Hendo: Why win/loss is not everything

[pankrat]

By that same token, only a retard or a child would not understand that height and reach plays a very important part which is why there is the term height/reach ADVANTAGE.

furthermore its quite retarded to conveniently leave out the part mentioned where the walk around weight for GSP and Hendo was not that far apart. It wasnt even 10lbs iirc.

To use size as equal of height/reach as OP did is childish and retarded. There are multiple example that proves as much.

Hendo walked around way more than 10lbs heavier than GSP

 

[pankrat]

He mentioned reach once. He talked about WEIGHT a lot. "Only a retard or a child would not understand" that adult size would include a discussion about weight and weight classes, as well as height.

Did your tiny, tiny brain somehow miss this in the opening post?

"Hendos fight night weight at 205 has been under 200lbs many times, he was 199lbs when he faced DC. GSPs fight night weight at 170 has been at least 194 (Firas said GSP was 194 4 days before the shields fight, most likely he was bigger on fight night)

So basically you have two guys who are about the same size and one fought at 170 (no hate he should fight at 170) and the other fought at 175, 185, 205 and 265."

Seems to me that's a discussion about.... wait for it..... weight.

Not sure about why that triggered such rage in you, but, maybe that's because you're a jackass.

The rage is in your mind mate.

OP talked about height/reach to draw the comparison. There are BW as tall as LHW and HWs. So yes, its childish and stupid.

Regarding weight. A bloated GSP was 190lbs, while Hendo was 205lbs if bulked up.
So 15lbs diference. Not that much, just a weight class.

What Hendo did is indeed impressive. The comparison around height is just stupid.

 

[fzoid4454]

The rage is in your mind mate.

OP talked about height/reach to draw the comparison. There are BW as tall as LHW and HWs. So yes, its childish and stupid.

Regarding weight. A bloated GSP was 190lbs, while Hendo was 205lbs if bulked up.
So 15lbs diference. Not that much, just a weight class.

What Hendo did is indeed impressive. The comparison around height is just stupid.

I stated that I understood why OP was comparing sizes and weight classes that Hendo and GSP fought in, and then you, ignoring about half of OPs original post, called me "a retard" for understanding it. Seems like a wild overreaction on your part.

Yes, there are BWs as tall as heavier guys. There are also people in the same weight class with wildly different builds and strengths because they are carrying the same weight packed into very different frames.

So, talking about height AND weight when comparing sizes makes complete sense.

And, again, "only a fucking retard" ignores either height or weight when talking about adult size, but you seem to think only one is retarded while going all-in on the other.

 

[pankrat]

I stated that I understood why OP was comparing sizes and weight classes that Hendo and GSP fought in, and then you, ignoring about half of OPs original post, called me "a retard" for understanding it. Seems like a wild overreaction on your part.

Yes, there are BWs as tall as heavier guys. There are also people in the same weight class with wildly different builds and strengths because they are carrying the same weight packed into very different frames.

So, talking about height AND weight when comparing sizes makes complete sense.

And, again, "only a fucking retard" ignores either height or weight when talking about adult size, but you seem to think only one is retarded while going all-in on the other.

Irs stupid to give height that much relevance. Its evident enough. You actually listed some reasons for it.

OP starts with it and then goes on to say GSP and Hendo "are about the same size", which is simply not true.

We have seen Hendo in the cage above 205lbs (vs Fedor) and even looked less bulked up than GSP did at 190.
When we saw Hendo around 200lbs he was slim, at least as slim if not more than GSP at his usual weight of 185lbs.
Hendo at 185lbs (hydrated) would look unhealthy and barely cleared for fighting. So its what it is.

It would be like saying Rockhold, for example, and GSP "are about the same size".
OP seems to think that given that Hendo is closer in height, it would make it a more fair assesment but nope, it doesnt work like that.

BTW I agree Hendo often doesnt get enough credit for the strenght of schedule he had with his relatively small size.
Im saying that bringing up GSP to say "is about the same size" and using the height card to support it is stupid and typically shertard by the way

 

[BowserJr]

The rage is in your mind mate.

OP talked about height/reach to draw the comparison. There are BW as tall as LHW and HWs. So yes, its childish and stupid.

Regarding weight. A bloated GSP was 190lbs, while Hendo was 205lbs if bulked up.
So 15lbs diference. Not that much, just a weight class.

