International Huge Protests in New Zealand Over Maori Bill

[A Very Serious Cat]

The ACT Party knew exactly what they were appealing to with the proposal, which is no doubt why they insisted on getting it read without actual voting support for the bill.
This is identity politics.
You can see exactly what sort of politics they were appealing to by the posts and posters that lapped it up here.

It will be interesting to see how this effects the popularity of Act the the Maori party. Right now act is winning quite easily

 

[Ruprecht]

It will be interesting to see how this effects the popularity of Act the the Maori party. Right now act is winning quite easily

The Maori Party has limited appeal, despite the Maori population doing better than most in terms of growth (excluding migration).
Act is obviously gambling on the idea that targeting them will gain more than it loses, and that New Zealand isn't immune to current broader political trends.

 

[Zookeeper Gabe]

 

[Gas121]

Personally I feel there is a bit of tension and Maori are low key mad at Europeans. I live in New Zealand and have been here for over a decade.

Like I’m in work this morning and Maori dude was talking about how the Whites basically stole their land and so on.

It’s a touchy subject, I tend to not even go there with this discussion. It is uncomfortable to discuss in NZ.

 

[aitkenmike]

So what special rights do they have?

Iwi have the right to be consulted in decisions around land and resources in their area. In some cases, they have been given co- ownership rights with the council or government over areas significant to them (e.g. the mountains in Auckland https://www.maunga.nz/about-us/ ; or the waikato river https://waikatoriver.org.nz/about/). They have the right to go to the Waitangi tribunal to seek redress for breeches of the treaty, including historical theft of land. Because of their relative position in society (despite their so called 'priveledge' they are over represented in child poverty, in poor health and education outcomes, in incarceration) there are some Government agencies that are tasked with improving these stats. Most legislation now has some language in it that the principles of the treaty have to be considered or taken into account.

 

[aitkenmike]

Personally I feel there is a bit of tension and Maori are low key mad at Europeans. I live in New Zealand and have been here for over a decade.

Like I’m in work this morning and Maori dude was talking about how the Whites basically stole their land and so on.

It’s a touchy subject, I tend to not even go there with this discussion. It is uncomfortable to discuss in NZ.

I'm sorry reality hurts. Also, I've never really felt that tension that you mention. Maori generally aren't mad at Europeans as individuals, they are mad at the crown, or at the government as a whole.

 

[The Big Yin]

I've been visiting New Zealand off and on for the past 25 years, the last time being 2 years ago. Over that time I've seen a massive difference in the feel of the place. It feels very oppressive with all the rules and regulations and the Chinese influence is stark. In contrast I was shocked at how crime ridden Christchurch was in 2022 compared to the 1990s.

I've had nothing but good experiences with Maori there, despite knowing they are over represented in crime and alcohol related incidents. It's a complex issue that I'd struggle to understand, but my feeling is from speaking with my friends over there (white & Maori) that they are seeing their society slide downwards and are pissed off. Especially the Maori who see their standing being eroded

 

[aitkenmike]

I've been visiting New Zealand off and on for the past 25 years, the last time being 2 years ago. Over that time I've seen a massive difference in the feel of the place. It feels very oppressive with all the rules and regulations and the Chinese influence is stark.

Wtf are you talking about?

 

[The Big Yin]

Wtf are you talking about?

My personal opinion, what else

 

[A Very Serious Cat]

I've been visiting New Zealand off and on for the past 25 years, the last time being 2 years ago. Over that time I've seen a massive difference in the feel of the place. It feels very oppressive with all the rules and regulations and the Chinese influence is stark. In contrast I was shocked at how crime ridden Christchurch was in 2022 compared to the 1990s.

I've had nothing but good experiences with Maori there, despite knowing they are over represented in crime and alcohol related incidents. It's a complex issue that I'd struggle to understand, but my feeling is from speaking with my friends over there (white & Maori) that they are seeing their society slide downwards and are pissed off. Especially the Maori who see their standing being eroded

Mang of the main city centers do seem to be sliding in terms of safety and the general feel. The pathetic sentences handed to violent criminals so they can back out reoffending in no time is big issue for many people.



You've been visiting nz off an on for 25 years... you're not the real big yin are you?

 

[The Big Yin]

Mang of the main city centers do seem to be sliding in terms of safety and the general feel. The pathetic sentences handed to violent criminals so they can back out reoffending in no time is big issue for many people.



