How we ruined grappling Sports

[rmongler]

Well it's a worthless skill in mma and will get you pounded out or choked.

You are incorrect; your incorrectness is on display in every event, every week, in every promotion out there.

 

[jack36767]

Well it's a worthless skill in mma and will get you pounded out or choked.

Sounds like another organization has lost touch with grappling sports oridional purpose and turned grappling into a silly game where it's strategic to give up your back for points.

Just like judo and wrestling.

Thanks for the assistance in supporting my threads title.

This is EXACTLY how we ruined grappling sports!!

You are out of touch. In mma strikers regularly use turtle to escape to their feet using hand control. Staying in guard gets you pounded out or decisioned. Strikers have begun using folkstyle bottom technique to get away from bjj dudes who can’t ride and only can lock around the waist to prevent the opponent from escaping. Then have no ability to choke or return the opponent to the ground. Knowing how to hand control or handfight on the mat is an essential skill for mma. (I know it’s hard for you to keep up).

Lol and I’ve looked into you.. there’s a reason you suddenly clarified “most points for my school not in the state”

Also wrestling has been returning to TV. And you never had an actual reply to the corruption issues with UWW

So yes.. out of touch with

1. Actual recent world results since the US starting paying its athletes
2. The evolution of mma
3. About high level folkstyle because you think bragging about points records in Kentucky means anything
4. What rules actually make a difference or matter

Oh and it’s comical the locking hands rule prevents you from teaching people to drive through a takedown

It is hilarious imagining “what are you doing Jonhnny” in a combo of an Afrikaner and southern accent

 

[-guerilla-]

You are out of touch. In mma strikers regularly use turtle to escape to their feet using hand control. Staying in guard gets you pounded out or decisioned. Strikers have begun using folkstyle bottom technique to get away from bjj dudes who can’t ride and only can lock around the waist to prevent the opponent from escaping. Then have no ability to choke or return the opponent to the ground. Knowing how to hand control or handfight on the mat is an essential skill for mma. (I know it’s hard for you to keep up).

Lol and I’ve looked into you.. there’s a reason you suddenly clarified “most points for my school not in the state”

Also wrestling has been returning to TV. And you never had an actual reply to the corruption issues with UWW

So yes.. out of touch with

1. Actual recent world results since the US starting paying its athletes
2. The evolution of mma
3. About high level folkstyle because you think bragging about points records in Kentucky means anything
4. What rules actually make a difference or matter

Oh and it’s comical the locking hands rule prevents you from teaching people to drive through a takedown

It is hilarious imagining “what are you doing Jonhnny” in a combo of an Afrikaner and southern accent

I was raised in Hawaii...
no twang in my accent.

I understand your frustration, English can be confusing.
I said I broke all the points records for my team in the state championship.

That means my athletes did better than all the other coaches athletes in the state championship history for my school.

you hassled me for "credentials" so my statements aren't bragging.

Now let's talk about math and facts...

Folkstyle wrestling has TERRIBLE tv ratings

American TV ratings almost killed olympic wrestling.

When it looked like wrestling was gonna be dropped by the Olympics Judo changed its rules banning any grabbing of the legs so wrestlers(recently "unemployed") wouldn't take over Judo.

Folkstyle wrestling lack of popularity almost got wrestling dropped from the Olympics and subsequently ruined competition JUDO

America invented its own style of wrestling whos lack of popularity almost RUINED 2 OTHER GRAPPLNG SPORTS!

THAT'S SOME EPIC LAMENESS!

now since I have proven folkstyle as the "herpes" of the grappling world let's move on to MMA.

54% of UFC top 15 ahletes are not American and thus have never trained in folkstyle, that means that Americans are statistically losing in the biggest mma tournament in the USA.

When folkstyle meets freestyle it gets crushed in the Olympics.

It's easy to get stars in your eyes when you see a few champions...its a hero worship phenomenon...but you gotta do the math to understand the science of MMA.

Dont fall for the sales and marketing...

 

[-guerilla-]

You are incorrect; your incorrectness is on display in every event, every week, in every promotion out there.

Just cause all you see is folkstyle thats dosent mean that's all there is.

You have to look deeper than promo fan videos

Did you bet the farm on brock lesnar?

 

[-guerilla-]

At 7 min 10 sec you can hear about rule manipulation in an attempt to advantage the bottom athlete and force the action to the feet.



This requirement to change your grip depending on the position of your opponent causes many folkstyle athletes to allow their opponent an opportunity to escape in MMA because they sometimes revert to the scholastic rules under pressure.

This was done in a misguided attempt to make the sport more exciting to television audiences.

