International Hamas launches surprise attack on Israel; Israel has declared a state of war. Vol. VII

[avenue94]

But you ignore the hostages, the civilians targeted at a music festival, the women raped and children that were beheaded that started all this

Israel has turned down multiple offers for a return of hostages in order to pursue their fanciful goal of eradicating Hamas (some for better reasons than others). You even see this with Bibi trying to torpedo his own ceasefire proposal because he would rather cling to power and avoid prison, even if it means prolonging the conflict.

Gaza ELECTED a terrorist group that's STATED purpose is to eradicate Israel.

Voters two decades ago elected one of the few groups left in Palestinian civil society after decades of infighting and Israeli/American influence to make sure that the only options Palestinians had left were extremists, not moderate factions. Because Israel prefers dealing with extremists, rather than moderates, because of the optics internationally. Your logic is means civilians in Israel or the US are fair game for voting in horrific leaders, yet you're applying this punishment mostly to Palestinians it seems.

Any other country would be blasting the shit out of Gaza if the same thing happened to them.

You mean like how Ireland and the UK were able to finally settle their conflict, despite Irish extremists coming within a hair of killing a British PM?

I have never seen Jews in NYC chanting Gas the Palestinians.

Bibi's Minister of Finance has supported price tag attacks, segregation between Arabs and Jews, banning Arabs from buying homes, and shoot-to-kill for stonethrowing. And when Israeli settlers carried out a pogrom against a Palestinian village, he wasn't satisfied that nearly hundreds of homes and businesses were burned to the ground, he wanted it completely wiped out.

There is plenty of extremism to go around, and the MP I highlighted isn't even the most extreme.

By the way, I never see groups of Israelis chanting and celebrating when they kill someone.

Have you missed all the pogroms and sectarian violence Israeli settlers have committed?

 

[SammyPops]

The only white flags are being waved frantically by Hamas and Palestinians as it finally sinks in how epically they done fucked up.

lol Hamas won if the war ends today. Israel and SA normalisatin dead. EU countries recognizing Palestine. ICJ and ICC rulings. BDS popping up everywhere and so on.

Israel done fucked up, walked right into dat hamas trap.

Avoid the ziontardism and inform us on how Israel won?

The real winner is peace though, b/c Israel may be forced finally to act in good faith.

 

[avenue94]

I suspect it wasnt just out of "rage" but rather both Bibi covering himself for allowing Oct 9th to happen and the more right wing extremist parts of the government using it to gain more control.

I think Ben-Gvir's statement right after the attack sums it up perfectly. "Israel is experiencing one of the most difficult events in its history. This is not the time for questions, tests and investigations."

It's pretty clear that even Bibi's allies know that investigations would be damning to current leadership.

 

[KnightTemplar]

lol Hamas won if the war ends today. Israel and SA normalisatin dead. EU countries recognizing Palestine. ICJ and ICC rulings. BDS popping up everywhere and so on.

Israel done fucked up, walked right into dat hamas trap.

Avoid the ziontardism and inform us on how Israel won?

The real winner is peace though, b/c Israel may be forced finally to act in good faith.

EU recognising Palestine is like me wanting to fuck Sidney Sweeny: it has absolutely no impact on the real world. It's the geopolitical equivalent of a participation trophy.

Yeah, good luck with enforcing an IAW on Bibi. I'd pay cash money to watch someone try to arrest him.

The only thing funnier than watching Hamas getting their shit pushed in is watching all the Palestinian nut-huggers trying desperately to find some glimmer of light in the darkness of abject defeat.

"We've won a moral victory! Suck on that, Zionists!"

 

[kflo]

Israel has turned down multiple offers for a return of hostages in order to pursue their fanciful goal of eradicating Hamas (some for better reasons than others). You even see this with Bibi trying to torpedo his own ceasefire proposal because he would rather cling to power and avoid prison, even if it means prolonging the conflict.

Voters two decades ago elected one of the few groups left in Palestinian civil society after decades of infighting and Israeli/American influence to make sure that the only options Palestinians had left were extremists, not moderate factions. Because Israel prefers dealing with extremists, rather than moderates, because of the optics internationally. Your logic is means civilians in Israel or the US are fair game for voting in horrific leaders, yet you're applying this punishment mostly to Palestinians it seems.

You mean like how Ireland and the UK were able to finally settle their conflict, despite Irish extremists coming within a hair of killing a British PM?

