Krav Maga

[Aardvark]

Well, they're having a GSP seminar, so they can't be all bad. Their Kali is modeled after the dog bros (this isn't the place where sled dog trains ... is it?), which is always a good sign.

The final test is always to go there and take a class, see if you like the instructor, the other students, etc. But at face value, they seem to have a decent set of programs, reasonably "credentialed" instructors and are basically an MMA gym with TMAs taught alongside.

You might be able to do better, but I guarentee you on average you'll do a lot worse.

Definately try it out.

 

[zenshin]

I would try it, it seems pretty good. Like the previous person said you could do worse.

 

[zenshin]

check this out guys, real god quality Krav maga from Israel called Kapap. Maj. Avi Nardia the real deal, look at th clips

http://www.avinardia.com/home.html

 

[Sankaku]

Krav Maga is a modern day Joke thanks to the likes of John Whitman and Darrin Levine. Mr. Levine spent a total of 8 weeks in training before he received his Black belt and then decided to come to Ameria and trade mark the system and then not allowing the real Krav maga guys here in the states teach it without paying him a monthly fee. IT IS A JOKE!!!! TKD has more respct than KM

You really don't know what you are talking about. Stick to Tai-Bo.

 

[zenshin]

You really don't know what you are talking about. Stick to Tai-Bo.

Bro, trust me when i tell you that I really know what I am talking about, trust me on that. I have been doing thai boxing not thai-bo get it clear.

Mr Levine has not spent more than a couple of trips to Israel to get his BB, how do I know this, because I have been in contact with many individuals in Israel that Mr. Levine claimed to train under for and many that knows of his real background. exaples

Eli Akizar (RIP) before he died we spoke in detail when I was in Israel he values mr. Levine as a very good friend but not a tue KM man.
Itay Gil ( top yasam expert) real deal awesome grappler
Avi Nardia ( Yamam and Military Intelligence)
Haim Gidon ( 10 degree BB in KM Israel) he was there when they were doing thos certifications in Israel in he 70's, I do not like his version of KM but he does know who's who in KM community.
Roni Kluger ( ex Idf member) has his KM organization throughout eastern europe, trained and met him in Romania at a seminar

Not one could verify Darren levine as a true KM, only a real good business man!!!

I know you probably have alo of love for your certifcation from Darrin, but in Israel or europe any certified KMAA person can wipe there asses with there certification. JNo offense bro. I am not old guy, I just spent alot of time in Israel and europe and had the oppertunity to meet and larn from these individuals.

Look the KMAA is going after the person who awarded levine with his 3,4,6th degree BB ( in a 4 year span, doesn't make sense) Eyal Yanilov, I am not a fan of Eyal but he was Levine mentor supposedly.

sankaku tellme your experiance with KM please

 

[Matt Thornton]

<sigh> I swore I'd never post in another KM thread.

Alright, here's the concept nobody seems to understand.

Gun disarms, knife defense, etc. in a realistic martial art like Krav Maga are not intended so you can heroically beat up the bad guy and keep your wallet and look cool. Krav is a realistic system and they encourage defensive TACTICS as well such as giving the guy your wallet, or running when you have the chance.

I'm going to place you in a situation, and you tell me what you do.

You're in a bank, and all of a sudden, you hear "Get the *#$% down!" It's being robbed. People are getting down on the ground. One of the armed robbers, for some reason, targets you. He starts screaming at you to "Turn around." Or he might be telling you to put something on your head.

At this point, do you assume "Well, there's nothing I can do, he has a gun?" You do realize what he's doing, right? Any time an assailant is trying to make you turn around, cover your face, wear a mask, he's most likely planning on killing you. He's, in effect, trying to de-humanize you so it's easier to kill you. Think about it. What's easier, looking someone in the face and shooting them, or just firing at a human-shaped target?

This is where defensive tactics and systems like Krav Maga come in. If you do nothing, your chance of survival is 0%. Technically, by doing ANYTHING, you're improving your chances of survival. Systems like Krav Maga attempt to raise that chance as best they can. They don't claim to make you invincible, they don't claim a 90 pound woman can overcome a posse of 250 pound thugs, no.

Krav is not "Poke his eyes, bite him, here's your black belt." I was in Krav Maga for a while before I switched to MMA. Just my yellow belt test alone put me in the shape of my life. I have just about the best cardio at my MMA gym, and I'm only a yellow belt in Krav Maga. At the belt tests, where I went, they had PUKE BUCKETS all around the studio. The early stages of Krav Maga were basically boxing with elbows, basic defensive kicks, and knees. I made a transition into boxing for a while while doing Krav Maga, and it helped me a TON because the two styles are so similar in their punches.

The creator of Krav Maga, by the way, was a Judoka and a boxer. That's what the style was originally based around.

It's not always about being able to kick someone's ass. There are people out there who just want to statistically improve their chances of survival. Good street smarts coupled with some backup "Oh shit" moves (i.e. gun and knife defenses) are essential for self defense. Krav basically combines those with realistic combatives (The striking is EXACTLY like MMA with some added self-defense strikes). There is sparring, too, by the way. Most people just judge Krav on the lower belt classes, which are based entirely around boxing and conditioning, with some very basic self defense moves.