What Hendo did is indeed impressive. The comparison around height is just stupid.

Its not just height comparison its an overall size comparison. Hendo was never a large mw. Gsp probably would be a small mw even in previous years. The point is that theyre is no huge size difference between hendo and the absolute WW GOAT and Hendo fought at a weight class 15lbs & 35lbs heavier and opponents that were 50lbs heavier than the weight class GSP competed in. He did it while not being that much bigger than GSP. Its not a knock on GSP, its a testament to the bad assess of Hendo.

GSPs walk around weight was close to 190, Hendos walk around weight was around 200. 10lb difference. Similar height and similar reach

 

[BowserJr]

To use size as equal of height/reach as OP did is childish and retarded. There are multiple example that proves as much.

Hendo walked around way more than 10lbs heavier than GSP

That's simple not true. He never cut weight for LHW. He weighed in at 202, 203 many times for that weight class and that was with him bulking up for it. He weighed in with jeans and weights in his pockets for hw

 

[volcom5]

GSPs walk around weight was close to 190, Hendos walk around weight was around 200. 10lb difference. Similar height and similar reach

dude….George St Pierre from his own mouth said he walks around at 183lbs, that’s no 2nd or 3rd hand opinion. Rush said that. Why are you trying to make up shit dude, it’s easily debunked by just a simple search.

 

[pankrat]

That's simple not true. He never cut weight for LHW. He weighed in at 202, 203 many times for that weight class and that was with him bulking up for it. He weighed in with jeans and weights in his pockets for hw

Yo say Hendo was more bulked up at LHW (200+lbs) than GSP was at MW (190lbs)? I think you are disingenuous saying that.

BTW Okami also weighted 200lbs for LHW bouts. He was even smaller than Hendo
Would you ever say Okami and GSP are about the same size or just because Hendo is a bit shorter it makes it any less stupid/false?

 

[nonoob]

records are for casuals who are into ESPN coverage of boxing and their wives boyfriends.

KK in action, Kickin' Out The Facts, not a social media Paid Parrot Involved.

​

Hendo, DaMan, musta had specially made shorts to contain his giant AF brass balls.

FULL Sherdog Hespect to Dan, unquestionably the Warrior, No Question Da-MMA-Man.

Dan's NEVER Refused A Battle, unlike Full Camp ufc151 Duck "champ" Jones did.

Jon being far too Chicken$hit to FAKE being a man to defend against Chael's 10 day (I'll fight Jon) notice.

Las Vegas, Nevada – For the first time in the history of the Ultimate Fighting Championship®, a UFC® champion Jon Jones has refused to face an alternative challenger after an injury to his original opponent, forcing the organization to cancel an event.

Was Jon Jones honest enough back then to say, accurately & appropriately,
"Cowardice Is Me, Not Just Shown Today...But Forever As I Build My True LEGACY."​

Currently, Jon Jones is bragging to his swallowers, "I'm living my best life" while
ducking Tom Aspinal, just like ALL HWs since he spoke of it in 2013.

Yes Jon, you say you're proud to be living your best life, Remember your true story will be told.

Your total life actions will be exposed, both in and hiding under the cage, and much more. Included will be your savage and violently abusive treament to the mother of your children that you were too sorry to marry to this day. A LEGACY you, and only you, formed that will be very well explained about your total lack of a moral character.

Future to-be-published story that will proceed you when long gone is...

Jon Jones, LEGACY OF A CHEATING COWARD.

 

[BowserJr]

Yo say Hendo was more bulked up at LHW (200+lbs) than GSP was at MW (190lbs)? I think you are disingenuous saying that.

No Im not saying that. I'm saying Hendo would put on a little bit of muscle at LHW. When not in camp there was maybe a 10-11lb weight difference and their height and reach is pretty similar.

BTW Okami also weighted 200lbs for LHW bouts. He was even smaller than Hendo
Would you ever say Okami and GSP are about the same size or just because Hendo is a bit shorter it makes it any less stupid/false?

Not sure what your point is with Okami.

Okami literally fought at 170 a few times. Hell, even Anderson fought at 170 and was ranked #1 after beating Sakurai.

