Crime Harvard professor says ‘all hell broke loose’ when his study found no racial bias in police shootings

[nhbbear]

My opinion on any study that only looks at these numbers without any context makes them so much less reliable. It’s like the “blacks are 2.9% more likely than whites to get shot by police.” I mean, for fuck’s sake, there’s not that many shootings of blacks per year. Usually around 1000 total, less than 300 are black, less than 20 unarmed. Again, in average. You have all these resources. Do a real fucking study. Look at each shooting and then come back to me. Tell me how many fired first. What crimes they committed. Armed with a knife? Did they just shoot or stab someone else?

 

[Mr Holmes]

the data also determined that officers were 23.8 percent less likely to shoot at blacks and 8.5 percent less likely to shoot at Hispanics than they were to shoot at whites

Interesting, 23 percent seems a bit too high. But I did figure they tend to hesitate with with blacks nowadays. 10% less likely seems more accurate to me, give or take a few percentage

I find his data be to highly accurate and if you disagree with it, like some of the freaks in this thread, then you are a racist.

 

[HOLA]

My opinion on any study that only looks at these numbers without any context makes them so much less reliable. It’s like the “blacks are 2.9% more likely than whites to get shot by police.” I mean, for fuck’s sake, there’s not that many shootings of blacks per year. Usually around 1000 total, less than 300 are black, less than 20 unarmed. Again, in average. You have all these resources. Do a real fucking study. Look at each shooting and then come back to me. Tell me how many fired first. What crimes they committed. Armed with a knife? Did they just shoot or stab someone else?

From 2015-2020, 135 unarmed black men and women were fatally shot by police. So I guess that doesn't even count someone like George Floyd, since he wasn't actually shot.

It is true that not every shooting of an unarmed person is unjustified. Sometimes there are valid reasons for it. But even as deferential as the courts are to cops, these shootings have still resulted in dozens of judgements and hundreds of millions in settlements.

 

[EL CORINTHIAN]

I have had three cops pin me to a truck, search me, point a gun at my dog, tell me they'd shoot him....my crime....letting my dog run free in a 10 acre empty field right before bed with no signs regulating time to access the field or any barrier to the giant open field.

I didn't want that experience even once.

You don't live in the US.

-sincerely, a white Canadian guy that has zero knowledge of the black experience in America.

LOL

Greek Canadian here. Our community was subjected to the largest race related riot in the nation that effectively relocated Greek town from Young and Bloor to Danforth.

My mother had Canadian Kids throw rocks at her head when she moved from Greece to Canada.

Me and a bunch of Balkan kids from the neighborhood would routinely get stopped and searched for literally nothing. Greeks, Albanians, Serbs, Bulgarians ect.

You Americans know dick all about racism.
Stop making excuses for the black community.

 

[Two Crows]

Well, might be pedantic, but a working paper is not a formal publication. It's a work in progress, subject to revision, and generally not advertised to the public. The paper was actually published in June 2019.

The paper shows last modification January 2018 (see link to actual paper).

It was public and being criticized, see the article discussing the paper dated 8/24/2016:


Where are you getting your June 2019 date from? Are you confusing a journal issue publishing the paper with the actual paper itself?

For reference, the working paper is the only publication to date. See Harvard's own publication page on Fryer for reference, it's still listed as "forthcoming":
https://scholar.harvard.edu/fryer/publications?page=1

 

[HOLA]

Yeah, that totally sounds legit. I'm sure they just found a dog wandering around, and immediately zeroed on the owner and proceeded to fuck them up. Uh-huh. Why don't you fill in blanks there, bud? If you're not completely making the story up, that is...

His story is completely typical of the experience with U.S. cops. He's lucky the cops didn't shoot his dog.

The “Puppycide” of Policing: How the Law Rationalizes the Police Killing of “Dangerous Dogs”

Police officers kill approximately 10,000 dogs every year in the United States, according to an estimate by a Department of Justice official. This amounts to police officers killing approximately 25 to 30 dogs every day. Although it is difficult to ascertain the actual extent of the problem...

trace.tennessee.edu

"Police officers kill approximately 10,000 dogs every year in the United States, according to an estimate by a Department of Justice official. This amounts to police officers killing approximately 25 to 30 dogs every day. "

You don't live here. Don't tell me Saskatchewan, or whatever bumblefuck nowhere you live is the same as Long Island.