Please just read this post because I've defended Krav Maga countless times. I currently train in MMA and I left Krav Maga but I still feel that I owe a lot of my stand-up fighting skills and my conditioning to Krav Maga.

 

[zenshin]

Ice man i am no disagreeing with you statment. I too value GOOD QUALITY KM, but that is not what is taught in the US. Sorry to say that, I have met and trained with some of Israel Elite and ALL of thn say th same thing he is not a real KM here in the USA. Sankaku stated that I do not know what I am talking about, I just wanted him to understand that I DO.

Everyone has there prefrence on what is good for them. I am not here to argue KM polotics because ovr the yars I have become discuted by it. I can honestly say I DO NOT LIKE DARRIN LEVINE for making KM a national joke. Avi Nardia calls his stuff Kapap after the Special Forces training in Israel just not to be associatd with KM.

Check out his web site and compare it to KMAA web-site clips and you can see the diffrence.

http://www.avinardia.com/home.html

 

[EPT]

I'm going to place you in a situation, and you tell me what you do.

You're in a bank, and all of a sudden, you hear "Get the *#$% down!" It's being robbed. People are getting down on the ground. One of the armed robbers, for some reason, targets you. He starts screaming at you to "Turn around." Or he might be telling you to put something on your head.

At this point, do you assume "Well, there's nothing I can do, he has a gun?" You do realize what he's doing, right? Any time an assailant is trying to make you turn around, cover your face, wear a mask, he's most likely planning on killing you. He's, in effect, trying to de-humanize you so it's easier to kill you. Think about it. What's easier, looking someone in the face and shooting them, or just firing at a human-shaped target?

Without knowing too much about the situation doing nothing could be the best thing to do. If you're doing a bank robbery, murdering a bystander is not going to help you, if he is going to murder you it's because he's a psycho and it's not going to matter whether or not he can see your face.

 

[Matt Thornton]

Without knowing too much about the situation doing nothing could be the best thing to do. If you're doing a bank robbery, murdering a bystander is not going to help you, if he is going to murder you it's because he's a psycho and it's not going to matter whether or not he can see your face.

Alright, I was using a really bad scenario. Obviously that's probably not going to happen in that exact situation. My main point was the forcing someone to cover their face or turn around. Any time someone tries to force you to comply with that order, shit is probably going down.

http://www.jimwagnertraining.com/store/CRIME_4.wmv

Watch that video clip.

 

[EPT]

Alright, I was using a really bad scenario. Obviously that's probably not going to happen in that exact situation. My main point was the forcing someone to cover their face or turn around. Any time someone tries to force you to comply with that order, shit is probably going down.

http://www.jimwagnertraining.com/store/CRIME_4.wmv

Watch that video clip.

You have a point, sometimes complying will be the worst thing you can do but other times it may save your life, there's people who have written books on this subject I don't think we're going to come to a conclusive answer on an MMA forum. For example even in the situation in the video there's no guarantee the guy is going to shoot her, that scenario could of played out in a hundred different ways, there really is no one right answer to this sort of thing.

 

[mmagic]

Alright, I was using a really bad scenario. Obviously that's probably not going to happen in that exact situation. My main point was the forcing someone to cover their face or turn around. Any time someone tries to force you to comply with that order, shit is probably going down.

http://www.jimwagnertraining.com/store/CRIME_4.wmv

Watch that video clip.

Oh wow, a video on the internet. It must be true.

Here is an alternative view of the situation. During a bank robbery, a robber tells you to get down and put your hands on your head because he is trying to control the crowd. You would have been fine if you had just followed his instructions, but instead when you attempted to elbow him in the side he shot you in the head. Way to go.

People who study martial arts in order to learn self defense or as a means to beat other people up are on the street are almost always tools.

 

[Aardvark]

the question of when to defend yourself is seperate from whether any given KM school is worth a rats ass.

however, as far as the bank scenerio, your best bet is to shut the fuck up, stay out of the way and let the robber and the police duke it out. a better example is when someone points a gun at you and tells you to a) get in the car b) go into an alley c) anything else. in which case the only consideration is: if he's willing to shoot you in a public place, what makes you think he'll be nice to you if you place yourself under his control without witnesses? sometimes you're just fucked and its better to go down fighting and with a chance for some random stranger calling an ambulance.

which again, has nothing to do with the question of whether any given KM school is a worth a damn. training gun disarms is a joke for 99.99% of the trainers and students out there.

 

[KeichuTrained]

forget tai-chi(like yoga w/kung-fu) or iado(swordfighting I think)

 

[USAMMAFAN]

People who study martial arts in order to learn self defense or as a means to beat other people up are on the street are almost always tools.

Excuse me then but wtf exactly is the point of studying martial arts then?

If you dont remember the orginal UFC and valeo tudo events were meant to showcase different systems of marial arts to see what was effective in a no holds barred situation with limited rules to see what was effective in the streets.

You dont think the gracies ever got in any steet fights? Jesus there is a video of Rickson fighting some dude on the beach in Rio on the internet.