So what's your point with Okami. Are you trying to say that he's massive compared to GSP?... Cuz it really depends on when in his career. When talking about size its not purely weight or purely height. Any moron knows this. Which is why I compared Hendo to someone who is pretty close in height, reach and walk around weight

 

[BowserJr]

dude….George St Pierre from his own mouth said he walks around at 183lbs, that’s no 2nd or 3rd hand opinion. Rush said that. Why are you trying to make up shit dude, it’s easily debunked by just a simple search.

Yeah cool story bro.

I did a quick search and all the top results say he walked around at 185-190.

Here is a legit source that talks about it

UFC Quick Quote: Georges St. Pierre could weigh as much as 193 pounds against Jake Shields on fight night

MMA and UFC news, results, rumors, fights and MMA rankings from the fan perspective.

www.mmamania.com

Most likely your referring to when he fought Bisping and dropped a lot of weight in training and had to focus on adding weight. Iirc that was on JRE when he mentioned it. Im pretty sure he also mentioned that he was heavier but in training the weight started coming off more than normal and the whole weight thing was a problem that camp and part of the reason he permanently retired which later on turned out to be part of some bigger health issue which he know has under control.


So again, context matters and you just decide to leave it out because you're trying so hard to be right or feel smart but in the end a quick search shows the facts and shows that you're just not that bright


Here is another source that talks about the issues with his MW bout and talks about his normal fight night weight, which BTW is usually a bit lower than walk around weight for most fighters.... so at the very least GSP was normally and comfortably 190

Trainer: GSP Almost Dropped UFC 217 Due To Weight | FIGHT SPORTS

Georges St-Pierre returned after a four-year layoff to win the UFC middleweight title against Michael Bisping at UFC 217, and it almost didn’t happen.

www.fightsports.tv

 

[Lord Pyjamas]

Why include GSP in this lol.


Dan deserves and gets mad respect and love...anyone who says otherwise (ive never heard anyone say anything) is just dumb...

Dan Henderson was the fucking man... And stopped Fedor...

His loses came because he pushed himself so hard...

This thread could easily been made with no issues without the GSP inclusion lol

Well some very rare fighters can be giant killers due to their fight ending freak powers and chins.
Most fighters can not do that stuff including GSP and a lot of other greats. Just very rare and interesting fighters.

 

[Legendary]

Dan is fucking awesome man. Always rooted for him and when he won it always felt special.

and yes I did have his shirt

 

[Natural Order]

I have Dan in my Top 10 ever to do it. One of my all-time favs.

 

[Natural Order]

Dan's a weird case of having a ton of great wins, especially due to his longevity, but never really being close to being the best at the times he was competing. Being #1 matters in all time rankings. You can't be the best of all time while never being the best during YOUR time. Ironically had he gotten that final decision against Bisping he'd have had a huge boost as he'd finally have had it, and crazily at like 46, even if most people would probably say neither Hendo nor Bisping were the best MWs even if ranked #1.

So because of that I struggle to rank him all time. Like for sure I'm putting him in the top 30ish from all his wins, his titles, and being so close to 1, but beyond that I really can't justify him in some of the rankings I see when no one would ever say he was actually #1 at any point. People say he's top 10 and I just don't see it.

Randy's the far more underrated guy where it seems people don't properly rank him and should be swapped with Hendo when people try and say Hendo might've been top 10.

He was #1. In two different weight classes you absolute noob.

 

[nonoob]

He was #1. In two different weight classes you absolute noob.

Save your keystrokes N O.​

ANYONE that could even mention Hendo being compared in ANY way to Bisping is in a total MMA fantasy world.

 

[pankrat]

No Im not saying that. I'm saying Hendo would put on a little bit of muscle at LHW. When not in camp there was maybe a 10-11lb weight difference and their height and reach is pretty similar.

"Not in camp" weight doesnt say much, since it depend on diet or how much they work the weight room

Optymal fighting weight for them, as we can tell by their long career and from their own mouth, is 185 and 200lbs.
When they bulked up to fight a bigger guy, they were 190 and 205 respectively.

Its what it is. 15lbs is not a huge size difference but definitely not "about same size".

Not sure what your point is with Okami.

Okami literally fought at 170 a few times. Hell, even Anderson fought at 170 and was ranked #1 after beating Sakurai.