 

[blackheart]

Yeah, that totally sounds legit. I'm sure they just found a dog wandering around, and immediately zeroed on the owner and proceeded to fuck them up. Uh-huh. Why don't you fill in blanks there, bud? If you're not completely making the story up, that is...

@HOLA

His story is completely typical of the experience with U.S. cops. He's lucky the cops didn't shoot his dog

See:

Spoken like a true Canadian muppet that has absolutely no fucking idea how rabid and insane the police are in America.

Let me give you one.

Last year coming home from a night of hard training, my neighbor claimed I bumped their car while parking in front of my house (they had parked in front of my house). I parked and got out and her and her friend were screaming at me going crazy. I got out and looked at our vehicles - no contact and no damage to either. Zero. None. Nada. Nothing. They're screaming at the top of their lungs and screaming that they're calling the police. They didn't ask for my insurance or info. They were going ballistic. They were drunk and watched me park in front of my place from the shadows of their front porch, at night, and THOUGHT they saw me bump their car. I went inside my place and carried on with my evening. An hour later, police are putting lights through my windows and telling me to come out and talk to them. I told them I don't talk to police without a lawyer present. Mind you, it's almost midnight at this point. 20 minutes later, and my truck is being towed from in front of my own house. I come outside and I'm yelling at them, like "wtf are you doing" "how can you tow my fucking truck from in front of my own house", stuff like that. At this point, I look around and I realize there are about a dozen squad cars, and 2-3 dozen officers fanned out in front of my house, in different positions, with their guns drawn. The cops start screaming at me that they're taking me into custody and I need to surrender to them. They tell me that if they're forced to come inside, they don't know what could happen to my dogs (I have two 6 month old puppies at the time). I ask them how the fuck can they force their way into my home without a warrant? They said they don't need one and that they have probable cause. I comply and I'm arrested.

Let me simplify all of that for your fucking idiot baboon brain -

I was minding my own business, parking my truck in front of my own house, and my neighbor was parked in front of my house, and my neighbor, a white woman, claimed she saw me bump her car and that she was calling the police. I inspected for damages - none. Then I carried on with my night and went in my house, continuing to mind my own business. Police knocked on my door and told me to come outside and talk to them. I told them I don't speak to cops without a lawyer, which is my constitutional right. Then my truck was towed from in front of my own home, while a minimum of two dozen officers stood in front of my home with guns drawn, and then I was arrested. But not before the police threatened the lives of my two puppies.

At no point, in any of this, did I threaten anybody, or brandish a weapon of any kind. There was no violence. There were no threats of violence. My white lady neighbor claimed I bumped her car, IN FRONT OF MY HOUSE, then my property was seized by the state, the lives of my dogs were threatened, and I was arrested at gunpoint and held in a disgusting metro jail for 24 hours where I wasn't allowed to sleep and was forced to watch a man overdose and die. This was my first encounter with police in TEN YEARS. No traffic stops. NOTHING. Police in the united states are rabid fucking animals, that feel that they have carte blanche to treat anybody however they want. They're trigger happy, violent in the extreme, militarized from disgustingly bloated budgets, racist, rabid fucking animals. And you have no fucking idea what you're talking about you maple syrup guzzling boot licker.

 

[HOLA]

LOL

Greek Canadian here. Our community was subjected to the largest race related riot in the nation that effectively relocated Greek town from Young and Bloor to Danforth.

My mother had Canadian Kids throw rocks at her head when she moved from Greece to Canada.

Me and a bunch of Balkan kids from the neighborhood would routinely get stopped and searched for literally nothing. Greeks, Albanians, Serbs, Bulgarians ect.

You Americans know dick all about racism.
Stop making excuses for the black community.

Oh, look...competitive grief. This?

"The Yonge Street riot was a civil disturbance that occurred in Toronto, Ontario, Canada, on the night of May 4, 1992.[1]

Events[edit]​

Originally, the protest had been focused on Rodney King, as the officers that beat King had recently been acquitted.[2][1][3] However, a young Black man named Raymond Lawrence was killed in Toronto on May 2 by two officers of the Peel Regional Police.[2][4] Accordingly, the protest grew to encompass Lawrence's killing as well.[2]

The protest began at the United States consulate on University Avenue, and then moved to the intersection of Yonge and Bloor Streets.[3] It was led by the Black Action Defence Committee.[5] Witnesses noted that many engaged in looting and violence were white skinheads.[2]

Aftermath[edit]​

Following the disturbance, according to a contemporaneous report in the Toronto Star, Ontario premier Bob Rae called for "reforms" in the "education and justice systems".[6] Rae tasked Stephen Lewis with drafting a report to analyze the causes of the disturbance.[1] Alexander and Glaze summarize Lewis's conclusions as follows: "[w]hile the LAPD trial verdict, and the May 2 Toronto police shooting death … acted as catalysts, the root causes of black unrest were simmering frustration over police mistreatment, discrimination in employment and housing, and a school system dominated by Eurocentric curricula."[7]"

.....

