Economy Income inequality and wasteful spending

[Hellowhosthat]

I'll ignore this is one of those thinly vailed brag threads.

At some point a 40 year old man needs to look right. I hope you got a couple of fly outfits in your closet. You can't be looking like you work at the dollar tree all the time. Gotta head to the Banana Republic outlet at least.

I don't see how "I'm living a deliberately shitty life despite working so hard I should be able to afford some luxuries and still save money but billionaires are cool" is any kind of brag whatsoever.

 

[sickc0d3r]

The low income worker non contributor thing is bogus as well. They still pay sales taxes, property taxes (indirectly through rent), payroll taxes, gas taxes, etc.

Before Nixon, when virtually the entire country was democrat and republican economic policy was wildly unpopular, the ultra wealthy were looked down upon for being greedy and selfish - the idea being that they belonged to the country club and the rest of us didn't.

Nixon thought there was no way he could win with the current republican platform, when it was suggested to simply appeal to people's emotions - that's what wins elections - theatre - they literally believed that "Americans are stupid, they want their thinking done for them". Taking points from the John Birch society, Nixon's team set out to create boogeymen for middle class white men. Now it wasn't rich people causing their problems, it was the poor, minorities, immigrants, etc.

And ever since, a huge contingent of this country consistently votes against their best interests in favor of policy that only benefits one class. Sure, the democrats do this too, but at the very least the dems throw the middle class a few bones here and there.

Conservatives have had one policy and one policy only for 50 years. Trickle down. And you get threads like this where people defend stagnating wages, growing wealth inequality, etc., because they were sold a lottery ticket that if you just work hard, you too can be the next Donald Trump.

Yup. On the economy, the republicans are trash, and have been for decades. Everything they do is an attempt to squeeze more money from bottom to top. Even their concern about the debt is entirely fake. Democrats are so bad at messaging that they can't take advantage, though.

 

[KeepingItReal]

Yes I will admit I have a bit of a flair for the dramatic. Truly I couldn’t remember off the top of my head when I was typing and just threw out a big number. Admittedly I thought it was worse than the 33% that the top 1% holds but that is still very very bad.

The last paragraph I’m not sure what you’re getting at. It does cover billionaires separately in the video. This video is also over a decade old now and the gap has only accelerated in growth since then.

I agree, you are a drama queen.

What is so bad about it? You are putting some arbitrary value on how much of what some person you don't know owns. If I have more toilet paper in my house than you does that also bother you?

 

[Stoic1]

Wife and I were evicted twice in our early 20's going to college. Rolled coins for groceries as times. The power went out a few times. We were working poor. I rode a motorcycle for transportation for 5 years. Then bought a 20 year old truck.

Fast forward 30 years.

My wife's car is 9 years old. My (new) truck is like 16 years old. She refuses to buy new clothes. My kid shops at Once Upon a Child. Wife actually sewed up the hole in my favorite pair of shorts last week. I fixed my sandals with 4200 epoxy.

She cooked carrots, Mac n cheese, and local burger meat for dinner. Probably $15 meal.

But I float around the Bahamas and Caribbean most of the year on a half million dollar yacht living on my investment dividends and savings. I never have to work again.

Successful financial habits can be learned. Being frugal and not being in debt is a lifestyle.

 

[Blayt7hh]

this video doesnt show the problem, it shows a disparity, a disparity that is shared by all countries.

Share of Wealth Held by the Top 1% by Country (2023)
The following data comes from the Global Wealth Report 2023, as reported in posts on X:
Brazil: 48.4%

India: 41.0%

United States: 34.3%
Note: Other sources (e.g., Federal Reserve data for 2024) estimate the U.S. top 1% share at 30.8%, slightly lower than the 2023 figure.

China: 31.1%

Germany: 30.0%

South Korea: 23.1%

Italy: 23.1%

Australia: 21.7%

France: 21.2%

United Kingdom: 20.7%

Japan: 18.8%

Switzerland estimate ~40%

Luxembourg estimate ~35-45

South Africa ~45-50%

Canada: 25.7%

Mexico: 36%

Belgium: 20%

Spain: 22%

the video shows that 80 percentile and up is "Rich", that is 150K Household income income............................................................................