So what's your point with Okami. Are you trying to say that he's massive compared to GSP?... Cuz it really depends on when in his career. When talking about size its not purely weight or purely height. Any moron knows this. Which is why I compared Hendo to someone who is pretty close in height, reach and walk around weight

What you seem to not acknowledge is that GSP is not a big WW, he never was and even below avg by modern standards, and here is where the (imo childish and stupid not trying to offend anybody) argument of height/lenght comes into play.
GSP has not a thick upper body. A much more relevant factor in an adult male actual size than some inches of lenght, even if harder to measure at least by the looks.

For Okami - who used to be falsely labeled as a huge MW just like GSP at WW back in the day and for similar reasons (slender, long thin body types with slim waist and wide shoulders) - to make 170 needed extreme low body fat with no bulk and sill making a big cut from 190.

Under such regime, GSP could very well get down to 180lbs or less and the LW limit is possible for him.

LW is not a possibility for Okami. For Henderson is not even certain he could make 170lbs and if he did would most likely be an unhealty skeleton far from the animal GSP was at WW.

 

[markg171]

He was #1. In two different weight classes you absolute noob.

Yeah Dan was the #1 MW and LHW which is why he lost unification bouts with Anderson and Rampage to determine the #1 MW and LHWs.

Oh.

 

[volcom5]

Yeah cool story bro.

I did a quick search and all the top results say he walked around at 185-190.

Here is a legit source that talks about it

UFC Quick Quote: Georges St. Pierre could weigh as much as 193 pounds against Jake Shields on fight night

MMA and UFC news, results, rumors, fights and MMA rankings from the fan perspective.

www.mmamania.com

Most likely your referring to when he fought Bisping and dropped a lot of weight in training and had to focus on adding weight. Iirc that was on JRE when he mentioned it. Im pretty sure he also mentioned that he was heavier but in training the weight started coming off more than normal and the whole weight thing was a problem that camp and part of the reason he permanently retired which later on turned out to be part of some bigger health issue which he know has under control.


So again, context matters and you just decide to leave it out because you're trying so hard to be right or feel smart but in the end a quick search shows the facts and shows that you're just not that bright


Here is another source that talks about the issues with his MW bout and talks about his normal fight night weight, which BTW is usually a bit lower than walk around weight for most fighters.... so at the very least GSP was normally and comfortably 190

Trainer: GSP Almost Dropped UFC 217 Due To Weight | FIGHT SPORTS

Georges St-Pierre returned after a four-year layoff to win the UFC middleweight title against Michael Bisping at UFC 217, and it almost didn’t happen.

www.fightsports.tv

How bout hearing it from the man himself, that’s who Im referring to.

By the way i know you saying Dan Henderson reach is 71 was not a typo someone posted the same exact OP as you on Facebook, by the name of MMA outsiders which that is either you on Facebook or you just copy and pasted it. Either way it’s not a typo and your were wrong.

It’s okay to admit you’re wrong, that’s how people grow and learn.

 

[BowserJr]

"Not in camp" weight doesnt say much, since it depend on diet or how much they work the weight room

Optymal fighting weight for them, as we can tell by their long career and from their own mouth, is 185 and 200lbs.
When they bulked up to fight a bigger guy, they were 190 and 205 respectively.

Its what it is. 15lbs is not a huge size difference but definitely not "about same size".



What you seem to not acknowledge is that GSP is not a big WW, he never was and even below avg by modern standards, and here is where the (imo childish and stupid not trying to offend anybody) argument of height/lenght comes into play.
GSP has not a thick upper body. A much more relevant factor in an adult male actual size than some inches of lenght, even if harder to measure at least by the looks.

For Okami - who used to be falsely labeled as a huge MW just like GSP at WW back in the day and for similar reasons (slender, long thin body types with slim waist and wide shoulders) - to make 170 needed extreme low body fat with no bulk and sill making a big cut from 190.

Under such regime, GSP could very well get down to 180lbs or less and the LW limit is possible for him.

LW is not a possibility for Okami. For Henderson is not even certain he could make 170lbs and if he did would most likely be an unhealty skeleton far from the animal GSP was at WW.

Ya ok sherbro. Keep doing mental gymnastics cuz I showed you that there is merit to what O said while you came at me aggressively and disparagingly for no reason.

Walk around weight is the weight they live their lives at so of course its relevant. Optimal weight is going to be different for every fighter for an amalgam of reasons. Fact is theyre similar in size. Weight, height, reach. You can add whatever you want but that fact remains