I'm sure it's dumb, but I can't figure out "one punch KO power"

[Portland8242]

Because a lot of one punch KO power is timing and accuracy.

Even 60% power punches that go completely unseen and hit clean on the jaw can be KO blows.

 

[colorles]

Thank you. And I just know from personal interactions. There have been instances where I poked a little further and I ended up seeing footage of their old amateur fights and training and it was clear, they never would have made it to a high level like they made themselves believe.

And like I said from the start there is nothing wrong with that, I have respect for anybody who goes in there to fight I never had that in me myself, hell I even avoided hard sparring(but that's because the angels called for me to preserve my braincells so that I could spread my wisdom online on Sherdog. Otherwise I could have been a contender). I'm just over it when somebody give me the 'Could have-talk.

Indeed.

To the bolded part: I know you are being sarcastic with that, but I will also say this: I was involved with boxing and a few other combat related disciplines, among many other sports, since the time I could walk, literally before I was even in kindergarten. As a child and teenager my entire life was various forms of sport and movement; even at school I took any opportunity to do something since I hated sitting at a desk that much. There is a reasonable chance, had I chosen to pursue a career in boxing or mma, that I could have been reasonably successful. However: I did not. And thus I don't act like I am the "uncrowned king".

I bring this up because there are many people that use lines of reasoning like you just said, and actually brag about it. I know you are being sarcastic there but I will bring it up anyways.

 

[Thy]

Brains consistenency is like jello. a knockout is when the brain condenses to one side and short circuits. So whiplash etc. hittin cross the chin acts like a fulcrum makin the brain smush to one side. hittin the temple ike the same thing. just makin the dudes head move fast enough in general. so a hard enough punch with enough velocity on most places of the head will do the job. but some spots like accross the bottom of the chin can make the head snap easier cause physics/science or something.


So in short punch fast n hard and aim. gluck lul

 

[colorles]

Go watch an MLB game. Some pitchers can throw ridiculous heat, some can't. They've all trained for years and have good technique, so it's mainly genetics. Some people can move their arm faster and generate more power. Same as fighting, if you can also control where that pitch is going and hit the target, you're going to be even better.

Throwing hard is a mixture of posterior kinetic chain, fast twitch muscle recruitment, height and size/weight, shoulder width, arm length, the tendons in the elbow/wrist/shoulder, etc. If we are talking throwing a football, hand size comes into play as well. In other words: it is indeed mostly genetic.

 

[Rubios]

Back to the original question: it's not about some guys having the capacity to generate more power (force * velocity). I'm dumb, just not that dumb.

I've read tons of papers because I'm kinda nerd and interested in physiology and stuff.
Numbers fluctuate quite a bit, but the upper limit for a male to get KOed with an accurate and unexpected punch is stablished around 700-800 Newtons.
This is the estimated human concussive threshold, meaning any person in the world receiving that punch would get KOed with a 100% probability.

A regular, untrained -I'm meaning strength training here- early teenager (with the proper skill) could perfectly exert that power.

So, what -obvious, I'm sure- item am I missing?

 

[ThaiSexPills]

Fast twitch muscle fibres help a lot too.

I remember reading somewhere Johnny Hendricks, who wasn’t a baseball player could throw a 90mph fastball. Not sure if that was true but it wouldn’t surprise me, it’s a similar skill set.

 

[colorles]

Back to the original question: it's not about some guys having the capacity to generate more power (force * velocity). I'm dumb, just not that dumb.

I've read tons of papers because I'm kinda nerd and interested in physiology and stuff.
Numbers fluctuate quite a bit, but the upper limit for a male to get KOed with an accurate and unexpected punch is stablished around 700-800 Newtons.
This is the estimated human concussive threshold, meaning any person in the world receiving that punch would get KOed with a 100% probability.

A regular, untrained -I'm meaning strength training here- early teenager (with the proper skill) could perfectly exert that power.

So, what -obvious, I'm sure- item am I missing?

That 700-800 Newtons cannot be right. If that were the case high level fighters would never be able to take punches from each other. I know: a lot of that is due to fighters being able to see punches coming and roll with them, etc. But, sometimes guys do just take punches flush and keep going. Or kicks: What about Hunt eating kicks from Cro Cop for example?

