Jones is destroying heavyweight

[AfroBanana]

Tom was shuffled into an interim fight due to circumstances. The solution to this would to just be active and fight and letting the chips fall with Jon and Stipe. Sitting around whining isn’t going to build a legacy or help HW either.

Toms just starting out and Jon is ending. Jon and Stipe really want to fight each other because if their legacy. Even if Jon wanted to fight a washed Matt Lindland in a C league org or wait for 40 year old one eyed Bisping that’s his prerogative.

I think Jon should have been stripped and this legacy fight shouldn’t have a title attached but I get why they want it business wise. HW isn’t that exciting…….. Tom and Gane are really all that stand out rn. Sergei and Curtis are the next tier and everything behind that meh.

 

[Mohawk Banditó]

Tom was shuffled into an interim fight due to circumstances. The solution to this would to just be active and fight and letting the chips fall with Jon and Stipe. Sitting around whining isn’t going to build a legacy or help HW either.

Toms just starting out and Jon is ending. Jon and Stipe really want to fight each other because if their legacy. Even if Jon wanted to fight a washed Matt Lindland in a C league org or wait for 40 year old one eyed Bisping that’s his prerogative.

I think Jon should have been stripped and this legacy fight shouldn’t have a title attached but I get why they want it business wise. HW isn’t that exciting…….. Tom and Gane are really all that stand out rn. Sergei and Curtis are the next tier and everything behind that meh.

That's what interim titles are though

 

[Oddmonster]

This is what I mean with you being love with hate

Jones has 1 asterisk on 1 fighter who he beat clean
You ignoring USADAs declaration Jones didn't cheat a second time

Sure, he is just "pulsing", as the only athlete in the world.

 

[AstralPanda]

He never would have accepted a fight with Frank or Pav. That's facts.

Except he did. Some people just don't exist in reality and like to rewrite history as it suits them.

Pavlovic was the official backup. He weighed in and on paper, Jones agreed to fight him if Gane pulled out.

And the UFC offered Frank a contract to fight him for 8 mil, which means Jones had already come to an agreement prior to this.

So, do you think Jones would
1) break the contract at the last minute out of uncontrollable fear.

Or

2) Jones hadn't even signed yet and they offered Frank the contract(capstone of the entire deal) under the contingency that Jones MIGHT sign.


Sounds more like a delusional fanfiction to me. Everything Chael said is proven with evidence.

It becomes even more delusional when we understand how to analyze mma and recognize how bad of a style match-up Jones actually was for him.

 

[Captain Herb]

Except he did. Some people just don't exist in reality and like to rewrite history as it suits them.

Pavlovic was the official backup. He weighed in and on paper, Jones agreed to fight him if Gane pulled out.

And the UFC offered Frank a contract to fight him for 8 mil, which means Jones had already come to an agreement prior to this.

So, do you think Jones would
1) break the contract at the last minute out of uncontrollable fear.

Or

2) Jones hadn't even signed yet and they offered Frank the contract(capstone of the entire deal) under the contingency that Jones MIGHT sign.


Sounds more like a delusional fanfiction to me. Everything Chael said is proven with evidence.

It becomes even more delusional when we understand how to analyze mma and recognize how bad of a style match-up Jones actually was for him.

So let me follow your logic for a second. You believe that Jon Jones had a contingency contract with Pav in case Stipe pulled out? So that means that Stipe would have had that same contingency contract as well, yet he refused to fight Pav when it came down to it. So your logic makes no sense, and also btw, there is no contingency contract. If one pulls out the other can choose to fight the backup, or not. It's not contractual.

 

[AstralPanda]

So let me follow your logic for a second. You believe that Jon Jones had a contingency contract with Pav in case Stipe pulled out? So that means that Stipe would have had that same contingency contract as well, yet he refused to fight Pav when it came down to it. So your logic makes no sense, and also btw, there is no contingency contract. If one pulls out the other can choose to fight the backup, or not. It's not contractual.

According to the UFC and based on our own eyes, Sergei weighed in. He would've fought, had Gane pulled out in order to save the card.