You've been visiting nz off an on for 25 years... you're not the real big yin are you?

My best mate lives in Christchurch and has been telling me the same thing around pathetic sentencing. He's so fucked off with it that he's considering moving back to the UK with his German wife. I've had to enlighten him on just how different the UK is to when he left in 1995.

Alas I'm not oor Billy. Just a hairy bastard with a Scottish dad.

 

[Natural Order]

 

[650lb Sumo]

When it comes to the street crime, safety and so on, people do associate Australia with crime to some extent, but both Australia and New Zealand have very high meth use levels. Sometimes in NZ they call it 'P'.

Australia has the highest reported methamphetamine (ice) use per capita in the world, according to the latest data on illicit drug consumption released today.


When comparing wastewater data from 27 countries last year, New Zealand ranked fourth highest in terms of consumption behind Australia, United States and the Czech Republic.

Recent data on seizures showed significant increases in the drug being found.

The National Drug Intelligence Bureau (NDIB) reported a 222 per cent increase in the amount of meth seized by both Customs and police in 2019, when compared with the three-year average from 2016 to 2018.

/

Apparently the problem has continued to worsen since that article was written three years ago, too. Criminal gang membership is also high in NZ, and it's the Maori gangs shifting a lot of the P.

Although most people identifying as Maori actually are of mixed heritage.

 

[A Very Serious Cat]

My best mate lives in Christchurch and has been telling me the same thing around pathetic sentencing. He's so fucked off with it that he's considering moving back to the UK with his German wife. I've had to enlighten him on just how different the UK is to when he left in 1995.

Alas I'm not oor Billy. Just a hairy bastard with a Scottish dad.

I'm in london right now and even though many nz centers are sliding they're not nearly as grim as what some of what I've seen here. I'd suggest moving out to a smaller place first if he's able as they're still much better than the cities

 

[A Very Serious Cat]

When it comes to the street crime, safety and so on, people do associate Australia with crime to some extent, but both Australia and New Zealand have very high meth use levels. Sometimes in NZ they call it 'P'.

Australia has the highest reported methamphetamine (ice) use per capita in the world, according to the latest data on illicit drug consumption released today.


When comparing wastewater data from 27 countries last year, New Zealand ranked fourth highest in terms of consumption behind Australia, United States and the Czech Republic.

Recent data on seizures showed significant increases in the drug being found.

The National Drug Intelligence Bureau (NDIB) reported a 222 per cent increase in the amount of meth seized by both Customs and police in 2019, when compared with the three-year average from 2016 to 2018.

/

Apparently the problem has continued to worsen since that article was written three years ago, too. Criminal gang membership is also high in NZ, and it's the Maori gangs shifting a lot of the P.

Although most people identifying as Maori actually are of mixed heritage.

Yes I'd say meth is the cause of many of the crime problems, either the users or the dealers like the gangs. There's also crimes like 'ram raiding' where even kids would steal vehicles to smash into shops to rob them, these may or may not be gang related as well

 

[650lb Sumo]

When it comes to the street crime, safety and so on, people do associate Australia with crime to some extent, but both Australia and New Zealand have very high meth use levels. Sometimes in NZ they call it 'P'.

Australia has the highest reported methamphetamine (ice) use per capita in the world, according to the latest data on illicit drug consumption released today.


When comparing wastewater data from 27 countries last year, New Zealand ranked fourth highest in terms of consumption behind Australia, United States and the Czech Republic.

Recent data on seizures showed significant increases in the drug being found.

The National Drug Intelligence Bureau (NDIB) reported a 222 per cent increase in the amount of meth seized by both Customs and police in 2019, when compared with the three-year average from 2016 to 2018.

/

Apparently the problem has continued to worsen since that article was written three years ago, too. Criminal gang membership is also high in NZ, and it's the Maori gangs shifting a lot of the P.

Although most people identifying as Maori actually are of mixed heritage.

I thought 'I bet Vice have a documentary on this', and actually a perfunctory search didn't turn one up, but there's this, from about two years ago:



And it turns out they have just banned public wearing of gang patches today!

First arrest as New Zealand ban on displaying gang patches comes into force

Ban on public display of gang insignia is part of a wider crackdown on gangs that some experts say could infringe on rights while doing nothing to cut gang membership

www.theguardian.com

New Zealand’s gangs will need to hide their gang patches or face prosecution after a new law banning gang insignia in public came into force on Thursday – a move critics believe could risk breaching the Bill of Rights and do little to reduce gang membership.

