How good was Chael Sonnen at his peak?

[textwarrior]

Sorry for being the new MMA fan who asks dumb questions but I'm still learning about the history of the sport and the fighters from previous generations.

I watch Chael on YouTube a lot but it occurred to me that I never really watched him fight.

So I went to fight pass and watched a few and he appears to be a good wrestler but his striking was not that great by today's standards. I watched his fight with Anderson and he was a few seconds away from beating the guy people thought was the goat at the time and ending Anderson's streak. His record is like 34-17 which is average and he was apparently susceptible to submissions and good BJJ.

What am I missing?

A silver medal fighter

 

[SakurabasEar]

All antics and other BS aside, Sonnen was a very good pressure grappler. He had fast and educated takedowns, and would even be one of the best in MW today (thats not a huge compliment, as the mw division today is shit and nothing compared to what it once was)

His striking was always basic, only slightly elevated by some of his PED use. Juiced Sonnon could throw a fairly good straight right, but everything else was limited.

As everyone has stated above, he had been submitted a lot. Much it having to do with how aggressive he was in many of those grappling exchanges. Tito by comparison was actually much more defensively responsible in this regard.

Comparing Tito and Sonnen is sort of complex, and probably deserves its own thread. I just wish Chael made it into the UFC earlier. Overall he was big personality, solid fighter. But he certainly belonged, and was UFC caliber in the old sense

 

[Sycho Sid]

People mentioning the Filho win most likely never saw that fight.

Filho was fighting a handicap match against Chael and Filho's invisible ghost opponents.


That said, Chael was what he was. A strong pressure fighting wrestler, who pretty much had no other path to victory. Had he beat Silva, he would have joined Josh Barnett in rarified company of winning a belt only to be stripped of it immediately for melting a cup. But he was solid top 10 to top 5 for awhile.

 

[brackis1]

At his very pico; he still had trash sub defense and wilted easily.

 

[brackis1]

People mentioning the Filho win most likely never saw that fight.

Filho was fighting a handicap match against Chael and Filho's invisible ghost opponents.


That said, Chael was what he was. A strong pressure fighting wrestler, who pretty much had no other path to victory. Had he beat Silva, he would have joined Josh Barnett in rarified company of winning a belt only to be stripped of it immediately for melting a cup. But he was solid top 10 to top 5 for awhile.

And still forget that earlier on, Filho tapped the shit out of Chael who wined like a brat lol

Chael had some of the least damaging offense of anyone to ever be a "high level fighter"
His ONLY finish in like 20 WEC+UFC fights was tapping Stann lol

 

[YoyoDS17]

In a world without Anderson Silva he'd have been a world champion. His biggest problem was inconsistency. But second biggest was fighting in the era of the best champions in the sports history.

Cheal also used PEDs… multiple times

 

[Dont troll me]

Not very.

 

[cooks1]

Dan Henderson has a “bad” record too. That’s what happens when you jump into the deep end right away.

Awful Comparison. Hendo had multiple straps against top competition in other orgs.

 

[mahavishnunj]

Good enough to clown prime Anderson Silva for 4¾ rounds

This is true, but Anderson looked like he hadn't even been in a fight after that brutal mauling for 4 rounds.

 

[Gamer2k4]

34-17 in the UFC is average?

Sounds right to me. The best fighters have almost no losses at all. The worst fighters quickly get the boot. A ration of 2:1 means you're good enough to stick around but not much more. That is to say - average.

 

[jx820]

Cheal also used PEDs… multiple times

They paid dividends.

 

[cburm]

He was amazing in strikeforce and did very well in the ufc infact if there was no spider hed a ben the champ but anderson was the greatest to ever do it

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

Awful Comparison. Hendo had multiple straps against top competition in other orgs.

Was only citing another guy with a “poor” UFC record. I say poor in quotes because I don’t think going .500 against top competition = poor performance. Beating multiple champions and title challengers and then taking Anderson to the limit is a very impressive run.

Chael was de facto WEC champion as well. Dominated the replacement when Filho pulled out and then beat Filho and only didn’t get the belt because Filho missed weight (which makes no sense).

He had a very successful career.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

This is true, but Anderson looked like he hadn't even been in a fight after that brutal mauling for 4 rounds.

Still a hell of a lot better than Franklin, Henderson and Vitor, who are all middleweight legends.

 

[BlueRunner]

Chael had made millions at that point and became a star, he didn't need MMA anymore and never took it as seriously again.

That is what all the losers say. You sound like a conor fangurl clone.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

And still forget that earlier on, Filho tapped the shit out of Chael who wined like a brat lol

Chael had some of the least damaging offense of anyone to ever be a "high level fighter"
His ONLY finish in like 20 WEC+UFC fights was tapping Stann lol

I’m not sure that makes what he did *less* impressive though. Marquardt, Bisping, Okami, etc. are not easy guys to get through 15 minutes with if you can’t hurt/finish them. Considering he had virtually zero power he did really well.

 

[brackis1]

I’m not sure that makes what he did *less* impressive though. Marquardt, Bisping, Okami, etc. are not easy guys to get through 15 minutes with if you can’t hurt/finish them. Considering he had virtually zero power he did really well.

I mean; for roiding its pretty sad he still didn't have power.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

I mean; for roiding its pretty sad he still didn't have power.

Agree, and I’m sure he was literally sad lol. But all a man can do is go to war with the tools that he has.

 

[pankrat]

Sounds right to me. The best fighters have almost no losses at all. The worst fighters quickly get the boot. A ration of 2:1 means you're good enough to stick around but not much more. That is to say - average.

That's like the most simpleton take you can have. Simpleton even by sherdog standards.

A guy who beats two to5 ers and losses to the champ has a ratio of 2:1 yet how retarded you have to be to call that "average"

 

[pankrat]

And still forget that earlier on, Filho tapped the shit out of Chael who wined like a brat lol

Chael had some of the least damaging offense of anyone to ever be a "high level fighter"
His ONLY finish in like 20 WEC+UFC fights was tapping Stann lol

I’m not sure that makes what he did *less* impressive though. Marquardt, Bisping, Okami, etc. are not easy guys to get through 15 minutes with if you can’t hurt/finish them. Considering he had virtually zero power he did really well.

Tapping Shogun, Suloev and Stann, for such a pillow-fistow wrestler as him, is actually not a bad list of finishes.