Ah yes right in line with other bastions of freedom like China and Mexico.

 

[Blayt7hh]

I agree, you are a drama queen.

What is so bad about it? You are putting some arbitrary value on how much of what some person you don't know owns. If I have more toilet paper in my house than you does that also bother you?

lol toilet paper. Talk about arbitrary. Yes I’m mad about the toilet paper hoarding that goes on.

The problem is people like you are really self centered so every conversation you have you think that it has to do with some of personal grievance. It’s not about a personal grievance though. It’s flat out bad for the country. We are watching it get worse and goofballs like you will write tripe like this in defense of it.

Why is wealth inequality bad? Because it leads to an end to social mobility. I assume you like capitalism right? You can say farewell to that as oligopolies and monopolies take over the markets and charge what they can get away with. It raises permanent barriers to entry to the market, it stifles innovation, and inevitably leads to all power back into some monarchy like system. Meanwhile, our healthcare system becomes more inaccessible. Our purchasing power shrinks by the day.

So I guess I can answer your asinine toilet paper question now. Will I resent it when one person hoards a mountain of toilet paper while the rest of us are trying to reuse a single ply sheet? Yes, yes I will.

 

[chardog]

Ah yes right in line with other bastions of freedom like China and Mexico.

And germany….. in any scenario, the top 1% own a crapload, this is nothing new

 

[Deleted member 592570]

Nixon thought there was no way he could win with the current republican platform, when it was suggested to simply appeal to people's emotions - that's what wins elections - theatre -

That's hilarious. Nixon was running against a guy whose whole platform revolved around the fact women wanted to suck his dick.

 

[avenue94]

this video doesnt show the problem, it shows a disparity, a disparity that is shared by all countries.

Share of Wealth Held by the Top 1% by Country (2023)
The following data comes from the Global Wealth Report 2023, as reported in posts on X:
Brazil: 48.4%

India: 41.0%

United States: 34.3%
Note: Other sources (e.g., Federal Reserve data for 2024) estimate the U.S. top 1% share at 30.8%, slightly lower than the 2023 figure.

China: 31.1%

Germany: 30.0%

South Korea: 23.1%

Italy: 23.1%

Australia: 21.7%

France: 21.2%

United Kingdom: 20.7%

Japan: 18.8%

Switzerland estimate ~40%

Luxembourg estimate ~35-45

South Africa ~45-50%

Canada: 25.7%

Mexico: 36%

Belgium: 20%

Spain: 22%

the video shows that 80 percentile and up is "Rich", that is 150K Household income income............................................................................

That disparity is not shared by all countries. The US's income distribution is more in line with developing countries than highly modernized economies.

 

[jk7707]

The 10 richest Americans got $365 billion richer in the past year. Now they’re on the verge of a huge tax cut

"The bill’s gains would go disproportionately to the rich, according to the analysis. The top 10% of earners would receive about two-thirds (65%) of the total value of the legislation, while households in the bottom 20% would lose about $1,035 in 2026 due to cuts to Medicaid, food stamps and other changes, according to Penn Wharton."

It's not about billionaires! Nothing to see here.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

This thread is way more effort than poor people are worth.

 

[chardog]

That disparity is not shared by all countries. The US's income distribution is more in line with developing countries than highly modernized economies.

you going to ignore germany, switzerland, and I didnt even mention sweden or singapore or australia, are these "developing" countries?

the rich own a lot, that should be a given.

maybe you should define how much the rich should own.

maybe you should look at the overall increase of wealth of all citizens.

 

[avenue94]

you going to ignore germany, switzerland, and I didnt even mention sweden or singapore or australia, are these "developing" countries?

the rich own a lot, that should be a given.

maybe you should define how much the rich should own.

maybe you should look at the overall increase of wealth of all citizens.

In most of those cases we're talking differences from 4 or 5 ppt to maybe 15. Those are massive differences.

 

[KeepingItReal]

lol toilet paper. Talk about arbitrary. Yes I’m mad about the toilet paper hoarding that goes on.

The problem is people like you are really self centered so every conversation you have you think that it has to do with some of personal grievance. It’s not about a personal grievance though. It’s flat out bad for the country. We are watching it get worse and goofballs like you will write tripe like this in defense of it.