How quaint. Nothing has ever happened in America that matches this!

 

[HOLA]

The paper shows last modification January 2018 (see link to actual paper).

It was public and being criticized, see the article discussing the paper dated 8/24/2016:


Where are you getting your June 2019 date from? Are you confusing a journal issue publishing the paper with the actual paper itself?

For reference, the working paper is the only publication to date. See Harvard's own publication page on Fryer for reference, it's still listed as "forthcoming":
https://scholar.harvard.edu/fryer/publications?page=1

From looking at the actual paper. Journal of Political Economy, Volume 127, #3. June 2019:

An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force.

 

[Mr Holmes]

@HOLA

See:

Spoken like a true Canadian muppet that has absolutely no fucking idea how rabid and insane the police are in America.

Let me give you one.

Last year coming home from a night of hard training, my neighbor claimed I bumped their car while parking in front of my house (they had parked in front of my house). I parked and got out and her and her friend were screaming at me going crazy. I got out and looked at our vehicles - no contact and no damage to either. Zero. None. Nada. Nothing. They're screaming at the top of their lungs and screaming that they're calling the police. They didn't ask for my insurance or info. They were going ballistic. They were drunk and watched me park in front of my place from the shadows of their front porch, at night, and THOUGHT they saw me bump their car. I went inside my place and carried on with my evening. An hour later, police are putting lights through my windows and telling me to come out and talk to them. I told them I don't talk to police without a lawyer present. Mind you, it's almost midnight at this point. 20 minutes later, and my truck is being towed from in front of my own house. I come outside and I'm yelling at them, like "wtf are you doing" "how can you tow my fucking truck from in front of my own house", stuff like that. At this point, I look around and I realize there are about a dozen squad cars, and 2-3 dozen officers fanned out in front of my house, in different positions, with their guns drawn. The cops start screaming at me that they're taking me into custody and I need to surrender to them. They tell me that if they're forced to come inside, they don't know what could happen to my dogs (I have two 6 month old puppies at the time). I ask them how the fuck can they force their way into my home without a warrant? They said they don't need one and that they have probable cause. I comply and I'm arrested.

Let me simplify all of that for your fucking idiot baboon brain -

I was minding my own business, parking my truck in front of my own house, and my neighbor was parked in front of my house, and my neighbor, a white woman, claimed she saw me bump her car and that she was calling the police. I inspected for damages - none. Then I carried on with my night and went in my house, continuing to mind my own business. Police knocked on my door and told me to come outside and talk to them. I told them I don't speak to cops without a lawyer, which is my constitutional right. Then my truck was towed from in front of my own home, while a minimum of two dozen officers stood in front of my home with guns drawn, and then I was arrested. But not before the police threatened the lives of my two puppies.

At no point, in any of this, did I threaten anybody, or brandish a weapon of any kind. There was no violence. There were no threats of violence. My white lady neighbor claimed I bumped her car, IN FRONT OF MY HOUSE, then my property was seized by the state, the lives of my dogs were threatened, and I was arrested at gunpoint and held in a disgusting metro jail for 24 hours where I wasn't allowed to sleep and was forced to watch a man overdose and die. This was my first encounter with police in TEN YEARS. No traffic stops. NOTHING. Police in the united states are rabid fucking animals, that feel that they have carte blanche to treat anybody however they want. They're trigger happy, violent in the extreme, militarized from disgustingly bloated budgets, racist, rabid fucking animals. And you have no fucking idea what you're talking about you maple syrup guzzling boot licker.

Maybe next time you'll think twice before gang banging.

 

[blackheart]

Maybe next time you'll think twice before gang banging.

Alright, at least you've got the tiniest semblance of a sense of humor still intact.

 

[EL CORINTHIAN]

Oh, look...competitive grief. This?

