Khabibs top 15 GOAT list

[Shilajit]

Lol it's not especially against Fedor : to me almost all the fighters that fought in Japan were overrated.

It includes Mirko, Nogueira, etc.

They were great as pioners and still have more than a decent career for that.

But when fanboys try to compare them to modern MMA fighters, it's just a big NO.

But once again, he lost by KO in the first round against a MW grandpa, so no need to continue such a wasteful discussion

Spend less time studying wikipedia

And more time studying skills

And you will understand what people smarter than you see.

 

[Westbrick]

Cormier is easily the most overrated mf ever

 

[Yellowcrab]

Every single fighter in the history of the sports.

I don't care : it's marketing and folklore for them.

They respect him as a pioner and that's it.

When they don't care about marketing or whatever however, that's what happens : "I’m not saying it’s gospel, that Fedor was taking them," Bisping finished. "But I’d say all signs point to that direction. Anytime he came over to America, he didn’t do well. Even Mirko Cro Cop was the same."

https://www.mmamania.com/2017/6/28/15890888/bisping-fedor-steroids-bellator-nyc-loss

Also i don't care about opinions, i care about facts. So their opinion remains irrelevant if it blatantly contradicts facts.

A HW "GOAT" would have never lost against a 40 years old MW by KO in the first round.

A MW that had to drink a lot of water to make the weight : Three months earlier, Henderson had stopped the great Fedor Emelianenko in Strikeforce, a sneaky little knockout in one of the greatest single rounds on historical record. Here was Dan Henderson, the reigning light heavyweight Strikeforce champion, guzzling water to make the heavyweight minimum.

https://www.mmafighting.com/2014/3/...erson-the-shogun-fights-bookend-a-cruel-chasm

A 40 years old Henderson, TRT or not, is a complete joke for the HW division and would be at the bottom of the division right now.

A prime Henderson is a good fighter in lower weight classes, which is completely and totally different : but Fedor's fanboys fail with basic logic.

Fedor was great, but only at the very beginning of the sport. Once the sport got more mainstream he got quickly exposed

 

[Shilajit]

I don't care : it's marketing and folklore for them.

They respect him as a pioner and that's it.

When they don't care about marketing or whatever however, that's what happens : "I’m not saying it’s gospel, that Fedor was taking them," Bisping finished. "But I’d say all signs point to that direction. Anytime he came over to America, he didn’t do well. Even Mirko Cro Cop was the same."

https://www.mmamania.com/2017/6/28/15890888/bisping-fedor-steroids-bellator-nyc-loss

Also i don't care about opinions, i care about facts. So their opinion remains irrelevant if it blatantly contradicts facts.

A HW "GOAT" would have never lost against a 40 years old MW by KO in the first round.

A MW that had to drink a lot of water to make the weight : Three months earlier, Henderson had stopped the great Fedor Emelianenko in Strikeforce, a sneaky little knockout in one of the greatest single rounds on historical record. Here was Dan Henderson, the reigning light heavyweight Strikeforce champion, guzzling water to make the heavyweight minimum.

https://www.mmafighting.com/2014/3/...erson-the-shogun-fights-bookend-a-cruel-chasm

A 40 years old Henderson, TRT or not, is a complete joke for the HW division and would be at the bottom of the division right now.

A prime Henderson is a good fighter in lower weight classes, which is completely and totally different : but Fedor's fanboys fail with basic logic.

Fedor was great, but only at the very beginning of the sport. Once the sport got more mainstream he got quickly exposed

How long have you been watching this sport

What is your training background?

 

[Dan O'Burke]

Lol. Big Nog and Bigfoot were were completely shot. Try again.

Ah, there it is...the "prime" argument...the plot armor any Pride fan needs...that's why 90% of debates on here are pointless.

 

[OneOfOne]

Ah, there it is...the "prime" argument...the plot armor any Pride fan needs...that's why 90% of debates on here are pointless.

"Primes don't exist" - Dan O'Burke

 

[Dan O'Burke]

"Primes don't exist" - Dan O'Burke

Primes are subjective, especially when fighters win over in Japan, come here and lose (when there is stricter drug testing) then go back to Japan or their home countries and win again. To fans of a certain fighter, primes only exist when they are winning then after they lose "oh they were out of their prime". That's called Sherdog 101.

 

[OneOfOne]

Primes are subjective, especially when fighters win over in Japan, come here and lose (when there is stricter drug testing) then go back to Japan or their home countries and win again. To fans of a certain fighter, primes only exist when they are winning then after they lose "oh they were out of their prime". That's called Sherdog 101.

