How Bitter Are the Gracies?

[mkw]

BJJ is as ubiquitous as karate once was. I doubt they're bitter. Their family's product is more popular than ever, entrenched in nearly every corner of the globe.

 

[HHJ]

I don't think they are so bitter. They have their place forever in mma history and you'll never be rid of them.

 

[Mike]

They've always seemed pretty bitter. Probably doesn't help that there hasn't been a successful Gracie in mma for many years. The game has passed them by.

 

[Nobru]

I kind of chuckle, because I came in to MMA with UFC I.

I remember buying all the Gracie Video Tapes, with Rorion going on-and-on about "The Gracie Dynasty."

There is no more "Gracie Dynasty," only martial arts instructors in dojo's these days.

They had a good thing going, and their influence is unmistakable. However, as athletes, they're basically nothing (with a few exceptions).

They were basically bullies, but they did open the entire martial arts world to ground grappling. However, their striking is so bad, their standup is so outdated, that they cannot compete with just their "system."

The truth is there are better men, and better athletes all over the world — and, contrary to their dogma, and elite striker can knock the daylights out of a grappler, when they learn enough anti-grappling to keep things on their feet.

I'd say, right now, Khabib's Dagestanian mix of combat-Sambo, judo, and wrestling is the most perfect "style" right now today. However, Khabib is also a specimen for this style, and not everyone can implement it.

This is why professionals have A TEAM of coaches now, teaching more than one style, and tailoring specific teaching to each unique student. The Gracie's belief that "their style" is the best is a thing of the past.

In fact, other than Oliviera, almost no one uses guard-based BJJ anymore.

In today's advanced understanding of MMA, some combination of wrestling, Muay Thai, boxing, and domineering grappling styles (not passive grappling styles) are required to win, tailored to the individual's unique talents.

if you combine the best martial arts techniques indeed you can be a better fighter...
back when they used to claim BJJ was the best all alone martial art, they kind of had a point.
you change the rules and scoring criteria, you take off the GI, BJJ loses.
In the meantime everyone starts training BJJ, so it becomes more common, less surprising and less relevant overall.

 

[The Chosen]

Meanwhile in reality Roger Gracie and Kron Gracie became BJJ legends, Rener and Ryron's prodigy became a UFC title challenger, and Neiman Gracie is an elite MMA fighter.

Gracies are doing just fine.

So because Brian Ortega got destroyed and humiliated in a title match the Gracie dynasty is somehow revived to glory? What?

 

[NoStoneUnturned]

I’m light hearted and reasonably happy go lucky by nature. Many of the older Gracie clan seemed moody and overly serious which is the type of person I learned to keep at arms length a long long time ago.

As to bitter, don’t know, I’m sure some are. Royce’s life doesn’t seem great these days. Divorce and money issues but a great many people have that problem BJJ legend or no.

 

[Fatality]

This thread reminds me of when Royce came back to the UFC to fight Matt Hughes. A few of my buddies were all hyped about how awesome the fight would be. I tried to tell them Royce was going to get tooled but they just wouldn't hear it. Then they were annoyed at me when the fight went exactly how I said it would. GJJ is fine against untrained people or limited one-dimensional fighters but against a well rounded opponent you better have something else in your skill set or chances are you're going to get fucked up. I always got the impression that the Gracies took great offense to the idea that GJJ wasn't the be all end all of fighting.

 

[TJ177]

I don't think that they're bitter - most of them actually made a decent amount of money off of all the schools and DVDs (and online belt classes!).

The bitter ones are the ones like Ken Shamrock who weren't really any worse as fighters and were pioneers but were just bad with money and marketing.

 

[felmmando]

Then there are a lot of dirty stuff they've done like Royce kneeing Shamrock in the balls then being proud despite the clear replay.

Sounds to me like you answered your own question: he was self-satisfied, not bitter. Now, Shamrock had some cause to be bitter...

 

[JonJonesNeedle]

They aren't bitter but some of them are very conceited and arrogant. I remember Cub saying he couldn't workout at a good grappling gym due to the Gracies or something of that sort, since he was scheduled to fight Kron.

 

[Apollo33]

Most of them with a Gracie last name ended up opening pretty successful gyms.

I bet Rorian is bit bitter that no one is paying them a licensing fee.

Some of the more older delusional Gracies are probably bitter that MMA evolved past 1 dimensional BJJ.

 

[Buff]

I bet Rorian is bit bitter that no one is paying them a licensing fee.

Some of the more older delusional Gracies are probably bitter that MMA evolved past 1 dimensional BJJ.

I'd imagine that inventing the UFC to prove that the family's martial art was the GOAT, and then becoming a mere footnote in its history was pretty hard to swallow...

Also:

 

[RicardinhoPT]

I remember that fight. Renzo started with the excuses already before the fight. Don't take the fight if you're not fit enough to fight.

I loved it when Saku ran through the entire Gracie family. I guess it was more difficult for them to win if they didn't cherry pick their opponents or could bend the rules in their favour

 

[RicardinhoPT]

I'd imagine that inventing the UFC to prove that the family's martial art was the GOAT, and then becoming a mere footnote in its history was pretty hard to swallow...

Also:

View attachment 823139

The worst thing is that they didn't invent it, Art Davies invented it

 

[Buff]

The worst thing is that they didn't invent it, Art Davies invented it

That's not what FightPass says.

You could also give Jeff Blatnick a nod...

Rorion is going to beat that horse until he's sticking the dirt though, and who could blame him? Nobody would care otherwise.

 

[RicardinhoPT]

That's not what FightPass says.

You could also give Jeff Blatnick a nod...

Rorion is going to beat that horse until he's sticking the dirt though, and who could blame him? Nobody would care otherwise.

True. And those Fightpass stories are hilarious, little fact checking took place there

 

[davidlemonparty]

Couple of sore losers in the family, and a couple of embarassing events.
But they are professional athletes and very prideful people, so you can expect this. There are more tears and broken hearts after a 1-2 nobody loses a fight on the early prelims. It's the nature of competing at the highest level especially over decades like they have.

TL;dr Gracie's are cool yo

 

[Kertol]

That's because there is a seemingly endless supply of them. Every time I turn around there are 3 new Gracies I've never heard of before.

Some of them are not even real Gracies. Roger and Neiman took their mother’s surname.

Meanwhile in reality Roger Gracie and Kron Gracie became BJJ legends, Rener and Ryron's prodigy became a UFC title challenger, and Neiman Gracie is an elite MMA fighter.

Gracies are doing just fine.

That's because there is a seemingly endless supply of them. Every time I turn around there are 3 new Gracies I've never heard of before.

Some of them are not even real Gracies. Roger and Neiman took their mother’s surname.

 

[mmamxfan]

Probably pretty happy with the money they have made off their multiple gyms training dorks off Sherdog to become warriors.

 

[MrCoffee]

Great post. How often do you have sex with that thing in your avatar?

BACK OF THE LINE, BUD. For fucks sakes...