That number simply cannot be right..although of course if varies immensely from person to person.

 

[marvinparsons]

It's also rare in a fight that someone gets hit with a full power perfect shot right on the chin or temple, where it seems to have the most KO impact.

Usually the guy throwing is sort of off balance, isn't throwing full power, the shot doesn't land 100% clean, the guy getting hit rolls with it etc.

That's why Shad-Liddell and Emmet-Mitchell were so brutal. They looked like 98% power and landed absolutely perfectly. I might be wrong, but I don't think Emmet or Rashad ever had a KO like that across probably 50 combined MMA fights. And they probably landed thousands of strikes in those fights.

 

[jsbx45]

First, I've been training boxing and K1 in a gym with VERY skilled guys who, for personal reasons, have never even thought about competing.
I've never did a single "hard sparring" session.

Point is. Science consensus says that the strength of an untrained 13 yo i.e., if he was able to properly engage his kinetic chain, land on the precise spot and had the skill to setup an unexpected flush punch...

...would be more than enough to make a 80kg dude, at least, go instantly lights out.

So my intuitive thought is that combat training develops resistance to endure G forces much, much higher than the normal distribution.
Is that the answer or there's more to it?

Its largely in the hips shermano, Although there is more to it than that.

 

[empsim]

Apart from timing, accuracy I think the willingness to commit to such shots also matters a lot.

From an athletic standpoint every UFC fighter should be capable of one shot KO's.

 

[MotorCityCobra]

It is simply to other similar things and largely genetic.

Throwing a baseball
Hitting a golf club
Hitting a snapshot
Hitting a tennis server

Etc.

Of course it is transfer of weight(how much of your weight gets transferred), combined with speed, combined with conservation of angular momentum.

But there are likely tons of variables for each individual one(bone and tendon strength/density, fast twitch muscle fibers, etc)

Some completely devastating punchers like George Foreman looked like he was barely swinging, whereas other devastating punchers look like they're throwing everything they have.

Why can a bunch of 6'6 monsters who played baseball their whole life, throw 80 mph while activating every muscle in their body, and some random 5'8 Dominican weighing 170 lbs can throw 85 effortlessly? I think it's the same thing, and it's likely if you lack KO power, it would be very hard to acquire it.

 

[BowserJr]

Work on your grip strength, swing from the hips and engage your legs

 

[Trabaho]

Point is. Science consensus says that the strength of an untrained 13 yo i.e., if he was able to properly engage his kinetic chain, land on the precise spot and had the skill to setup an unexpected flush punch...

...would be more than enough to make a 80kg dude, at least, go instantly lights out.

That is if he channels and throws his perfect punch and the other guy waits and doesn't move. Even that us questionable if it's a sure KO. Fighters move. Eveb 1 minute of grappling takes away your max power. Noone throws max power shots for 15 minutes. You wouldn't sprint for 15 minutes in a row either.

 

[Trabaho]

First, I've been training boxing and K1 in a gym with VERY skilled guys who,
for personal reasons, have never even thought about competing.

impossible. They can be good, but very skilled a bunch of tyem and noone of them competed. There is good compared

I've never did a single "hard sparring" session.

To a "beginner or light hobbist" and good period. I mean noone in the gym did a ammy fight. They could be good but than not as good as you imagine.

 

[Hog-train]

Go watch an MLB game. Some pitchers can throw ridiculous heat, some can't. They've all trained for years and have good technique, so it's mainly genetics. Some people can move their arm faster and generate more power. Same as fighting, if you can also control where that pitch is going and hit the target, you're going to be even better.

And roids. My cousin played baseball in college. He told me some kids were throwing in the 80's and over one summer of doing roids, they were throwing heat in the 90's in high school.

 

[Paolo Delutis]

First, I've been training boxing and K1 in a gym with VERY skilled guys who, for personal reasons, have never even thought about competing.
I've never did a single "hard sparring" session.

Point is. Science consensus says that the strength of an untrained 13 yo i.e., if he was able to properly engage his kinetic chain, land on the precise spot and had the skill to setup an unexpected flush punch...