Yes, primes are subjective. But wouldn't you agree that there comes a point where its no longer subjective? For instance, you wouldn't claim Mark Coleman was in his prime in 2023, right? Thats pretty objective.

Likewise, we can say guys like Big Nog in or around 40yrs old, 30+ fights, and 15 years of fighting are objectively not in their primes any longer. Unless of course they are juiced up like Dan Henderson.

 

[Mike]

Im not saying GSP specifically retired to avoid USADA.

I’m just saying that he competed when USADA wasn’t around, so there’s no telling what he could have been doing.

You could literally apply that logic to anyone that fought pre usada, or retired during usada. Gsp refused an exemption when he came out of retirement to win the mw title, and passed all his tests for that fight. Not sure how people can ask for more.

 

[No Skill Gap]

Where would you put Usman?

Idk it's so tough to say. We don't have a complete career of the fighter and see - Aldo, Penn, Cruz, Fedor, even Holloway now, McGregor, etc. These guys continue to fight then fall off a cliff, even guys with lesser legacies that once burned bright like a Woodley or Weidman.

I guess I'd have to flesh it out:

1A. Jones
1B. GSP
3. Anderson Silva
4. Fedor (I guess?)
5. Aldo
6. Cruz
7. Mighty Mouse
8. DC
9. Adesanya
10. Cejudo
11. Usman (I guess here?)
12. Penn?
13. McGregor
14+. Couture/Lidell, Shogun, Frank Shamrock, Hughes, Holloway, I forgot Volk at this point he's higher probably ~8-11, Miocic, Dillashaw honestly deserves a mention, Edgar arguably higher up...

I think ~11 is the highest I'd put Usman. Maybe 9-10 at very most. I think he fought a lot of sneaky low end competition i.e. Masvidal x2, arguably washed Woodley, pre-title weak comp. Losing to Edwards twice in a row hurts his legacy a lot.

That list is also rough. I personally weigh double champ, high end achievements, top tier wins the most. I don't care that the UFC gave you two free title defenses when you fought Jorge journeyman masvidal with zero TDD twice in a row for example, or Izzy defends against some arguably bums like Vettori, Costa, 40 year old Cannonier.

To me, Izzy getting dominated in grappling by a weak LHW champ in Jan hurts him. Where as GSP beats a weak MW champ in Bisping by finish, and DC goes up to HW and beats Miocic initially, McGregor for however polarizing he is put the emotions away...he was a legit double champ and finished the FW GOAT by KO then beat a good LW champ at the time in Alvarez by dominate performance/KO. Cejudo became double champ.

I think that means more than racking up title defenses without context. Again, MIghty Mouse a prime example. You can critique Silva's competition too honestly, but I do believe he could have went to 205 and won the belt...He destroyed a recent champion in Griffin and beat Irvin there easily. A lot of this is subjective though. So I put DC 8th there, he could easily be 12-15 too...sure.

I'd say this is important - Name the top 5 wins of said fighter. What are there best 5 accomplishments in the sport, top 5 wins.

If we're putting a 40 year old washed up Silva as Adesanya's top 5 for example, then there you go. If we have to include a split decision win and 2x wins over Dodson for Mighty Mouse's top 5 wins ever...okay there you go. I'm not putting those guys top 3-5 ever. They never had elite competition. And I think someone like DC is punished legacy wise, because he had to go against the GOAT probably in his division. He might be top 3-5 ever, but you can't really put him there.

 

[Orochimaru 大蛇丸]

DC is one of the greatest fighters of all time

He's very underrated

I think both DC and Jones during their peak would beat any fighter that has ever lived personally

GOAT lists are about resume, not who you think was the best at their peak

 

[Hezekiah]

He's cheating. Just pick 15 names, not 20.

 

[wisdom blows]

I don't care : it's marketing and folklore for them.

They respect him as a pioner and that's it.

When they don't care about marketing or whatever however, that's what happens : "I’m not saying it’s gospel, that Fedor was taking them," Bisping finished. "But I’d say all signs point to that direction. Anytime he came over to America, he didn’t do well. Even Mirko Cro Cop was the same."

https://www.mmamania.com/2017/6/28/15890888/bisping-fedor-steroids-bellator-nyc-loss

Also i don't care about opinions, i care about facts. So their opinion remains irrelevant if it blatantly contradicts facts.

A HW "GOAT" would have never lost against a 40 years old MW by KO in the first round.