Why is wealth inequality bad? Because it leads to an end to social mobility. I assume you like capitalism right? You can say farewell to that as oligopolies and monopolies take over the markets and charge what they can get away with. It raises permanent barriers to entry to the market, it stifles innovation, and inevitably leads to all power back into some monarchy like system. Meanwhile, our healthcare system becomes more inaccessible. Our purchasing power shrinks by the day.

So I guess I can answer your asinine toilet paper question now. Will I resent it when one person hoards a mountain of toilet paper while the rest of us are trying to reuse a single ply sheet? Yes, yes I will.

Brother, one of the reasons people want to be socially mobile is to be better off than other people or even just themselves(in their current state) but that invariably means wealth inequality. If a doctor, lawyer, or a detective were paid the same as a store clerks they probably wouldn't see any point in going through school all those years. I'm not saying money is the only reason, they do what they do, but it sure is a reason.

You really are a drama queen.

 

[Blunderbuss]

Wife and I were evicted twice in our early 20's going to college. Rolled coins for groceries as times. The power went out a few times. We were working poor. I rode a motorcycle for transportation for 5 years. Then bought a 20 year old truck.

Fast forward 30 years.

My wife's car is 9 years old. My (new) truck is like 16 years old. She refuses to buy new clothes. My kid shops at Once Upon a Child. Wife actually sewed up the hole in my favorite pair of shorts last week. I fixed my sandals with 4200 epoxy.

She cooked carrots, Mac n cheese, and local burger meat for dinner. Probably $15 meal.

But I float around the Bahamas and Caribbean most of the year on a half million dollar yacht living on my investment dividends and savings. I never have to work again.

Successful financial habits can be learned. Being frugal and not being in debt is a lifestyle.

While I'm not doing quite that well lol I do take your point. I always got shit in college for being frugal (which basically just meant not spending $100 at the bar Friday and Saturday night or eating out every other day) but when momentous cool shit rolled around, guess who had the ability to attend it. My mindset was always im being cheap now so i can afford to have actual fun later.

Present situation, we paid off our house after 9 years on a 25 year mortgage. No car payments. We just have our child to look after and make sure she is doing well. We hope to get her into a private school because society terrifies me lol so she is our biggest expenditure and worth it. My wife grew up SUPER poor and will never allow herself to go back to that and doesnt want her kid to experience what she had to. We managed to get this done in our mid 30s. Meanwhile my best friend is literally in the process of declaring bankruptcy.

that said, prices are fucked now so when you're paying 2500 to rent a one bedroom, fuck it, why not try to have fun and waste what little money remains. Life sucks anyway

 

[Blayt7hh]

Brother, one of the reasons people want to be socially mobile is to be better off than other people or even just themselves(in their current state) but that invariably means wealth inequality. If a doctor, lawyer, or a detective were paid the same as a store clerks they probably wouldn't see any point in going through school all those years. I'm not saying money is the only reason, they do what they do, but it sure is a reason.

You really are a drama queen.

Nope now you’re doing the classic attempt at misdirection. You’re talking about communism and I never said we should be communist. There’s a huge difference between not wanting to go back to the Middle Ages and being communist. It’s also straight bs because none of those jobs you listed are going to make you a multi billionaire.

Btw nothing I listed was wrong. Those are all problems we know that come with huge wealth inequality gaps.

 

[chardog]

I don't see how "I'm living a deliberately shitty life despite working so hard I should be able to afford some luxuries and still save money but billionaires are cool" is any kind of brag whatsoever.

I'm not gonna kick on the poors, cultural problem, can probably trace back to fatherless behavior, etc, deeply ingrained and some people are simply natural showoffs whether they are poor or well off, they like it and it's ok to be different.

In most of those cases we're talking differences from 4 or 5 ppt to maybe 15. Those are massive differences.

