History repeats: Ngannou is also beating mostly high mileage fighters

[Claude]

you didn't ask whether or not fedor had mileage as well. you just said to name the fighters. i did. you're wrong. ngannou is 34 with 13 UFC fights lol stipe only has 5 more fights

High mileage = over 10 years of experience. That's the criteria used in this thread.

You mentioned 1 out of 12 top wins of Fedor.
I mentioned 5 out of 7 top wins of Ngannou.

Age is irrelevant.

You failed mate.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

High mileage = over 10 years of experience. That's the criteria used in this thread.

i don't care lol you're perpetuating a goofy narrative that relies on arbitrary criteria. ngannou's resume is full of just as many old dudes as anyone else's

 

[Claude]

i don't care lol you're perpetuating a goofy narrative that relies on arbitrary criteria. ngannou's resume is full of just as many old dudes as anyone else's

Not really arbitrary. Generally, fighters have around a good decade of fighting before they decline. Look at DC. Look at Stipe. They declined around a decade into their careers. Same happened to Fedor, Nog and many others. There are exceptions, but 10 years is a safe spot.

"Old" is irrelevant. A 35 year old fighter can be in his prime (DC) or way past it (Nog) depending on when he began fighting.

Much to learn still you have, young padawan.

 

[Yellowcrab]

Not really arbitrary. Generally, fighters have around a good decade of fighting before they decline. Look at DC. Look at Stipe. They declined around a decade into their careers. Same happened to Fedor, Nog and many others. There are exceptions, but 10 years is a safe spot.

DC declined while winning the HW title as a natural LHW. Fedor lost to a 40 years old natural MW while being a 34 years old natural HW.

A difference among others...

 

[Claude]

DC declined while winning the HW title as a natural LHW. Fedor lost to a 40 years old natural MW while being a 34 years old natural HW.

A difference among others...

Pretty much everything in that post is factually incorrect, lol.

 

[rakeleaves]

True, but he still starched Ruizenstruik and Blaydes within 1 round... Does anybody really think Volkov would beat him or Lewis should be favored in the rematch?

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Not really arbitrary. Generally, fighters have around a good decade of fighting before they decline.

in your opinion. plenty of fighters have stayed at an elite level for longer.

"Old" is irrelevant. A 35 year old fighter can be in his prime (DC) or way past it (Nog) depending on when he began fighting.

yes. and plenty of the all time best HWs have wins that fit the latter description.

 

[rakeleaves]

in your opinion. plenty of fighters have stayed at an elite level for longer.


yes. and plenty of the all time best HWs have wins that fit the latter description.

Not really in his opinion - this emperical. He said "generally", which means most - then you replied with "plenty", which means a lot over a longer period of time. Yeah plenty have been exceptions, but the general trend still remains.

 

[Yellowcrab]

Pretty much everything in that post is factually incorrect, lol.

Everything is correct : DC started to decline against Stipe, but he still won the HW title while being a natural LHW.

Dan Henderson is a natural MW, he made almost his whole career in this category and he beat Fedor at 40 years old...

A bit too much for your supposed GOAT. Fedor is the GOAT of Pride and nothing else...

 

[Claude]

in your opinion. plenty of fighters have stayed at an elite level for longer.


yes. and plenty of the all time best HWs have wins that fit the latter description.

Nope, there's data to back it up.

Examples of fighters who declined older (late 30's or early 40's) because they started MMA late:

-Randy: Started at 34
-Hendo: Started at 27
-Liddell: Started at 29
-Coleman: Started at 32
-Carwin: Started at 30
-Cormier: Started at 30
-Miocic: Started at 28

On the other hand, fighters who started younger (early 20's) declined in their early 30's:

-Rampage: Started at 21
-Tito: Started at 22
-Shogun: Started at 21
-Hughes: Started at 25
-Wanderlei: Started at 20
-Fedor: Started at 23
-Aldo: Started at 18

"Elite level" is subjective and dependant on the division they're fighting.

Arlovski was "elite" in 2016, as he was top ranked and close to a title shot. Yet he was past his prime. He clearly declined after Fedor (10th year). He was just beating lower competition.

Bottom line: Ngannou has many more high mileage top wins than Fedor.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Not really in his opinion - this emperical. He said "generally", which means most - then you replied with "plenty", which means a lot over a longer period of time. Yeah plenty have been exceptions, but the general trend still remains.

