Media MMA Che: The Problem With Muay Thai in MMA.

tramendous said:
Jon jones
Alex pereira
Adesanya
Leon edwards
Aldo

These are just some of the fighters whos striking style has been closer to muay thai than boxing. Boxing just synergizes better with wrestling and lots of American fighters know wrestling so they add in boxing. The bjj guys who arent afraid of getting taken down, do more muay thai in their striking.
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I'll give you Perreira and Aldo, but Leon and Adesanya don't resemble Muay Thai fighters much to my eye - they are snipers moving on the outside, looking for the opening. There is a lot more kickboxing in them and you can see the tma karate connection in how they move in and out, chamber their kicks etc. this is also why their fights can get boring at times, which would never happen with Aldo or Perreira.

Jon Jones is the master of putting everything together (his only "weakness" is the boxing), but he doesn't really fight like a Muay Thai guy either.
 
ILove4MinutesHyuna said:
How do elite kick boxer fair vs Thai fighters now days? I remember hearing Rogan talk about how in the early days the Thai's used to fuck up kick boxers with leg kicks.
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It depends on the rule set. Clinch makes the biggest difference.

Your example of Thais beating kickboxers with leg kick only holds true for American kickboxers. American long pants kickboxing is a different animal vs k1 kickboxing
 
avenue94 said:
I'm down to see as much top level talent filter into mma. It's why most of us got into the sport in the first place, to see different specialists adapt to the mixed rule set.
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Yeah man, but then we don't get to see a fair match up between the striking styles in MMA. Isn't that what we're talking about here?
 
Agree.
I started my martial road with boxing, at 12. And I keep it until my 16's.
I moved to another city, and for many reasons I couldn't keep my training.
But I keep doing my RoadWork, polishing my punches(specially the jab), push ups, abs and etc, I even bought a sandbag to keep punching.

So at 23 I started muay thai, and tbh I really struggled with the stance, cause I've already used to the boxing stance during all my life.

I'm short guy, like 5'3, so I've always used to dodge punches with head movement until i can enter in pocket range.
My master always said, its OK have some head movement, but in MT I shouldn't rely that much in it. cause the stance dont allow the most fluid movement, and it leaves you too much open to flying knees and head kicks too.

Now 5 years later I'm much more used to MT, but due to my range, I still need to be in pocket.
Sometimes I struggle to close distance, but once I get in, my background in boxing really helps me a lot.
I feel like my boxing is above most of people here, even some veterans. (Not saying I'm better fighter than them, but i think I'm better at boxing)
I think I have good 1-2's, body shots and uppercuts. I like to use a lot of knees to the body too.
we usually dont use elbows in sparring section, but i think I have good ones, specially in clinch breaks.

I have no idea how to stuff TD's (obviously I've already watched guys sprawling a thousand times in MMA, but I never drilled it)
 
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Vergilius said:
I'll give you Perreira and Aldo, but Leon and Adesanya don't resemble Muay Thai fighters much to my eye - they are snipers moving on the outside, looking for the opening. There is a lot more kickboxing in them and you can see the tma karate connection in how they move in and out, chamber their kicks etc. this is also why their fights can get boring at times, which would never happen with Aldo or Perreira.

Jon Jones is the master of putting everything together (his only "weakness" is the boxing), but he doesn't really fight like a Muay Thai guy either.
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Thats why i said closer to muay thai. Its not lumpinee stadium muay thai but mma muay thai. Kickboxing is basically muay thai without the clinch knees and elbows.
 
ILove4MinutesHyuna said:
How do elite kick boxer fair vs Thai fighters now days? I remember hearing Rogan talk about how in the early days the Thai's used to fuck up kick boxers with leg kicks.
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From my knowledge Thais still have a pretty big experience advantage over a lot of kickboxers and of course an advantage over kickboxers under full MT rules with MT scoring.

But you don’t see much above the waist kickboxing outside of the amateurs from my knowledge so kickboxers have more experience with leg kicks.
 
markantony20 said:
I mean that goes for anything in MMA no?
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To an extent yes, but there is a hierarchy of need. Boxing is the most superfluous, and in a one vs vs each style the boxer goes to the hospital vs MT, gets choked out by the BJJ and gets GnP by the wrestler. Its bottom of the food chain is all I am saying, but it has its place when the other arts are there yes.
 
ILove4MinutesHyuna said:
How do elite kick boxer fair vs Thai fighters now days? I remember hearing Rogan talk about how in the early days the Thai's used to fuck up kick boxers with leg kicks.
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Depends. They tend to trade victories a lot. Takeru just lost to Superlek but then a K-1 champ knocks out *insert random lumpinee champ here* in japan.
 
avenue94 said:
What about Barboza's style screams muay thai to you? If you dropped him into the Thai circuit, his style would stand out quite a bit for its oddity compared to what's usually seen in the sport.
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It's Brazilian Muay Thai. All your favorite Brazilian fighters train it.
 
KID Yamamoto said:
Depends. They tend to trade victories a lot. Takeru just lost to Superlek but then a K-1 champ knocks out *insert random lumpinee champ here* in japan.
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It’s the rule set. Other countries are competitive with Thais in kickboxing. In straight MT then it’s not competitive especially in the lighter weight classes. There is a huge gap in skill level when it comes to clinching. It is honestly not close.
 
Too bad Shara Bullet is at MW instead of LHW, him vs Khalil would be a great MT vs Lethwei fight.
 
NoSmilez said:
It’s the rule set. Other countries are competitive with Thais in kickboxing. In straight MT then it’s not competitive especially in the lighter weight classes. There is a huge gap in skill level when it comes to clinching. It is honestly not close.
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A Japanese kid in Nadaka is running through all the smaller champs in RWS too. Thais still run the 120s-130s but they lose to farang plenty of times.
 
It’s a truism to say any single style has a problem in MMA. Muay Thai is adopted to differing degrees by nearly all fighters. True MT stylists are rare in MMA because traditional MT is a very different sport in terms of culture, rules, expectations etc. just like BJJ comps are hugely different from MMA fights.

I think aspects of MT that are under-utilised are the high level clinch and elbow stuff, spike, and spear elbows etc. it’s nuts to see a guys throwing punching flurries against a shelled up opponent who’s hurt. One you get in that ranged elbows are so much more effective

There are also very few guys who use teeps for disruption with any frequency . It’s hard to catch a lead teep and hard to exploit a catch with someone who knows what they’re doing.

Finally, there will never be young Thais training in MMA unless it becomes part of their betting culture because apart from a few holidays that’s the main reasons fights are held.
 
World eater said:
Another thing to bear in mind is the use of kicks, especially mid kicks and high kicks. Most karate and kickboxing fighters will use fast kicks - rotate the standing leg, raise the kicking leg bent at the knee and whiplash with the lower part of the kicking leg. This allows the fighter to regain balance faster. Most MT fighters, on the other hand, rotate the standing leg and then swing full force the kicking leg like a scythe without blending the knee. This is a more powerful kick, but if it misses it rotates your body out of balance. In a MT fight it’s not as big a deal because they are crazy fast with repositioning, spinning backfists and elbows, but in an mma fight a good opponent could easily go for a TD. These kicks are probably MT’s strongest weapon, would be hard to “unlearn” this just to be better at mma.
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Did you just shove bitch ass karate in there to make a point ? Not so fast homie 🤣
 
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