrestling takedowns.
     
  18. radman

    radman Purple Belt

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    Funny, I always have a hard time with Judo BB with good BJJ training during Newaza at Oishi Judo. But with the rest of the Judoka's with limited or no BJJ training, I can get a little creative!:icon_chee
     
  19. IronCage**

    IronCage** Banned Banned

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    I cross train between both BJJ and Judo. I am a blue belt in BJJ and Orange belt in Judo. I have tapped out 3 Judo black belts in my Judo school. One of them was my own Judo instructor. The next day I got tapped by an advanced white belt in my BJJ school :redface:

    If grappling was like phones, Judo Newaza would be a rotary phone and BJJ ground game would be the iPhone.
     
  20. Commissar

    Commissar Gold Belt

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    I think it's safe to assume that guys like Roger Gracie and Ricardo Arona are better groundfighters than any judoka in the world. If not, then I can't imagine why they aren't winning ADCC.

    As far as throws go, in general, judokas > BJJ. End of thread.
     
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