A MW that had to drink a lot of water to make the weight : Three months earlier, Henderson had stopped the great Fedor Emelianenko in Strikeforce, a sneaky little knockout in one of the greatest single rounds on historical record. Here was Dan Henderson, the reigning light heavyweight Strikeforce champion, guzzling water to make the heavyweight minimum.

https://www.mmafighting.com/2014/3/...erson-the-shogun-fights-bookend-a-cruel-chasm

A 40 years old Henderson, TRT or not, is a complete joke for the HW division and would be at the bottom of the division right now.

A prime Henderson is a good fighter in lower weight classes, which is completely and totally different : but Fedor's fanboys fail with basic logic.

Fedor was great, but only at the very beginning of the sport. Once the sport got more mainstream he got quickly exposed

do you know what ALL time means? You don’t compare fighters of today with advanced training/techniques/money/nutrition/drugs etc. You judge fighters by how great they were in relation to their peers.

Fedor got KOd by Hendo after his prime run, GSP got KOd by a LW grappler with zero KO wins on his record in the MIDDLE of his prime. Which is worse?

 

[Izzysexboyfriend]

Wtf where’s Conor

 

[D 1 Wrestler]

Max Holloway beat Aldo two times

Conor beat him in 13 seconds, put him up there

 

[Yellowcrab]

do you know what ALL time means? You don’t compare fighters of today with advanced training/techniques/money/nutrition/drugs etc. You judge fighters by how great they were in relation to their peers.

Ok it's a valid point, but that's not what most Fedor's fanboys are saying, they're saying he would beat any fighter nowadays if he was in his prime, which is a complete joke.

And don't speak about drugs : modern UFC = USADA vs no drug testing in Japan.

Fedor got KOd by Hendo after his prime run, GSP got KOd by a LW grappler with zero KO wins on his record in the MIDDLE of his prime. Which is worse?

And here we go with the nonsense again

So he was more out of prime than a 40 years old MW ?

He has such an embarrassing loss, because he was never that good, as simple as that.

And i agree with GSP, it's an embarrassing loss too, but at least that LW wasn't 40 years old...

Also, at 35 years old (older than Fedor) and after years of inactivity, Jon Jones beat a younger fighter from a higher weight class...

 

[Maaj19]

That run is full of cans. Real competition started just before the McGregor fight.

He's a beast tho.

Faber, Swanson, Mike Brown, Edgar, Mendez are cans? He fought good/great fighters in his run.

 

[MDoza]

You could literally apply that logic to anyone that fought pre usada, or retired during usada. Gsp refused an exemption when he came out of retirement to win the mw title, and passed all his tests for that fight. Not sure how people can ask for more.

Connor will pass all his tests when he comes back too. Keep believing what you want though.

 

[Orochimaru 大蛇丸]

It blows my mind more people don’t call out the Cejudo pick

Please tell me what he did to be in the same realm as those other guys?

Beat DJ in a fight he arguably lost, then beat 125 TJ who had a death weight cut and zero history at 125… pretty much means nothing when you consider that

Then beats Moraes who went on to completely fall off a cliff after that, then beats old ass Dominick Cruz with a controversial stoppage in a very competitive fight leading up to that

There is seriously no argument, but people get tricked by the two weight champ bullshit… he did a very similar thing Conor did, but with Conor everyone sees through it, with Cejudo I guess because he got one bullshit defense in each weight class people are tricked by it?

Please someone make an argument for why Cejudo should be ranked over guys like JOSE FUCKING ALDO.

 

[Pechan]

Don't know if it's been posted but Chatgpt chimes in:

As an AI language model, I do not have personal opinions. However, the title of "greatest MMA fighter of all time" is subjective and can vary depending on individual opinions and criteria. There are several fighters who are often regarded as some of the greatest in MMA history, including:

1. Anderson Silva: A former UFC Middleweight Champion known for his striking and creative fighting style. Silva holds numerous records in the UFC, including the longest title reign in Middleweight division history.
   
   
2. Georges St-Pierre: A former UFC Welterweight Champion who is considered one of the most well-rounded fighters in MMA history. St-Pierre was known for his wrestling, striking, and grappling skills, and had a dominant career inside the octagon.
   
   
3. Jon Jones: A former UFC Light Heavyweight Champion known for his dynamic striking, wrestling, and grappling skills. Jones holds numerous records in the UFC, including the most successful Light Heavyweight title defenses.
   
   
4. Fedor Emelianenko: A Russian heavyweight fighter who had a dominant career in organizations such as Pride FC and Strikeforce. Emelianenko was known for his well-rounded skills, durability, and striking prowess.
   
   
5. Khabib Nurmagomedov: A retired UFC Lightweight Champion who was known for his dominant grappling and wrestling skills. Nurmagomedov retired undefeated with a perfect 29-0 record and was known for his relentless pressure and ground control.