Instead of adoption olympic wrestling America invented its own unique style of special "scholastic or folkstyle" wrestling and have been hyper-manipulating the rules ever since.

 

[jack36767]

I was raised in Hawaii...
no twang in my accent.

I understand your frustration, English can be confusing.
I said I broke all the points records for my team in the state championship.

That means my athletes did better than all the other coaches athletes in the state championship history for my school.

you hassled me for "credentials" so my statements aren't bragging.

Now let's talk about math and facts...

Folkstyle wrestling has TERRIBLE tv ratings

American TV ratings almost killed olympic wrestling.

When it looked like wrestling was gonna be dropped by the Olympics Judo changed its rules banning any grabbing of the legs so wrestlers(recently "unemployed") wouldn't take over Judo.

Folkstyle wrestling lack of popularity almost got wrestling dropped from the Olympics and subsequently ruined competition JUDO

America invented its own style of wrestling whos lack of popularity almost RUINED 2 OTHER GRAPPLNG SPORTS!

THAT'S SOME EPIC LAMENESS!

now since I have proven folkstyle as the "herpes" of the grappling world let's move on to MMA.

54% of UFC top 15 ahletes are not American and thus have never trained in folkstyle, that means that Americans are statistically losing in the biggest mma tournament in the USA.

When folkstyle meets freestyle it gets crushed in the Olympics.

It's easy to get stars in your eyes when you see a few champions...its a hero worship phenomenon...but you gotta do the math to understand the science of MMA.

Dont fall for the sales and marketing...

Again you don’t keep up with the meta or what you are watching and are either 5, 10, or 15 years out of date. You twist stats for your point. You deliberately were vague and implied you had credentials you did not really have..

The popularity is not about individual rules. I’m sorry you don’t know how to teach hard finishes to takedowns

Aw I was hoping your ranting was in that Afrikaner accent

 

[rmongler]

Just cause all you see is folkstyle thats dosent mean that's all there is.

You have to look deeper than promo fan videos

Did you bet the farm on brock lesnar?

It is evident that you don't actually watch MMA, so you don't know what happens in MMA.

 

[-guerilla-]

Again you don’t keep up with the meta or what you are watching and are either 5, 10, or 15 years out of date. You twist stats for your point. You deliberately were vague and implied you had credentials you did not really have..

The popularity is not about individual rules. I’m sorry you don’t know how to teach hard finishes to takedowns

Aw I was hoping your ranting was in that Afrikaner accent

On your personal attack:
Actually I speak "British English" with a mild west coast Pacific islander accent so you Tennessee types would probably mock me anyway when I say trash bin rather than can.

I always got a kick out of the indigenous southerners telling me "u tawk funny"



On the actual topic of this thread:
Read it and weep...
http://rankingmma.com/ufc-rankings/
**Updated daily & within 24 hours after major MMA events**

 

[-guerilla-]

It is evident that you don't actually watch MMA, so you don't know what happens in MMA.

You don't have to fear math.

Dont be angry with numbers.

Just because American folk style wrestling has done a lot of damage to International grappling and Americans have trouble with math sometimes.

 

[yetanother]

If 54% of fighters in the UFC are not American and yet most champions are folkstyle wrestlers how is math on your side?

 

[-guerilla-]

If 54% of fighters in the UFC are not American and yet most champions are folkstyle wrestlers how is math on your side?

That's the problem with hero worship.

It clouds your judgement

Most of the top 15 athletes are not folkstyle wrestlers

If you really do believe that the UFC champion is the greatest fighter on Earth in that weight clas you've been sold a fake wrestling hero worship package.

Fight sports have always been plauged by champions who were pushed in rank or avoid the best contenders.

Also the UFC knows that having a bunch of foreign champions is bad for business.

Brock lesnar ring a bell?

 

[yetanother]

That's the problem with hero worship.

It clouds your judgement

Most of the top 15 athletes are not folkstyle wrestlers

If you really do believe that the UFC champion is the greatest fighter on Earth in that weight clas you've been sold a fake wrestling hero worship package.

Who do you think is the best fighter in that weight class the number 100 guy or the KSW champ?

 

[-guerilla-]

Who do you think is the best fighter in that weight class the number 100 guy or the KSW champ?

That's the 1 million dollar question.

Is it always the champ...NO

 

[jack36767]

If 54% of fighters in the UFC are not American and yet most champions are folkstyle wrestlers how is math on your side?

If 54% of fighters in the UFC are not American and yet most champions are folkstyle wrestlers how is math on your side?

