Is Charles Oliveira a better grappler than prime BJ?

[DanDragon Machi]

I think Charles maybe have a dangerous ground but BJ had a better wrestling by far. Was pretty tough put him on his back when he was in shape

 

[Shaolin Alan]

BJ was mostly dominant from top position. His bottom game was never very explosive; but then again, few fighters could ever get him down, let alone keep him there for long.

 

[Darragh]

BJ vs Oliveira is like comparing Fred Astaire to Gene Kelly.

True flow vs hard work and grit.

 

[Flower2dPeople]

In pure grappling aspect, Oliveira is a phenomenal but Penn was literally a prodigy. 3 yrs training and winning the mundials as a black belt.

 

[GordoBarraBJJ]

Penn's backtake and reverse triangle, off his back, on Hughes was, and still is, a thing of beauty. Too bad he got injured in that 2nd fight with Hughes.

 

[Bend NvR Break]

Is Charles a BJJ world champion? BJ is.

I still think without the grease BJ would grapple fucked GSP. Instead GSP cheated and we have greasegate.

 

[HHJ]

BJ could physically do things Charles cant do.

 

[VinceArch]

I'd say so but that isn't taking anything away from BJ Penn. But if a fighter was able to get him breathing heavy his grappling would be ineffectual as the fight went on.

 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Is Charles a BJJ world champion? BJ is.

I still think without the grease BJ would grapple fucked GSP. Instead GSP cheated and we have greasegate.

 

[Tweak896]

People underrate BJ so much here because he loss after he got old. It's not a fair comparison really, Olivera would be a MW compared to BJ. BJ probably would be a BW or FW at most in modern UFC. BJ is so much more creative and fluid, where Olivera is more explosive. Would love to see them roll, but Olivera just has size. If BJ was same size he'd take it no problem.

 

[TheBulge]

Penn had some very flashy moves but Oliveira is more effective imo. When people talk about heart in combat sports it is also a crucial aspect when it comes to the guard, as BJ would lose the will to fight pretty quickly when he got put on his back and didn't get up or reverse right away. Oliveira was similar before he found a new motivation which makes him perform well even under fire.

 

[DanDragon Machi]

People underrate BJ so much here because he loss after he got old. It's not a fair comparison really, Olivera would be a MW compared to BJ. BJ probably would be a BW or FW at most in modern UFC. BJ is so much more creative and fluid, where Olivera is more explosive. Would love to see them roll, but Olivera just has size. If BJ was same size he'd take it no problem.

Hughes was way stronger than Charles and BJ handled him with no problem first time
Striking with Machida is way toughter than a grappling match with Charles prime for prime

 

[JKS]

No question Charles is a better grappler.

 

[Tweak896]

Hughes was way stronger than Charles and BJ handled him with no problem first time
Striking with Machida is way toughter than a grappling match with Charles prime for prime

It's so weird to compare eras. Today someone like Chandler would be hard to submit, just fight camps know exactly where not to go. Hughes fought where a real strategy was getting armbars from bottom or sweep your opponent off your back. BJ wasn't like that, but he also probably got more subs than anyone fighting guys much larger.

Both BJ and Olivera are similar to where they want to rock and sub, but in my opinion BJ did much more with his few physical gifts. There probably can't be another BJ in today's era where skill gaps aren't as wide as they were.

 

[dildos]

BJ was another level. It isn’t comparable.

 

[Shaolin Alan]

 

[DrMurrayDolphin]

Prime BJ was not superior to the majority of modern champion level fighters. He would be nullified by any of the strong wrestlers.

 

[DrMurrayDolphin]

GSP definitely greased up in the first fight. He was a remarkably dirty fighter, which was belied by his squeaky clean image.

 

[TriangleMonkey]

Prime 2nd run 155 BJ buzz-saws rejuvenated full-grown LW Charles

 

[DanDragon Machi]

Prime BJ was not superior to the majority of modern champion level fighters. He would be nullified by any of the strong wrestlers.

Most wrestlers fighters nowadays keeps afraid of going to the ground with a world class black belt jiu-jitsu guy. Look at Kamaru and Chimaev x Burns
Makachev and Tysarukyan are exceptions (and Arman almost got finished by Charles)