"generally" doesn't apply to literal fight records that we can look up. we know who fought and when they fought. it's already happened. "generally" yes that is correct, but we're talking about specific fighters.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Arlovski was "elite" in 2016, as he was top ranked and close to a title shot.

no. no he wasn't. no one thinks arlovski is a great win for ngannou.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Bottom line: Ngannou has many more high mileage top wins than Fedor.

incorrect. herring had nearly 30 fights. goodridge had over 30. kohsaka had over 30. lindland had 25. sylvia had nearly 30.

and fedor's career is also littered with fighters who had very little experience like choi, valavicius, zulu, nagata, ogawa, etc.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

GREAT post!! Spot on

And the guy is 35 with three losses on his record and some idiots are still acting like he’s unbeatable. Lol

Also... wonder how much Dana is paying USADA under the table for this turd

we love PED accusations on sherdog

 

[Claude]

Everything is correct : DC started to decline against Stipe, but he still won the HW title while being a natural LHW.

Dan Henderson is a natural MW, he made almost his whole career in this category and he beat Fedor at 40 years old...

A bit too much for your supposed GOAT. Fedor is the GOAT of Pride and nothing else...

DC was heavier than Stipe at 246 lbs. Fedor was 223 lbs vs. Hendo. So how was DC a natural LHW while Fedor was a natural HW? lol

Hendo was not a natural MW at the time. He had trouble cutting to MW years before that, and was fighting at LHW.

You're too lost. Pick up some knowledge before arguing with me. I say that respectfully.

Cheers.

 

[Yellowcrab]

And the guy is 35 with three losses on his record and some idiots are still acting like he’s unbeatable. Lol

Few years ago, he was a homeless irregular migrant in France... his path is more impressive than any other HW in MMA.

On the other hand, Stipe started wrestling in high school in the US...

 

[Claude]

"generally" doesn't apply to literal fight records that we can look up. we know who fought and when they fought. it's already happened. "generally" yes that is correct, but we're talking about specific fighters.

It applies to Ngannou's opponents. Overeem, Arlovski, Cain, JDS, Stipe, all had over 10 years of mileage and were past prime. Ultimately, that's all that matters. Whether you agree with the 10 year mark or not, it doesn't change anything.

Could you say the same thing about Fedor's opponents? Well, you tried, and failed.

no. no he wasn't. no one thinks arlovski is a great win for ngannou.

Yes, Arlovski was an elite HW in 2016 by the rankings and was 1 fight away from a title shot.

incorrect. herring had nearly 30 fights. goodridge had over 30. kohsaka had over 30. lindland had 25. sylvia had nearly 30.

and fedor's career is also littered with fighters who had very little experience like choi, valavicius, zulu, nagata, ogawa, etc.

Fedor had more fights than Tim. Herring had 27 fights. That's still an acceptable amount of experience.

Kohsahka, Goodridge, Lindland were not top wins. The guys with little experience were also not top wins, so they're irrelevant here.

It's funny you have to bring up unranked wins to inflate your argument. Proves how little you have to work with.

Cheers.

 

[Yellowcrab]

DC was heavier than Stipe at 246 lbs. Fedor was 223 lbs vs. Hendo. So how was DC a natural LHW while Fedor was a natural HW? lol

Hendo was not a natural MW at the time. He had trouble cutting to MW years before that, and was fighting at LHW.

You're too lost. Pick up some knowledge before arguing with me. I say that respectfully.

Cheers.

DC was fat AND older than Stipe, yet he still won the HW title in their first fight... it speaks volume.

How DC competed in the HW division ? By being fat... :

I don't care about what you say about Henderson : he spent the most of his career at the MW division... he was 40 years old and he beat a 34 years old Fedor.

End of the story... honestly, with such a defeat for Fedor, how can you even continue the discussion ?

Can you name me a single recognized champion who lost to :

1) A much older dude

2) A much older dude coming from a lower division

I don't know any...

 

[Claude]

DC was fat AND older than Stipe, yet he still won the HW title in their first fight... it speaks volume.

How DC competed in the HW division ? By being fat... : https://i.redd.it/euz8pk4v6zw11.jpg

I don't care about what you say about Henderson : he spend the most of his career at the MW division... he was 40 years old and he beat a 34 years old Fedor.

End of the story... honestly, with such a defeat for Fedor, how can you even continue the discussion ?

Can you name me a single recognized champion who lost to :

1) A much older dude

2) A much older dude coming from a lower division

I don't know any...

You didn't answer me: How was Fedor a natural HW at 227 lbs while DC wasn't at 246 lbs.

Fedor had a high amount of body fat too.

Answer please.

Cheers.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Yes, Arlovski was an elite HW in 2016 by the rankings and was 1 fight away from a title shot.

so if arlovski, past his prime, was "elite" then you're arguing nothing. you're admitting that these "old guys" are elite heavyweights.