How do you NOT benefit from lifting?

Discussion in 'Strength & Conditioning Discussion' started by omgitsrick, May 12, 2008.

  1. omgitsrick

    omgitsrick Green Belt

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    Alot of people argue about how lifting is detrimental for MMA, or how it makes you slow and not explosive. Others argue it helps you and makes you MORE explosive. Pro lifting people have more proof whereas the others don't really have factual evidence to back up their claims. But if lifting really helps that much why do alot of pro fighters succeed without it? And if a fighter who succeeds without lifting starts lifting (and im not talking about curls and tricep extensions) will he be an even better fighter?

    for example: If Fedor got a good powerlifting routine and started using it, would he be a better fighter because of it? Would it be possible for him to be a worse fighter?
     
  2. ThinkGreen

    ThinkGreen Der √úbermensch

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    If someone starts focusing too much on lifting and not enough on technique then I think they could become a "worse" fighter.
     
  3. omgitsrick

    omgitsrick Green Belt

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    This is true, but I'm talking strictly about supplementing your fighting WITH lifting.
     
  4. chia

    chia POWER OF THE GLOW

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    Almost everything is beneficial, but MMA is so complex that it is all about priority. You can go overboard on conditioning, on strength training, on supplements, even training if it is cutting into your recovery time.

    There can hardly be any detriment to being too strong, but sometimes stronger fighters learn to rely on strength and power instead of technique, and this can affect the way they learn certain techniques. They may get used to powering through certain moves and forget the technical aspects which can be detrimental when facing a larger opponent. Relying too much on strength can also drain the energy systems quickly and affect stamina (ala Mark Coleman vs. Mo Smith).

    That said, I believe the majority of fighters out there could definitely benefit from increasing their strength levels, but it is up to them to figure out their own priorities as a fighter. All forms of training take a toll on the body and everyone needs time for recovery while avoiding injuries.
     
  5. Rare Chestnuts

    Rare Chestnuts Banned Banned

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    Every fighter could benefit from being stronger. The problem is that your possible training time and recovery abilities aren't unlimited. Every hour you spend in the weight room is an hour you can't spend practicing your skills or working on your conditioning. You have to find the balance that works for you based on what your goals are and where your weaknesses lie.
     
  6. Brad Morris

    Brad Morris Green Belt Professional Fighter

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    Strength is a factor in a fight, if all else is equal than the stronger fighter will have an advantage. But there are so many variables in a fight.

    If a good fighter supplements his training with a smart lifting program then yes he will reap good benefits. But if a fighter starts to focus on strength alone he risks keeping his many other training areas sharp, such as timing, speed, endurance, skill/technique work etc.
     
  7. Jaxx

    Jaxx Green Belt

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    From Ross...

    'Many athletes become obsessed with weight room numbers. They focus too much attention towards the weight room. Rather than improving as a fighter, their focus shifts towards improving as a weight lifter. They become more interested in lifting 10 more pounds, as opposed to throwing 10 more punches per round.

    You will not learn how to fight in the weight room. You will not earn any points with the judges by boasting of an impressive bench press. No matter what you do in training, it must contribute to your improvement as an athlete. If your strength program does not offer specific results, it is not worth your time and energy. Remember, the goal of any combat sport is to defeat your opponent, not to lift the greatest load in the weight room.'


    RossTraining - Articles
     
  8. Mumrik

    Mumrik Silver Belt

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    What makes you think he doesn't already have a solid lifting routine? The man is strong.
     
  9. spiral

    spiral Banned Banned

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    I remember reading somewhere that Fedor actually did heavy compound lifts for judo before he started MMA. I also remember an interview where he says that it's better to fight heavy people to gain stength than lifting heavy weights... this might be true with judo, where you actually *lift* and throw peoples, but with other martial arts maybe this would not make do. I know *my* judo increased a lot with lifting, that's for sure ^^
     
  10. Donut62

    Donut62 Black Belt

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    The 4 replies in a row from Chia, Rare Chestnuts, Brad Morris, and Jaxx are all spot on.
     
  11. takeahnase

    takeahnase watching the swarm

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    Lifting makes you slow.
     
  12. WanderingSpirit

    WanderingSpirit White Belt

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    If i remember Fedor actually was in a stage where he did powerlifting.
     
  13. joshetc

    joshetc butthole hurts from teh gay

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    Right.

    Fighting trainers correlate bodybuilding with lifting weights. Strict bodybuilders, obviously, aren't going to be very good fighters compared to professionals. The reason has nothing to do with them lifting, and everything to do with them not training fighting.

    Most people are very narrow minded. If most people are big and bad fighters, it must be them being "big" that makes them a bad fighter. People don't realize there are numerous examples across MMA of fighters that got stronger and became beasts at the same time. BJ Penn didn't suddenly become 10x better at BJJ in the last year or two, hes an order of magnitude more athletic than he previously was, though. Anyone that trains fighting, then adds maximal strength training without removing other fighting training is going to become a better fighter.
     
  14. krellik

    krellik Gimli son of Cisco

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    You will not become a magically worse fighter by raising your max strength levels, you do risk of becoming a worse fighter if strength training takes to much out of you so you cant focus 100% on your martial arts training...

    Extreme example, if you would train fighting 6 days a week and started lifting weights and the added strain on your recoupery reduced your martial arts training to 3 days a week it would surely hurt your tech, it might be ballanced out by your added athleticism but propably not.. Now of course thats not a situation we should put ourselves in and there are plenty of great ways of combining martial arts, strength and conditioning, but it surely isnt an easy thing to do if your a serious fighter!
     
  15. Klotz

    Klotz Shalom

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    Fighters that are the best in the world are that way because they are the best in the world. Fighters who aren't born the best benefit greatly from strength training.
     
  16. krellik

    krellik Gimli son of Cisco

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    Some of them also have work ethics that are out of this work and trains smarter than anyone else...
     
  17. maori rule all

    maori rule all Blue Belt

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    why can't life be perfect and the fight situation be based on powerlifting/strength training. Damm it Damm it Damm it.









    in all seriousness though, I agree completly with everyone's replies.
     
  18. BayAreaGuy

    BayAreaGuy Good Day

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    The proof for weight lifting not making you slow is noting that Bruce Lee was an avid weight lifter and credited it with giving him speed and power.



    "But if lifting really helps that much why do alot of pro fighters succeed without it? "


    Because weights isn't the only form of strength training the say way BJJ isn't the only form of submission grappling.


    Fedor said he hasn't lifted weights since he started fighting, what he does is he does push ups and dips really fast, and lots of pull ups and hitting tires for "speed and power". Being 225 and doing those excersies as fast as he can, that's a good workout right there.
     
  19. Mumrik

    Mumrik Silver Belt

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    And throwing people around all day. One of those being his "little" brother, a far bigger man.
     

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