...would be more than enough to make a 80kg dude, at least, go instantly lights out.

So my intuitive thought is that combat training develops resistance to endure G forces much, much higher than the normal distribution.
Is that the answer or there's more to it?

What science consensus have you seen, most 13years old in Merica( im Canadian)...they'd likely pound a Hamburger down then throw down with fists...

That said im not sure what the ask is here...


Majority of Knocks out happen from the strikes you dont see or anticipate...most fighters are trained to anticipate for the most part strikes
..this is why combinations were invented to Fool or break through defenses causing an opening for the K.O or unseen shot..

Most untrained people dont get punched nor know how to defend...and therefore walking into a huge shot you dont see coming is much higher thus the 1 shot ko % goes way up ...


So its not really about the size ...its the skill and ability to land an unseen shot... This why K.O's happen with 136lbs men all the way up to 200 plus pound mean..

Now unless your talking about one touch ko power some people seem to have that it seems to just take a touch and someones K.Oed..this is a harder phenomenon to explain but i believe it comes from a mixture the extreme discipline to just do something the exact same way over and over again to the point its been perfected at full power thrown on a reactionary basis (no thought needed) and an extreme self belief to the point of freedom to just be able to throw said strike with no restrictions( not saying its wild just unadulterated, full committal) , most strikes especially in MMA are not thrown with full committal as you have to worry about the counter or being taken down or people dont have the touch of death level confidence in their stand up...fighting is Hugely mental, you'd be amazed what confidence does and takes away from a fighter once lost.


Hope that helps

 

[AFewDollarsMore]

Wonder if you just practiced one punching for several months, could you just eventually acquire one punch ko power. I mean everything else one practices one gets better at.

 

[evergreenrider]

That being said, there are guys in the world that legitimately did have the athleticism and talent to make it at something, that never did due to "life getting in the way" (whatever that may be)...although those kinds of guys are seldom vocal about it.

Growing up, there was this kid that to this day, was the greatest natural athlete I've ever encountered. 6th grade, he's effortlessly ripping near unlimited reps of 185 on the bench. Would run literal laps around the track kids with a gotdamn cigarette in his mouth.

Unfortunately dude came from what can only be called, a white trash upbringing. He didn't ever have a chance, and never gave a fuck to apply his natural talents in sporting endeavors.

Year after high school he dove off a bridge into the river, hit a hidden rock, and snapped his neck. Been in a wheelchair since.

 

[BodybagJohnny**]

First, I've been training boxing and K1 in a gym with VERY skilled guys who, for personal reasons, have never even thought about competing.
I've never did a single "hard sparring" session.

Point is. Science consensus says that the strength of an untrained 13 yo i.e., if he was able to properly engage his kinetic chain, land on the precise spot and had the skill to setup an unexpected flush punch...

...would be more than enough to make a 80kg dude, at least, go instantly lights out.

So my intuitive thought is that combat training develops resistance to endure G forces much, much higher than the normal distribution.
Is that the answer or there's more to it?

I think that power is 70 percent genetics and 30 percent trainable.

That's just a guestimate based on training and observation.

I've always been blessed with good power even before I had training. Generating it was just instinctive to me. I did improve some with better technique, learning to sit down on a straight right for example, rotate my core, and fully extend.

But I'm an explosive, fast twitch guy and I think that has a lot to do with it. People who can generate explosive rotational power hit/kick harder.

Training only takes you so far. Look at Chael Sonnen, Nate Diaz, and Sean Strickland. They aren't power hitters and never will be.

Usually those guys are blessed instead with insane cardio.

And then some unfortunately unathletic people have neither.

 

[Fahcough]

Fast twitch muscle fibres help a lot too.

I remember reading somewhere Johnny Hendricks, who wasn’t a baseball player could throw a 90mph fastball. Not sure if that was true but it wouldn’t surprise me, it’s a similar skill set.

eh, I'd def have to see that one on the gun. That's a trained muscle over repetition. Maybe off of a ground ball with a crow hop, not pushing off a mound. His arms too short.