Bibi's Minister of Finance has supported price tag attacks, segregation between Arabs and Jews, banning Arabs from buying homes, and shoot-to-kill for stonethrowing. And when Israeli settlers carried out a pogrom against a Palestinian village, he wasn't satisfied that nearly hundreds of homes and businesses were burned to the ground, he wanted it completely wiped out.

There is plenty of extremism to go around, and the MP I highlighted isn't even the most extreme.

Have you missed all the pogroms and sectarian violence Israeli settlers have committed?

is fatah a moderate faction?

and israel preferred dealing with hamas so much israel threatened to withhold cooperation with the elections if hamas was on the ballot.

of course, you seem to label hamas as "insurgents" and not terrorists. and the basic question of what their goal / objective is seems to be too hard a question to answer......

 

[moreorless87]

I would guess the two main reasons Hamas won.....

1.Fatah were very corrupt and ineffective as a government.

2.The Peace Process which Fatah backed had led nowhere.

 

[avenue94]

Now let's just get each and every country to recognize Hamas as a terrorist group and refuse to do business with them until they abdicate. Egypt, Syria, Iran, Qatar is to place them on the terrorist list, Qatar then must detain the Hamas leaders currently enjoying protection on their turf and hand them over to Israel and confiscate their billions in funds, no one is to treat them like a political entity or give them anything resembling aid.

Again, wishing for the moon. Even if you could get all those countries to blacklist Hamas, furthering isolating Gaza would only do what most sanction regimes do: increase the popularity of the current authorities who can scapegoat sanctions for their failures.

Even if Hamas vanished, who would even be in charge of Gaza and why would they be better?

Funny thing about the laws of war. If you break the laws of war, you aren't protected by them. And you don't get to just hide behind civilians to avoid the consequences. Particularly when said civilians widely support you breaking the laws of war.

Which treaty says this?

Despite this, israel has tried to minimize casualties.

If that's the case, where is Israel's unedited footage from the Flour Massacre, or why have Israeli soldiers who committed blatant war crimes and unlawful killings not been charged, even before the war?

Yea Israel is using pinpoint accuracy to completely minimize civilian casualties. All the countries in the world and every human rights organization on the planet are lying except the US and Israel.

To be pedantic, it's not even a matter of accuracy. It doesn't matter how accurately you place a 2000lb bomb if it's a densely populated neighborhood. It's why the gaslighting from folks upset that the US wasn't going to provide smart munitions past a certain size was insane.

 

[kflo]

I think Ben-Gvir's statement right after the attack sums it up perfectly. "Israel is experiencing one of the most difficult events in its history. This is not the time for questions, tests and investigations."

It's pretty clear that even Bibi's allies know that investigations would be damning to current leadership.

implying what exactly?

 

[Sir Punchalot]

Northern Israel is on fire tonight after heavy attacks from the Hezbollah.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1797735557315072215

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1797721998715699647

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1797728112459034700

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1797727506344358214

 

[Hog-train]

EU recognising Palestine is like me wanting to fuck Sidney Sweeny: it has absolutely no impact on the real world. It's the geopolitical equivalent of a participation trophy.

Yeah, good luck with enforcing an IAW on Bibi. I'd pay cash money to watch someone try to arrest him.

Make no mistake about it. This ICC warrant for Netanyahu's arrest is HORRIBLE for Israel and caught the US and Israel completely flat footed.

you didn't like the idea of recognizing hamas as a terror org, detaining leaders and confiscating funds?

what about payouts for "martyrs"? that you're a fan of?

The hell does this even mean. Forgot your Alzheimer's medication? You're gonna need to give context to your dipshit questions or no one knows WTF you're talking about.

 

[KnightTemplar]

Make no mistake about it. This ICC warrant for Netanyahu's arrest is HORRIBLE for Israel and caught the US and Israel completely flat footed.

Israel's reaction,

 

[avenue94]

is fatah a moderate faction?

Compared to Hamas yes, but far from perfect.

and israel preferred dealing with hamas so much israel threatened to withhold cooperation with the elections if hamas was on the ballot.

Yup, and then Israel and the US did their best to back coups against Hamas and drive them from power, which backfired.

of course, you seem to label hamas as "insurgents" and not terrorists.

They're terrorists engaged in an insurgency against Israel atm. You can oppose what Israel is angling for and still think Hamas is vile, ya know.

and the basic question of what their goal / objective is seems to be too hard a question to answer......