He’s trying to make a convaluted point that hopefully eventually the non folk wrestlers (or people that actually train it) or other backgrounds will overtake the “evil mericans”. Which might happen but not for the reasons he thinks. Wrestling in the US has found ways to get money to its athletes and keep them competing so they have been less and less likely to do mma.. because they are winning world medals
(Something he ignores so obtusely he is making it funny)

He also is making even a bigger point.. he checks “sherdog stats” but by his own admission hasn’t really watched mma for at least 10 maybe 15 years. And I know you’re not as familiar with wrestling so what hes saying with “set the points record for my school” rather than “my team took 4th in the Kentucky state championships” or “I coached a tiny school to have 5 placers and a Champ” is deliberately making his accomplishment sound bigger than it most likely was. He could have set the “points record” because a couple of kids got a few pins before being eliminated or he could have gotten second.

The only reason someone who coached wrestling in the US for 15 years would phrase it the way he did is to make it sound bigger than it was. It’d be like me saying “In my first year as head coach, I led my school to its best season ever. Took second I’m our conference, and had our highest ever postseason placer and set our postseason points record”.. technically accurate. But the real way of saying it is, “I was the first coach to recruit more than 5 kids to the team, we took second in a weak conference but the kids got better, injuries killed us at the end of the year and my best kid got a gift draw at sectionals and took advantage but he also wrestled his ass off. Young team improved but long way to go” it’s a big difference in presentation

 

[-guerilla-]

The 2 most celibrated folkstyle wrestlers in modern UFC history have NEVER faced an accomplished freestyle wrestler in their UFC or MMA career.

Do you think thats an accident?

The only freestyle wrestler that the current heavyweight UFC champion has ever faced diddent even make the 2020 olympic team for Australia!

 

[jack36767]

The 2 most celibrated folkstyle wrestlers in modern UFC history have NEVER faced an accomplished freestyle wrestler in their UFC career.

Do you think thats an accident?

Sigh, of all the points to make about match making that is by far so weak it’s pathetic

 

[yetanother]

The 2 most celibrated folkstyle wrestlers in modern UFC history have NEVER faced an accomplished freestyle wrestler in their UFC career.

Do you think thats an accident?

Well, there aren't a lot of freestyle wrestling contenders. That's not a point that works in your arguments. Khabib is a freestyle wrestlers but he actually uses *riding* a lot.

 

[-guerilla-]

Well, there aren't a lot of freestyle wrestling contenders. That's not a point that works in your arguments. Khabib is a freestyle wrestlers but he actually uses *riding* a lot.

Absolutely, great observation.

You ever wonder why there are so few freestyle wrestlers in the UFC?

 

[-guerilla-]

He’s trying to make a convaluted point that hopefully eventually the non folk wrestlers (or people that actually train it) or other backgrounds will overtake the “evil mericans”. Which might happen but not for the reasons he thinks. Wrestling in the US has found ways to get money to its athletes and keep them competing so they have been less and less likely to do mma.. because they are winning world medals
(Something he ignores so obtusely he is making it funny)

He also is making even a bigger point.. he checks “sherdog stats” but by his own admission hasn’t really watched mma for at least 10 maybe 15 years. And I know you’re not as familiar with wrestling so what hes saying with “set the points record for my school” rather than “my team took 4th in the Kentucky state championships” or “I coached a tiny school to have 5 placers and a Champ” is deliberately making his accomplishment sound bigger than it most likely was. He could have set the “points record” because a couple of kids got a few pins before being eliminated or he could have gotten second.

The only reason someone who coached wrestling in the US for 15 years would phrase it the way he did is to make it sound bigger than it was. It’d be like me saying “In my first year as head coach, I led my school to its best season ever. Took second I’m our conference, and had our highest ever postseason placer and set our postseason points record”.. technically accurate. But the real way of saying it is, “I was the first coach to recruit more than 5 kids to the team, we took second in a weak conference but the kids got better, injuries killed us at the end of the year and my best kid got a gift draw at sectionals and took advantage but he also wrestled his ass off. Young team improved but long way to go” it’s a big difference in presentation

actually I was trying to make the point that constant rule manipulation by governing bodies in an attempt to make a sport "more exciting" for television audiences is a net negative.

Also that America should not invent its own particular unique style of wrestling and should instead compete with the world at the Olympic version of wrestling

Although This Thread Got Hijacked by a "my karate is stronger" folkstyle vs. Freestyle debate I still find it quite interesting but hopefully down the road we can get back to discussing rule manipulation and grappling Sports

 

[yetanother]

Absolutely, great observation.

You ever wonder why there are so few freestyle wrestlers in the UFC?

I would guess it's because they aren't good enough at mma rather then some anti freestyle conspiracy. I don't think that most countries with decent freestyle have mma clubs that don't suck or even decent BJJ.