Sport martial arts evolved out of self-defense martial arts as a way for practioners to test their skills against one another in a controlled competition.

Combat sambo came before sport sambo.

BJJ for self defense came before sport Bjj, etc.

Every military has some sort of hand to hand combat system for its soldiers and police, etc, etc. According to your logic why does the military even train period? I mean things are so unpredictable, why even bother to rehearse scenarios?

Is any martial art or self defense system 100%, well no, very few things in this world are %100, but some preparation is better then no preparation in almost every situation in the world.

This is why we have boot camps, police academies, and martial arts dojos. Combat will always be an unpredictable situtation, but experience has shown time and time again that training for the unexpected and realistically can produce results and instill the confidence to handle situations.

From the early days of Rome's first highly trained professional armies to modern day mma practioners. Preparing yourself for combat, while not always %100 is often very effective.

 

[pistachio22]

Oh wow, a video on the internet. It must be true.

Here is an alternative view of the situation. During a bank robbery, a robber tells you to get down and put your hands on your head because he is trying to control the crowd. You would have been fine if you had just followed his instructions, but instead when you attempted to elbow him in the side he shot you in the head. Way to go.

People who study martial arts in order to learn self defense or as a means to beat other people up are on the street are almost always tools.

Forget about the bank scenario, iceman has already admitted that wasn't a good example.

Maybe instead imagine you're out with your girlfriend & you get held up. You're the sole target for this assailent, maybe he was planning to take you out of the picture & rape & kill your girl. Would you just want to play possum? Or would you try to take him out 1st?
What you've got to remember is that krav maga is a military program, they need solutions for life & death situations.

I would of thought anyone in this "MIXED Martial Arts" forum would appreciate & know, from examples we've all learned or witnessed from the fore-fathers of the art. Those who don't take another art seriously very often get their ass handed to them.

It's a good idea to have a mixed bag of tricks, the more shit you know the more shit you can throw.

As for people who learn martial arts for self defense comment... How do you come to that conclusion?
I don't know what it's like where you are from but around my area theres a lot of people who look for trouble & if you don't learn how to defend yourself, you will become a victim.

 

[KravMachado]

Everybody downs Krav until they come to a class with all their BS and can't even get through a 3 minute stress drill. Yes, it's self defense oriented, but it is a MMA. No, you can't gouge eyes out in MMA, but think of Krav as MMA for self defense. THey use MMA techniques for self defense purposes. Thats why Bas Ruten does privates at the KRav Training Center in LA. Tae Kwon Do has about as much effectiveness as a stun gun on an elephant. Tae Kwon Do is a sport. Not a fighting style. Other than the roundhouse, you are not going to effectively jump spinning back kick anyone unless they're an idiot. And even if you do land something silly like that, you'd better hope to hell you drop the guy.

"There is no art or way. Take what works and use it, throw everything else away"

 

[theguy]

i agree with kravmachado all the rest of you are just friggin ignorant.really if all krav maga is eye gouges,and kicks to the groin then why would 95% of you lose to that person in a fight.Oh yeah and the guy who said he broke some person who from krav fingers simply give your head a shake and realize just cause you typed it dont make it real the only thing that is real is how fast a real martial artist would make you thier bitch.For all those people who want to really know what krav maga is try it then judge because most of (not all)these guys have no clue what they are talking about

 

[Aardvark]

Everybody downs Krav until they come to a class with all their BS and can't even get through a 3 minute stress drill. Yes, it's self defense oriented, but it is a MMA. No, you can't gouge eyes out in MMA, but think of Krav as MMA for self defense. THey use MMA techniques for self defense purposes. Thats why Bas Ruten does privates at the KRav Training Center in LA. Tae Kwon Do has about as much effectiveness as a stun gun on an elephant. Tae Kwon Do is a sport. Not a fighting style. Other than the roundhouse, you are not going to effectively jump spinning back kick anyone unless they're an idiot. And even if you do land something silly like that, you'd better hope to hell you drop the guy.

"There is no art or way. Take what works and use it, throw everything else away"

Strawman. I don't think the majority of people who rip on Krav advocate TKD. I could give a fuck what Bas is doing with his time or what he gets paid to endorse. Randy Couture says with a straight face that a strap improves his performance, doesn't mean I believe it.

 

[Aardvark]

i agree with kravmachado all the rest of you are just friggin ignorant.really if all krav maga is eye gouges,and kicks to the groin then why would 95% of you lose to that person in a fight.Oh yeah and the guy who said he broke some person who from krav fingers simply give your head a shake and realize just cause you typed it dont make it real the only thing that is real is how fast a real martial artist would make you thier bitch.For all those people who want to really know what krav maga is try it then judge because most of (not all)these guys have no clue what they are talking about

who says 95% of us would lose to that person exactly? Where are you pull this number from? Oh, right, your ass.

BTW punctuation and white space are your friends.

 

[feedback]

KM in the US is shit because of reasons mentioned above. It's a complete McDojo that teaches watered down *EVERYTHING*.

Outside of the US though, it's no joke. I've got a french friend who was a doorman in Paris for 6 years who had a good KM school there. He wrecked a lot of people's grills (OH YEAH)