This wouldn't be the case, unless Jones agreed to it.

As Chael stated.

Refusing to fight Sergei outright is an entirely different argument, if you have the opportunity to build a card with a bigger name, obviously you will do so.

Taking a last minute, designated, agreed to replacement Is an entirely different thing.

Essentially what you're saying is, in spite of Sergei training and weighing in as a potential replacement, if it came down to it, Jones would've been to terrified to actually fight him.


He would've sacrificed the whole card, promotion, his reputation, his paycheck, good graces with the ufc.

Because he was too terrified to fight Sergei. A one dimensional power puncher who got outgrappled by overeem like he was a small child.


This is how you both know someone who doesn't understand mma, or someone who is so invested in their hatred that they've lost all semblance of common sense.

You decide which one you are.

But, there's a reason why no elite fighters or analysts actually feel the way you do.

 

[AstralPanda]

Hate is a powerful drug my friends. That's why I approach everything cold.

When you get too invested into either extreme, you lose the capacity to see the nuanced Grey.

 

[Captain Herb]

According to the UFC and based on our own eyes, Sergei weighed in. He would've fought, had Gane pulled out in order to save the card.

This wouldn't be the case, unless Jones agreed to it.

As Chael stated.

Refusing to fight Sergei outright is an entirely different argument, if you have the opportunity to build a card with a bigger name, obviously you will do so.

Taking a last minute, designated, agreed to replacement Is an entirely different thing.

Essentially what you're saying is, in spite of Sergei training and weighing in as a potential replacement, if it came down to it, Jones would've been to terrified to actually fight him.


He would've sacrificed the whole card, promotion, his reputation, his paycheck, good graces with the ufc.

Because he was too terrified to fight Sergei. A one dimensional power puncher who got outgrappled by overeem like he was a small child.


This is how you both know someone who doesn't understand mma, or someone who is so invested in their hatred that they've lost all semblance of common sense.

You decide which one you are.

But, there's a reason why no elite fighters or analysts actually feel the way you do.

We'll never know if Jones would have fought replacement Pavlovich. We do know that Stipe said he wouldn't and that he only wanted Jones. At least that's what the UFC told Aspinall. Or maybe Jones told the UFC to save Stipe for him and pull him from the fight. We also know that Stipe claimed at the time that the UFC never asked him to fight Pavlovich and instead brought in Aspinall. So we know someone isn't telling the truth and I would put my money on it being the UFC who is lying and telling different people different things and saving Stipe for Jones is the most likely reason. We also know that Jones wouldn't fight Chael Sonnen on short notice even when he had a full camp and Chael had none and was coming from MW to take the fight. All signs point to Jones only being willing to fight Stipe, not Pavlovich or anyone else. And again, there is no contact between the primary fighters and the "designated backup fighter"

 

[BowserJr]

Jones will retire after holding the belt for 5 years with no HW losses and 0 defenses, claiming to be the GOAT HW cuz he held the belt longer than anyone

 

[CatchtheseHands]

Yeah, that was his first fight in the UFC almost 6 years ago. More recently he handled Blaydes, kept it standing and knocked him out. If he can handle Blaydes, I'm quite sure he can handle old and fat Jones. But there's no way Jones would ever fight him because he's waaay too dangerous for Jon's liking.

Okay and? Reems chin was shot and he was coming off of 2 brutal KO losses, with one of those losses being from Blaydes. Not to mention Sergei was 12-0 prior to joining the UFC. That's why they gave him someone like Reem so early. Blaydes was 5-0 upon entering the UFC and was only 9-1 when he was finishing Oleynik, Hunto and Reem back to back. You can't use inexperience as reasoning here when Sergei had more fights, wins and 5 round championship experience due to being the FNG HW champ. Sergei should have been able to get Reem out of there quite easily but couldn't. Sergei beating Blaydes doesn't mean as much as you think because he's not tested. Anyone can have an unlucky night and end up losing to someone they should have or could have beaten. Blaydes was on his way to beating Lewis to a decision until he made a mistake and paid for it, does that mean Lewis is better than Blaydes? No. And yes, before you say "well Sergei could have had an off night with Reem" yes he certainly could have but this is where my point comes in. What if Blaydes opted to wrestle with Sergei instead of trade with him? How do we know if Blaydes took the same approach as Reem that he couldn't have taken him down and finished him there just as well? That's the thing, we don't know because Sergei hasn't been tested enough. He's ony fought 3 legit opponents and got tooled 2 out of 3 of those time. Yet you're saying he could beat Jon Jones easily? come on dude.. for all we know Volkov beats Sergei next month..