Hamas? Self preservation, control of the Gaza Strip, fighting Israel. It's important to distinguish between what terrorist or liberation groups say, and what they can actually do. Positions also change over time.

 

[avenue94]

implying what exactly?

Bibi knows that the investigations of 10/7 would be the final nail in the coffin for his political career (and with that, likely comes prison time). And so do his extremist allies who wouldn't have as much power after he's gone and a new government forms. The severity of 10/7 and death toll was less a credit to Hamas finding new capabilities and more to do with catastrophic security and political failures on Israel's end. And their current crop of leadership knows this.

 

[method115]

Biden is so awful that he's making Trump look good on issues that Trump is worse on, and Trump is dishonest and cynical enough to play along with people's false perceptions.

What a world.

I mean there's multiple ways to stop a war, like completely wiping the enemy off the map.

 

[Hog-train]

Israel's reaction,

Yea means so little that's why the the ex Israeli spy chief had to resort to threatening the chief ICC prosecutor.

Classic case of "I don't care!" while jimmies rustled.

 

[kflo]

Compared to Hamas yes, but far from perfect.

so this "to make sure that the only options Palestinians had left were extremists, not moderate factions." was a lie then. got it.

Yup, and then Israel and the US did their best to back coups against Hamas and drive them from power, which backfired.

They're terrorists engaged in an insurgency against Israel atm. You can oppose what Israel is angling for and still think Hamas is vile, ya know.

Hamas? Self preservation, control of the Gaza Strip, fighting Israel. It's important to distinguish between what terrorist or liberation groups say, and what they can actually do. Positions also change over time.

nothing about the eradication of israel and killing of jews? you don't think they see driving jews from the region is the goal? c'mon, there's no good faith discussion here.

 

[avenue94]

so this "to make sure that the only options Palestinians had left were extremists, not moderate factions." was a lie then. got it.

Moderate is a relative term, and Israel has been happy to favor an extreme faction (Hamas) over the most powerful moderate faction available (Fatah). I have no idea why you are so obsessed with denying a plain reality that has been reiterated repeatedly by Israel.

nothing about the eradication of israel and killing of jews? you don't think they see driving jews from the region is the goal? c'mon, there's no good faith discussion here.

It's their goal in the same way that North Korea wants to be a world power. Talk is one thing, the ability to follow through is another. And until a more moderate faction emerges, Israel has to partner with Hamas.

Notice how Israel still refused to share with the world it's plans for post-war Gaza?

 

[KnightTemplar]

Yea means so little that's why the the ex Israeli spy chief had to resort to threatening the chief ICC prosecutor.

Classic case of "I don't care!" while jimmies rustled.

Yeah, Bibi is going to do the Perp Walk any time now. Putin will probably be crapping himself about the mighty ICC coming after him as well.

That's what all the retards marching for Palestine fail to realise: nothing you do matters to Israel. They'll keep fucking Hamas and it's supporters, without lube, until they bleed out from their ass. And all the sanctions, international arrest warrents, protests etc won't change that.

So lay back, like good girls, and enjoy it.

 

[kflo]

Moderate is a relative term, and Israel has been happy to favor an extreme faction (Hamas) over the most powerful moderate faction available (Fatah). I have no idea why you are so obsessed with denying a plain reality that has been reiterated repeatedly by Israel.

It's their goal in the same way that North Korea wants to be a world power. Talk is one thing, the ability to follow through is another. And until a more moderate faction emerges, Israel has to partner with Hamas.

Notice how Israel still refused to share with the world it's plans for post-war Gaza?

You blatantly lied and you’re trying to make it about me?? Comical.

You claimed Israel made it so the ONLY options were extremists, not moderate factions. This is a blatant lie. Own it.

You are also trying to claim Israel actually preferred Hamas. This is also a blatant lie as they tried to make sure Hamas wasn’t on the ballot; and almost invaded Gaza to eliminate the threat they posed.

And yes, the other side is Hamas, who won’t stop working towards their stated goal.

Or do you think Hamas wants a peaceful solution with Israel in tact?

 

[Hog-train]

Yeah, Bibi is going to do the Perp Walk any time now. Putin will probably be crapping himself about the mighty ICC coming after him as well.

He's not going to be arrested because it will prevent him from traveling to many countries if it goes through.

Putin had to cancel his trip to the BRICS Summit because of his ICC arrest warrant. South Africa warned him not to come because of it.

So totally false that it has no teeth.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/07/19/world/putin-brics-summit-south-africa-intl/index.html