Social MAGA 2025 Civil war incoming! Vivek Ramaswamy Betrays Base & reveals true colors, Says Americans SUCK !!

[Soggust]

What government is bailing out tech companies?

This is an ignorant take.

Tech is incredibly important to the success of America over the next 15 years. The VAST majority of H1-B holders are from India and China. We get their best and brightest working on American products. Take away H1-B and it not only hinders our ability to be successful, but makes India and China more successful.

America should be putting out a PSA immediately.

If you have a STEM degree Masters+ you can get a visa for 3 years with an accelerated path to citizenship.

Nah I simply don't agree that we are going to fail as a country if we don't outsource our best jobs to other countries.

It's especially tough for folks to buy the argument that we need more STEM workers from a guy whose net worth went up 200 fuckin billion in 2024 alone after cutting 14% of his workforce at Tesla, shitting on his employees publicly at Twitter and forcing RTO5 across the board.

You can’t “pay Americans more” to “lure them in”. The talent pool for limited positions is already scarce. Limiting the pool doesn’t make the pool more talented.

Sure you can. I don't believe that because certain positions are scarce that means we need to flood them with talent and drive their value down or else America will be too stupid to compete in the future.

I think America is big enough to find quality candidates. It's not that tech can't find quality candidates. It's that tech can't find quality candidates at the price they want to pay and the conditions they want to enforce.

Killing the H1-B is the stupidest low IQ take I’ve seen.

The issue is with illegal immigration ffs.

Not sure who suggested killing the program altogether

 

[Islam Imamate]

Couple of critiques from your statements above:

A. The hotel/motel thing was an example and yes it can be used for hotels/motels but I should have said the hospitality industry which is generally lower paying industry. It is my understanding that companies like Marriott and Hilton do use H1-B Visas just not the extent of other industries. Trump even admitted he uses H1-B Visas for his hospitality industries for what its worth.

Just because a company isn't centered around tech doesn't mean they don't have tech positions. Hotel chains will have websites and internal apps for instance. I would bet most H1-B workers don't work at a tech company despite working in a tech role.

15 years in tech and I've never worked with anyone that had positive thing to say about H1. I'm for legal immigration but the program needs regulation. Like for example if you lay American workers off you shouldn't be eligible to replace them with H1. We shouldn't be the type of country where the government to enact policies that make it harder for native born workers.

Why? If these H1-B workers are as bad as you say why can't someone else open up their own company that only hires American workers to outcompete them?

Imo let them hire foreigners so they can be more efficient, grow more, and thus contribute more in tax revenue which can then be spent on programs to help Americans.

 

[Darkavius]

Tech is incredibly important to the success of America over the next 15 years. The VAST majority of H1-B holders are from India and China. We get their best and brightest working on American products. Take away H1-B and it not only hinders our ability to be successful, but makes India and China more successful.

You can’t “pay Americans more” to “lure them in”. The talent pool for limited positions is already scarce. Limiting the pool doesn’t make the pool more talented.

America should be putting out a PSA immediately.

If you have a STEM degree Masters+ you can get a visa for 3 years with an accelerated path to citizenship.

Killing the H1-B is the stupidest low IQ take I’ve seen.

The issue is with illegal immigration ffs.

But the problem with your argument is Repubs and MAGA especially are very sensitive to immigration and it does not help that Musk is an immigrant. I tend to think more people in America would like to be trained for the STEM industries that go to H1-B holders, but with the cost of living and education costs it's not an option for many.

This is where the dilemma is in America. Repubs want to basically dismantle the Department of Education and the states are messing up the education system worse than it already is (looks at Oklahoma and Florida). Then at the same time corps are talking about we don't have enough qualified people. So do we actually want to train Americans to do the jobs needed or do we just want cheaper labor for corps?

 

[Mr Holmes]

Why? If these H1-B workers are as bad as you say why can't someone else open up their own company that only hires American workers to outcompete them?

Because the entire argument is we need them because there isn't enough native workers. We all know the Disney story, right?

 

[Islam Imamate]

Because the entire argument is we need them because their isn't enough native workers. We all know the Disney story, right?

Which is true, there aren't enough and so it's good that we allow foreigners to fill those vacancies.

 

[Mr Holmes]

Which is true, there aren't enough and so it's good that we allow foreigners to fill those vacancies.

Laying people off is the opposite of being short workers.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Laying people off is the opposite of being short workers.

That might not be why the company is laying them off, could be the company is performing poorly and had to contract. That's not evidence there isn't a wider shortage.

 

[Mr Holmes]

That might not be why the company is laying them off, could be the company is performing poorly and had to contract. That's not evidence there isn't a wider shortage.

Agree to disagree here. I don't think a company should be able to game the system like that.

 

[Rob Battisti]

But the problem with your argument is Repubs and MAGA especially are very sensitive to immigration and it does not help that Musk is an immigrant. I tend to think more people in America would like to be trained for the STEM industries that go to H1-B holders, but with the cost of living and education costs it's not an option for many.

This is where the dilemma is in America. Repubs want to basically dismantle the Department of Education and the states are messing up the education system worse than it already is (looks at Oklahoma and Florida). Then at the same time corps are talking about we don't have enough qualified people. So do we actually want to train Americans to do the jobs needed or do we just want cheaper labor for corps?

We need an immense push toward STEM for Americans. YUGE.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Agree to disagree here. I don't think a company should be able to game the system like that.

How is it gaming the system? They're hiring workers as they set fit.