 

[fedorthegoat777]

There is a lot of excuses on why Jon Jones wrecked a bunch of UFC legends, but in the end that is what happened. Doesn't matter to any significant portion of fighters, analysts, or fans that he used PEDs and cheated. Doesn't matter that he is "bigger" (everyone made weight). Jon wins fights, and he wins them every single time. It doesn't matter that he, the man, is a failure in almost every meaningful way. Jon will go down as a legend, a troubled legend, but a legend. Conversely he will never be a fan favorite. If Jon doesn't self-correct, when he exits fighting completely he will likely implode and we all know karma can be tough.

Now do I think Jon is carefully selecting his opponents? Yes I do. I don't know the exact reasons why. Maybe he doesn't want the wear and tear. Maybe he doesn't want the miserable week after. Maybe he doesn't want to train as hard as some of these guys might require him to do. However, there is one thing I'm pretty positive on, it isn't because he thinks they're better. Jon is one of the best I've every seen, period.

Jones wrecked LHW.
He got one good win at HW.
I am not going to count Stipe.

 

[Captain Herb]

Okay and? Reems chin was shot and he was coming off of 2 brutal KO losses, with one of those losses being from Blaydes. Not to mention Sergei was 12-0 prior to joining the UFC. That's why they gave him someone like Reem so early. Blaydes was 5-0 upon entering the UFC and was only 9-1 when he was finishing Oleynik, Hunto and Reem back to back. You can't use inexperience as reasoning here when Sergei had more fights, wins and 5 round championship experience due to being the FNG HW champ. Sergei should have been able to get Reem out of there quite easily but couldn't. Sergei beating Blaydes doesn't mean as much as you think because he's not tested. Anyone can have an unlucky night and end up losing to someone they should have or could have beaten. Blaydes was on his way to beating Lewis to a decision until he made a mistake and paid for it, does that mean Lewis is better than Blaydes? No. And yes, before you say "well Sergei could have had an off night with Reem" yes he certainly could have but this is where my point comes in. What if Blaydes opted to wrestle with Sergei instead of trade with him? How do we know if Blaydes took the same approach as Reem that he couldn't have taken him down and finished him there just as well? That's the thing, we don't know because Sergei hasn't been tested enough. He's ony fought 3 legit opponents and got tooled 2 out of 3 of those time. Yet you're saying he could beat Jon Jones easily? come on dude.. for all we know Volkov beats Sergei next month..

Before the fight with Pav, Blaydes was talking about becoming a more complete fighter, working on good entries, not telegraphing etc. That's what he was trying to set up but he didn't get the chance because Pavlovich had too much firepower too early. What makes you think he couldn't do the same thing to Jones? Remember, Jones' only path to victory in the HW is wrestling, Pav knows he will have to come in with a shot for takedown and his defense is certainly better than Gane.

 

[CatchtheseHands]

Before the fight with Pav, Blaydes was talking about becoming a more complete fighter, working on good entries, not telegraphing etc. That's what he was trying to set up but he didn't get the chance because Pavlovich had too much firepower too early. What makes you think he couldn't do the same thing to Jones? Remember, Jones' only path to victory in the HW is wrestling, Pav knows he will have to come in with a shot for takedown and his defense is certainly better than Gane.