"The Yonge Street riot was a civil disturbance that occurred in Toronto, Ontario, Canada, on the night of May 4, 1992.[1]

Events[edit]​

Originally, the protest had been focused on Rodney King, as the officers that beat King had recently been acquitted.[2][1][3] However, a young Black man named Raymond Lawrence was killed in Toronto on May 2 by two officers of the Peel Regional Police.[2][4] Accordingly, the protest grew to encompass Lawrence's killing as well.[2]

The protest began at the United States consulate on University Avenue, and then moved to the intersection of Yonge and Bloor Streets.[3] It was led by the Black Action Defence Committee.[5] Witnesses noted that many engaged in looting and violence were white skinheads.[2]

Aftermath[edit]​

Following the disturbance, according to a contemporaneous report in the Toronto Star, Ontario premier Bob Rae called for "reforms" in the "education and justice systems".[6] Rae tasked Stephen Lewis with drafting a report to analyze the causes of the disturbance.[1] Alexander and Glaze summarize Lewis's conclusions as follows: "[w]hile the LAPD trial verdict, and the May 2 Toronto police shooting death … acted as catalysts, the root causes of black unrest were simmering frustration over police mistreatment, discrimination in employment and housing, and a school system dominated by Eurocentric curricula."[7]"

.....

How quaint. Nothing has ever happened in America that matches this!

Yes, thats the one. The one that forced Greek town to relocate from downtown to Danforth.

Are you fucking stupid?

I'm taking about the anti-Greek race riots

1918 Toronto anti-Greek riot​

The 1918 Toronto anti-Greek riot was a three-day race riot that took place across Toronto, Ontario, Canada, targeting Greek immigrants in early August 1918. The date range of the riots is variously cited as 2–4 August or 1–5 August, with some sources using the latter range to include the event that triggered the violence and the date of the final restoration of the peace. It was the largest riot in the city's history and one of the largest anti-Greek riots in the world. In the newspapers of the time, the events were referred to as the Toronto troubles.[1][2][3] The riot was the result of prejudice against new immigrants as well as the false belief that Greeks were not fighting in World War I[2] and held pro-German views.[4]

I'm illustrating the point that none of this shit is unique to African Americans and the idea that a Canadian couldn't understand makes me laugh as a Greek-Canadian.

American Liberals: As a Canadian you could never understand the black man's plight.

Greek: Hold my Souvlaki.

 

[SKYNET]

It's like accusing you of being Brackis

for the record, I must apologize as my reply was not meant to infer that account is Brackis, after 3 pages it just started reminding me of a bad impersonation

I remember Brackis well, and @blackheart, you sir, are no Brackis

 

[HOLA]

@HOLA

See:

Spoken like a true Canadian muppet that has absolutely no fucking idea how rabid and insane the police are in America.

Let me give you one.

Last year coming home from a night of hard training, my neighbor claimed I bumped their car while parking in front of my house (they had parked in front of my house). I parked and got out and her and her friend were screaming at me going crazy. I got out and looked at our vehicles - no contact and no damage to either. Zero. None. Nada. Nothing. They're screaming at the top of their lungs and screaming that they're calling the police. They didn't ask for my insurance or info. They were going ballistic. They were drunk and watched me park in front of my place from the shadows of their front porch, at night, and THOUGHT they saw me bump their car. I went inside my place and carried on with my evening. An hour later, police are putting lights through my windows and telling me to come out and talk to them. I told them I don't talk to police without a lawyer present. Mind you, it's almost midnight at this point. 20 minutes later, and my truck is being towed from in front of my own house. I come outside and I'm yelling at them, like "wtf are you doing" "how can you tow my fucking truck from in front of my own house", stuff like that. At this point, I look around and I realize there are about a dozen squad cars, and 2-3 dozen officers fanned out in front of my house, in different positions, with their guns drawn. The cops start screaming at me that they're taking me into custody and I need to surrender to them. They tell me that if they're forced to come inside, they don't know what could happen to my dogs (I have two 6 month old puppies at the time). I ask them how the fuck can they force their way into my home without a warrant? They said they don't need one and that they have probable cause. I comply and I'm arrested.