At midnight, it became illegal for gang members to display signs, symbols or patches – large insignia sewn on to jackets, for example – anywhere in public. This includes displaying insignia on their clothing or vehicles.

Breaches of the ban carry a sentence of up to six months imprisonment or a $5,000 fine, and insignia would have to be forfeited and destroyed.

Three minutes after the ban came into effect, a Mongrel Mob member based in Hastings was arrested for displaying a large Mongrel Mob sign on the dashboard of his car, the police confirmed to the Guardian. He was issued a summons to appear in court and the sign was confiscated, police said.

 

[A Very Serious Cat]

I thought 'I bet Vice have a documentary on this', and actually a perfunctory search didn't turn one up, but there's this, from about two years ago:



And it turns out they have just banned public wearing of gang patches today!

First arrest as New Zealand ban on displaying gang patches comes into force

Ban on public display of gang insignia is part of a wider crackdown on gangs that some experts say could infringe on rights while doing nothing to cut gang membership

www.theguardian.com

New Zealand’s gangs will need to hide their gang patches or face prosecution after a new law banning gang insignia in public came into force on Thursday – a move critics believe could risk breaching the Bill of Rights and do little to reduce gang membership.

At midnight, it became illegal for gang members to display signs, symbols or patches – large insignia sewn on to jackets, for example – anywhere in public. This includes displaying insignia on their clothing or vehicles.

Breaches of the ban carry a sentence of up to six months imprisonment or a $5,000 fine, and insignia would have to be forfeited and destroyed.

Three minutes after the ban came into effect, a Mongrel Mob member based in Hastings was arrested for displaying a large Mongrel Mob sign on the dashboard of his car, the police confirmed to the Guardian. He was issued a summons to appear in court and the sign was confiscated, police said.

A benefit of the patches is it points out who the shitheads are. Luckily for me they're mostly in north and I've only ever seen a handful in person my whole life

 

[aitkenmike]

My personal opinion, what else

'Oppressive' and 'Chinese influence is stark' is bonkers. That is much more you bringing your own perceptions and biases and seeing what you want to see.

There are definitely growing crime problems, while still being a pretty safe society, and homelessness is an issue in the big city centres. Sentences for violent crime can definitely be pathetic, and this Government has changed some of the sentencing regulations limiting some of the 'discounts' on sentence for various factors, so hopefully we start seeing a bit of a difference there.

A lot of the increase in crime is due to the increase in homelessness, but also somewhat out of our control - over the last 10 years or so Australia has been deporting a large number of gang members and criminals that were born in NZ, but moved to Australia as young children with their family (so called 501 deportees) and that is pushing some of the gang culture here towards even more explicit violent crimes and firearms, rather than being more under the radar and the violence mainly being kept to between gang factions. This Government is also trying to crack down on gangs, some in good ways, some in bad. We'll see if that makes a tangible change.

 

[The Big Yin]

'Oppressive' and 'Chinese influence is stark' is bonkers. That is much more you bringing your own perceptions and biases and seeing what you want to see.

I think you just can't see it if you're living in it. I was threatened by cops at 1am with some crazy fine for breaching freedom camping rules as me and the wife were parked up with a coffee. There Seemed to be micro rules for everything.

And as for the Chinese - every beauty spot I visited was ruined by Chinese tourists with shops cashing in hard. It did make us laugh the endless signs in the bathrooms showing 'do not squat'

 

[650lb Sumo]

Yes I'd say meth is the cause of many of the crime problems, either the users or the dealers like the gangs. There's also crimes like 'ram raiding' where even kids would steal vehicles to smash into shops to rob them, these may or may not be gang related as well

I dated a Wellington policewoman for a while and she said they were very brazen with their meth brewing, importing and dealing, and this was a few years ago. There was a 'P house' across the street from a police station for ages before they figured it out apparently. And it's got worse since then.

There was a ram raid epidemic in the UK in the 90s but they seemed to get it under control. But now it's growing again.

A benefit of the patches is it points out who the shitheads are. Luckily for me they're mostly in north and I've only ever seen a handful in person my whole life

South Island is too cold for the Maoris they don't like it too much.

(Still some obviously, I saw them. Just not as many, and before the Brits came apparently there were very few.)

*I am not equating Maoris with organised criminals!*