What fight were you watching dude? go back and watch that fight again. Blaydes wasn't setting up for any TD's. He was standing there trying to trade with him. He had plenty moments where he could shoot but didn't. What makes me think he couldn't do the same to Jon? Jon has one of the highest fight IQ's in MMA, that's what. You can hate him all you want but he's definitely one of the most intelligent fighters to ever step into the octagon and Pav is not a complicated fighter to figure out. If you can shut down his boxing he has nothing else. His TD offense isn't that great as he couldn't get down Overeem after several attempts. His clinch game is not very good as he got taken down multiple times by Reem in the clinch and was getting tossed around in it. His defense off his back is not good as Reem smashed him there. All Jon would have to do is close the distance and initiate the clinch or time Pav on an entry and it would be over shortly after.

 

[bjjwar]

I wish he wasn't so hung up on the Stripe fight but it be what it be. He'll beat Stripe and then probably become ambiguous about his next move for about 2 years until he eventually retires.

He's free to do that or whatever he wants, but if he wants to fight Stipe and not the real contenders he should vacate the belt.

 

[Captain Herb]

What fight were you watching dude? go back and watch that fight again. Blaydes wasn't setting up for any TD's. He was standing there trying to trade with him. He had plenty moments where he could shoot but didn't. What makes me think he couldn't do the same to Jon? Jon has one of the highest fight IQ's in MMA, that's what. You can hate him all you want but he's definitely one of the most intelligent fighters to ever step into the octagon and Pav is not a complicated fighter to figure out. If you can shut down his boxing he has nothing else. His TD offense isn't that great as he couldn't get down Overeem after several attempts. His clinch game is not very good as he got taken down multiple times by Reem in the clinch and was getting tossed around in it. His defense off his back is not good as Reem smashed him there. All Jon would have to do is close the distance and initiate the clinch or time Pav on an entry and it would be over shortly after.

I doubt he would want to get inside kicking distance with Pav, at least at first. I suspect he would run and hope he gasses. It wouldn't be an easy fight for Jonny with a lot of downside, which is why he would never take it

 

[phenomphan2]

The division is at a standstill. Not sure how Dana can let this happen.

 

[CatchtheseHands]

I doubt he would want to get inside kicking distance with Pav, at least at first. I suspect he would run and hope he gasses. It wouldn't be an easy fight for Jonny with a lot of downside, which is why he would never take it

Why would he not? Pav doesn't kick, Jon does. That's the safest place for him other than the clinch. Lol dude I'm done. No sense in continuing this. I've already gave you plenty of reasons as to why Pav would be a fairly easy fight for Jon and I've countered every single point you gave as to why it wouldn't be, using logic and evidence. The fact that you can't counter any of my counter points and can only keep repeating the same talking points I've already addressed just shows that you either don't understand fighting or that you're blinded by Jon Jones hate. I'm going to go with the latter here because you're not even trying to hide your bias here.

 

[orca]

relax stipe and him is already gonna fight lol
after that its over
hes gonna come back again and fight pereira to stack up those great wins
on his resume


meanwhile tom doesnt even want to fight a contender
dude basicaly cries for legacy
he should fight asap
do what others did
wipe out generations of fighters

not cry like a btch lmao
sadly hes not confident in himself
because you know its obvious he cries alot

 

[Mohawk Banditó]

relax stipe and him is already gonna fight lol
after that its over
hes gonna come back again and fight pereira to stack up those great wins
on his resume


meanwhile tom doesnt even want to fight a contender
dude basicaly cries for legacy
he should fight asap
do what others did
wipe out generations of fighters

not cry like a btch lmao
sadly hes not confident in himself
because you know its obvious he cries alot

Tom has fought contenders. What are you brain bleeding about now?

 

[CatchtheseHands]

relax stipe and him is already gonna fight lol
after that its over
hes gonna come back again and fight pereira to stack up those great wins
on his resume


meanwhile tom doesnt even want to fight a contender
dude basicaly cries for legacy
he should fight asap
do what others did
wipe out generations of fighters

not cry like a btch lmao
sadly hes not confident in himself
because you know its obvious he cries alot

Realistically Tom should not have to defend anything or fight anyone but the champ because Interims are not meant to be defended, they're meant to be unified. So he does have grounds to be upset and only wanting to fight for the belt.