I'm not quite following, however the countries with high disparity, typically have housing issues, everyone should own homes and if they did, the disparity would be lower, maybe not low enough, but a lot lower.

we already see this at the state level, wealth disparity can be a 10 point+ difference with states with high home ownership vs low ownership. compare california to west VA, low ownership v high ownership. California has a high wealth accumulation at the top, housing is prohibitively expensive. West VA has a comparatively much different accumulation of wealth, housing prices are low, home ownership is high.

hell, if we can get housing under control in california, we can probably drop a few points in wealth disparity with that alone, this state is a giant economy that rivals and exceeds some countries..... NY is probably hopeless

 

[Possum Jenkins]

The irony being that those low paid workers get shit on by flat tax, tax is theft types, being called non-contributors, when in fact they are essential to a working economy. Besides being cheap labor, their lack of disposable income means that every dollar they make, they spend. And most of the money goes right back to ownership (banks, land owners, etc), and local businesses.
That picture turned upside down is a funnel, which is a fine example of how the money in circulation actually flows from the poorest to the richest.

Luckily, the flat tax, tax is theft guys have mostly STFU during the Trump era. Might be one of the very positives of MAGA.

But yeah, low-wage workers are integral parts of any capitalist economy. This is as true as it was 200 years ago.

It's already 95 F with oppressive humidity here in Houston and they're repairing the roof at my job's building these months. The work is absolutely brutal and no surprise, most or all the workers are Spanish-speaking immigrants. But I noticed that there's even a few female workers there. They're lifting and moving the stuff right alongside the men.

It reminded me that some work is so unpleasant and some people are so desperate that they'll take some of the worst jobs for a paycheck.

 

[Sinister]

Capitalism is based on consumerism and is a debt based system that implodes if there's not constant growth. The entire incentive structure for it to exist is people spending money and going into debt. They literally hire experts on human behavior to market to people and atop that, in the US and abroad wages have been stagnating and there's been a gutting of social programs to go along with growing income inequality. This is marketing working as intended, tying people's identity/status to things. This is the result.

I am a Capitalism = bad person and I am smart with money and no where close to being in debt of any kind nor am I remotely materialistic. I know plenty of people who could be as financially well off as me but make poor financial decisions and are in poor health. I could fellate myself and my decision making but I understand it's not that simple, the issue is systemic. It's literally fax over feelings.

The Capitalism = bad people, if I had to guess, are probably writ large less materialistic and more careful financially than others, aside from some of the ones who are pro Capitalism and understand the system well.

Dude dont try to have a nuanced view of socio-economics which acknowledges who has more political influence and how they shape the world around everyone.

Poor people are retards who dont deserve anything.

That's all you need to know.

EDIT: Oh and before I forget, only ever vote for people who want to do never-ending debt ceiling increases, and who think every tax dollar should only go to those with the highest surpluses of those dollars. People who dont think of the working class as human beings deserving of dignity and comfort, but rather subjects who need to be thought for and whose labor, and the labor of their children (once they can no longer afford to educate them) the comfort class is absolutely entitled to.

 

[Blayt7hh]

Wife and I were evicted twice in our early 20's going to college. Rolled coins for groceries as times. The power went out a few times. We were working poor. I rode a motorcycle for transportation for 5 years. Then bought a 20 year old truck.

Fast forward 30 years.

My wife's car is 9 years old. My (new) truck is like 16 years old. She refuses to buy new clothes. My kid shops at Once Upon a Child. Wife actually sewed up the hole in my favorite pair of shorts last week. I fixed my sandals with 4200 epoxy.

She cooked carrots, Mac n cheese, and local burger meat for dinner. Probably $15 meal.

But I float around the Bahamas and Caribbean most of the year on a half million dollar yacht living on my investment dividends and savings. I never have to work again.

Successful financial habits can be learned. Being frugal and not being in debt is a lifestyle.

I think I’ve seen you post that you retired as an officer from the Army, correct? If that is the case, I would like to point out that you are the beneficiary of possibly the single most socialist program we run in this country. This isn’t a post saying you haven’t earned what you have got or that you didn’t make good decision.

I am pointing out that I see a lot of anti economically liberal posts from you but you seem to be living the leftist dream right now. Sure you may have saved, but you’re also getting half your paycheck to just be alive. You have healthcare for life for you and your family. You’re probably getting a tax free disability check every month despite probably being more physically capable of working than your peers are. I just want you to remember that next time you shit on any “socialist” agendas. I want you to remember that almost no one working in the free market is getting a deal even a fraction as good as that.