Let me simplify all of that for your fucking idiot baboon brain -

I was minding my own business, parking my truck in front of my own house, and my neighbor was parked in front of my house, and my neighbor, a white woman, claimed she saw me bump her car and that she was calling the police. I inspected for damages - none. Then I carried on with my night and went in my house, continuing to mind my own business. Police knocked on my door and told me to come outside and talk to them. I told them I don't speak to cops without a lawyer, which is my constitutional right. Then my truck was towed from in front of my own home, while a minimum of two dozen officers stood in front of my home with guns drawn, and then I was arrested. But not before the police threatened the lives of my two puppies.

At no point, in any of this, did I threaten anybody, or brandish a weapon of any kind. There was no violence. There were no threats of violence. My white lady neighbor claimed I bumped her car, IN FRONT OF MY HOUSE, then my property was seized by the state, the lives of my dogs were threatened, and I was arrested at gunpoint and held in a disgusting metro jail for 24 hours where I wasn't allowed to sleep and was forced to watch a man overdose and die. This was my first encounter with police in TEN YEARS. No traffic stops. NOTHING. Police in the united states are rabid fucking animals, that feel that they have carte blanche to treat anybody however they want. They're trigger happy, violent in the extreme, militarized from disgustingly bloated budgets, racist, rabid fucking animals. And you have no fucking idea what you're talking about you maple syrup guzzling boot licker.

I have my own story with a crazy cop, like so many of us do. I got in a 3 car pileup. I was the middle car. Car in front was an SUV, with the spare tire missing, so it was just this metal sticking out. I had a 95 Maxima at the time. It got smushed. None of us were driving reckless. Shit happens. But I was 19. Cop (whose breath stunk of alcohol at like 11 AM), was obviously a big Don Frye fan.

He asked me how fast I was going, and I suppose he didn't like when I said 35, because this was the response I got:

In what fucking bizarro land is that a reasonable response?! lmao. We got into an accident; we didn't rob a bank. I guess I should consider myself lucky he didn't try to turn into Frye vs. Takayama.

 

[HOLA]

Yes, thats the one. The one that forced Greek town to relocate from downtown to Danforth.

Are you fucking stupid?

I'm taking about the anti-Greek race riots


I'm illustrating the point that none of this shit is unique to African Americans and the idea that a Canadian couldn't understand makes me laugh as a Greek-Canadian.

American Liberals: As a Canadian you could never understand the black man's plight.

Greek: Hold my Souvlaki.

I knew you came across a curmudgeon, but I had no idea you've been around since 1918. Impressive, sir. I recommend dried prunes. It will help with your bowel movements and make you less grumpy. Godspeed, gramps.

 

[skaleton]

Yeah, that totally sounds legit. I'm sure they just found a dog wandering around, and immediately zeroed on the owner and proceeded to fuck them up. Uh-huh. Why don't you fill in blanks there, bud? If you're not completely making the story up, that is...

What do I win my making it up?
Did you forget that you're making up that you know how the American police work?

They saw me. And assumed I was smoking. Dog showed up while they were searching me.
Blanks filled baby.

Your turn. Why did they let me go and ride out quick? Why'd one apologize?

 

[skaleton]

LOL

Greek Canadian here. Our community was subjected to the largest race related riot in the nation that effectively relocated Greek town from Young and Bloor to Danforth.

My mother had Canadian Kids throw rocks at her head when she moved from Greece to Canada.

Me and a bunch of Balkan kids from the neighborhood would routinely get stopped and searched for literally nothing. Greeks, Albanians, Serbs, Bulgarians ect.

You Americans know dick all about racism.
Stop making excuses for the black community.

I haven't made a single excuse. Its the poor community that's being fucked with, not the black community.

I'm white. I don't care about the police treatment towards black people. I care about the police treatment towards American citizens.

Now that I don't look so poor they treat me nicer. That's fucked up.

 

[Hdfi]

However, the data also determined that officers were 23.8 percent less likely to shoot at blacks and 8.5 percent less likely to shoot at Hispanics than they were to shoot at whites.

So there's racial bias but it is against whites. It's not surprising at all.

 

[Cool Hand Luke]

I love souvlaki

 

[Two Crows]

From looking at the actual paper. Journal of Political Economy, Volume 127, #3. June 2019:

An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force.

I don't have access to that Journal (and they want $30 for that article alone), so I can't comment. It is possible Harvard is just late in updating his page. Maybe they are ignoring it given the media attention?

I know some journals publish working papers for peer review, but I thought that stopped with the popularity of pdf formats.

I have no idea.