It's tech bros like you trying to game the system by getting the government to enact barriers before your competition instead of outcompeting them fair and square.

 

[ChosenOne]

I invite you again to embrace being less stupid and understand they people that ran that poll and all the people that shared the results commenting on it probably know more than an imbecile on a karate forum derping about it being irrelevant because they're engineers.

According to you, our culture is lazy and dumb and can't produce good STEM talent. And yet Indian engineers embarrass themselves with their lack of ability to write basic programming logic. Our engineers sure as hell can do better than that. But of course you don't actually know what your talking about. You have no idea engineers and scientists write code to automate their analysis or to process data. You don't know the difference between facts and opinions. You're just regurgitating Musk like a complete tool.

What you cited was not a poll. It is magat fodder they feed to the most stupid magats knowing they will eat it up with a critical thought in their head.

95% of Doctors are not fit for surgery. So what. Again all they have to do is feed you out of context and incomplete blurbs and you eat it up because you are dumb.

Saying that 95% of engineers coming out of India cannot code or 95% of doctors cannot do surgery is in NO WAY an insult to the 5% who can and do, at top levels.

 

[Soggust]

That might not be why the company is laying them off, could be the company is performing poorly and had to contract. That's not evidence there isn't a wider shortage.

But certainly, there have to be SOME qualified candidates in the 80% of twitter employees that Elon laid off before needing to export jobs? Or the 10% of SpaceX and tesla employees this year?

Like, you're not wrong in that it's not definitive evidence of an employee shortage but imo the forest from the trees seems to be that American tech workers are underemployed and hurting from the last few years and the idea of the super wealthy outsourcing more jobs and competition is unappealing to many.

How is it gaming the system? They're hiring workers as they set fit.

It's tech bros like you trying to game the system by getting the government to enact barriers before your competition instead of outcompeting then fair and square.

Is your opinion that we should allow immigrants to compete in all sectors and all fields (and all economic brackets) or only for certain job types or shortages?

edit-my clarification was phrased worse than my initial question lol

I don't have a follow up. I'm just curious. Although I disagree with your position, I generally respect your consistency and think it's fair even if it's not my position.

 

[ChosenOne]

...

And if companies are struggling for talent, then I'm not sure I'm convinced it's the government's job to bail them out.

"Bail them out"????

WTF does that mean?

If a company wants to hire someone from another company why should big government get in the way? Let the market and competition decide and not BIG GOVERNMENT.

What you seem to want is protectionism. You think if BIG GOVT does not step in Americans will not be able to compete for the jobs and win the. You want DEI for Americans.

 

[Mr Holmes]

How is it gaming the system? They're hiring workers as they set fit.

It's tech bros like you trying to game the system by getting the government to enact barriers before your competition instead of outcompeting then fair and square.

I guess I could just as easily argue CEOs of tech companies are getting the government to remove barriers so they don't have to compete for workers by raising wages or improving work life balance.

 

[Islam Imamate]

We need an immense push toward STEM for Americans. YUGE.

Idk if I even agree with that. STEM workers get paid more and often way more so if that's not incentive enough then maybe Americans just don't want STEM jobs.

It's okay to play football in high school only to take over your dad's middle class business instead of becoming a STEM drone. A lot of Americans like becoming entrepreneurs not to make money but to have control over their work and for the convenience.

I will say that I've heard the argument that there are unnecessary barriers in the form of credentialism to breaking into medicine which if removed might attract more American students. Reforming that kind of thing I'm all for.

 

[Islam Imamate]

I guess I could just as easily argue CEOs of tech companies are getting the government to remove barriers so they don't have to compete for workers by raising wages or improving work life balance.

Sure but removing those barriers is a good thing, means more efficient labor markets.

What you're calling for is labor market protectionism and it's bad actually.

 

[Mr Holmes]

Sure but removing those barriers is a good thing, means more efficient labor markets.

What you're calling for is labor market protectionism and it's bad actually.

Nah, protecting american workers is actually a good thing.

 

[Soggust]

"Bail them out"????

WTF does that mean?

If a company wants to hire someone from another company why should big government get in the way? Let the market and competition decide and not BIG GOVERNMENT.

What you seem to want is protectionism. You think if BIG GOVT does not step in Americans will not be able to compete for the jobs and win the. You want DEI for Americans.

Sorry "bail them out" is admittedly bad phrasing because it suggests a financial bailout, which wasn't really what I was thinking.

I was thinking of bailing them out in the sense of increasing the amount of folks in the talent pool as opposed to making companies fight over limited talent.

But you're not wrong. That big guv dei is what I want.

Imo, if we want a consistent approach like you are suggesting, then we would allow all immigrants to get American jobs, regardless of sector or need. The American best will certainly rise, right?

If we are saying, "hey we are cool with some immigration, but let's only bring in who we need", then I think I'm generally in favor of favoring low-income jobs that are hard to fill and not giving away the best American jobs.

 

[ChosenOne]

I guess I could just as easily argue CEOs of tech companies are getting the government to remove barriers so they don't have to compete for workers by raising wages or improving work life balance.

the problem is you cannot argue it intelligently.

If the US workers are better they will compete without big govt saving them. A CEO, in these top tech industries will always hire the best and is not going to take discount workers doing second rate work to save a buck.

 

[ChosenOne]

Nah, protecting american workers is actually a good thing.

So Vivek and Elon were right and you admit.

The poor culture bad working Americans will just not be able to compete unless big govt steps in and creates barriers to protect them.

FLOLOLOL.