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International Hamas launches surprise attack on Israel; Israel has declared a state of war. Vol. III

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Your description of this war could be applied to a lot of other wars/battles: Vietnam, WW2, falujah.

I'd even argue its typical of asymetrical warfare.

I think the issue is that the bloodthirsty Israeli need it to be different so they can justify the murder of more than ten thousand civilians.



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Somewhat. Although, Britain killed far more German civilians than Germans did, but nobody argued they were the bad guys.

I think nam has some minor similarities on a broad level, like willing to sacrifice civilians, but it didnt come anywhere close to what Hamas is doing, how theyre doing it or what they believe.

Whatever similarities you find, at least any modern example, are going to pale in comparison to what Hamas and their ilk are doing, much less what theyre capable of doing. Murder and civilian casualties of war are separate things.
 
"journalists" running with hamas apparently isn't a hoax though........


and neither is the Israel supporter drawing the swaskitas and blaming it the Palestinian peace movement at stanford.
 
I know this is the start of your denial that any Palestinians civiliasn have been killed so I am not getting involved again. I do not beleive in such denail.
Lying again! Nice! Is there a post you’ll choose not to lie?

palestinian civilians have died.

so stop lying in like every post. It’s boring and sad.
 
While this might be true. Who cares? Am I supposed to feel bad that all these countries couldn't gather enough people to wipe out Israel like they wanted? It doesn't change the overall point of the video.

what? why wouldn't the facts matter?

If it didn't matter he wouldn't frame it in such a way. There is a reason people do this.

It flips the narrative when you change the framing of the scenario. Words have power and the west constantly uses this tactic to draw public support.

It's the reason people don't care when millions of "terrorists" die.
 
what? why wouldn't the facts matter?

If it didn't matter he wouldn't frame it in such a way. There is a reason people do this.

It flips the narrative when you change the framing of the scenario. Words have power and the west constantly uses this tactic to draw public support.

It's the reason people don't care when millions of "terrorists" die.

In this instance they don't matter because they don't change anything. I read what you said and I believe it but I still came away with the same conclusion at the end of the video. Which is why I said it doesn't matter.

If I tell you the story of a guy who brutally raped a 10 year old girl and I said the guy was 45. Then we find out he's 30 does that change anything to you? Does learning that the guy was 15 years younger change your overall thoughts on that story?
 
In this instance they don't matter because they don't change anything. I read what you said and I believe it but I still came away with the same conclusion at the end of the video. Which is why I said it doesn't matter.

If I tell you the story of a guy who brutally raped a 10 year old girl and I said the guy was 45. Then we find out he's 30 does that change anything to you? Does learning that the guy was 15 years younger change your overall thoughts on that story?


He cares less about "facts and truth" so much as pointing out that someone supporting Israel is wrong about something, no matter how inconsequential it is to the overall point. Hes one of those guys that started to shut the fuck up really quick about the hospital bombing once it came out that Israel didnt do it.
 
When Israel bombs a building and says there were insurgents there, how do we know if it's even true in each individual case? That could be them just saying that.
 
When Israel bombs a building and says there were insurgents there, how do we know if it's even true in each individual case? That could be them just saying that.
I dont see people on your side applying the same level of skepticism to the casualty reports from the Gaza officials.
 
In this instance they don't matter because they don't change anything. I read what you said and I believe it but I still came away with the same conclusion at the end of the video. Which is why I said it doesn't matter.

If I tell you the story of a guy who brutally raped a 10 year old girl and I said the guy was 45. Then we find out he's 30 does that change anything to you? Does learning that the guy was 15 years younger change your overall thoughts on that story?

That is not the same thing at all nor should we reach the same conclusion.

I'll give you an example of Ben Shapiro doing this.

Ben Shapiro: "The PLO promised there would not be any more violence after this agreement however there was an uptick of violence after this"

This statement is true however it implies that the Palestinians were the ones committing the violence. The statement is true because a lot of Israeli terrorists ran into shops and threw grenades killing thousands of Palestinians. The uptick of violence came from the Israelis. It's called lying by omission.

Can you see how you can say something true yet the results are different?

It's the same thing for the video I quoted. He makes it seem like Israel was struggling against the combination of multiple countries which makes it seem like they were fighting a much larger force and were lucky to survive. The truth is way different.
 
When Israel bombs a building and says there were insurgents there, how do we know if it's even true in each individual case? That could be them just saying that.
Ya but they provide an image in black in white with the building highlighted in red, so I guess that's evidence?

Looks like they just blew up another Human Shield Hospital a few hours ago...
 
When Israel bombs a building and says there were insurgents there, how do we know if it's even true in each individual case? That could be them just saying that.

If they just wanted to kill civilians for fun why didn't they gun down the thousands they've been letting walking right through their lines all this week?

Seems like a pretty good opportunity if that was the objective.
 
Source ?

Geneva conventions, you think Israel follows those ?

Are you really pretending this is remotely the same issue?

Hamas literally operates in violation of every norm..

Israel does not intentionally violate the Geneva Conventions...

You lose all credibility when you conflate the way Hamas and Israel conduct themselves.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/...y-gaza-palestine-al-shifa-hospital-rcna123624

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...-an-ambulance-being-used-by-hamas-2023-11-03/

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/r1pwadtqt
 
I dont see people on your side applying the same level of skepticism to the casualty reports from the Gaza officials.

I don't take the Gaza Ministry of Health's figures at face value either. Both sides obviously have strong political reasons to exaggerate.

And there's no accurate way to know ATM since it's basically blockaded and blackout of journalists.

However, the UN and the US both have estimated the deaths to be in the thousands.

If they just wanted to kill civilians for fun why didn't they gun down the thousands they've been letting walking right through their lines all this week?

Seems like a pretty good opportunity if that was the objective.

Willful disregard for civilian life can have similar results to targeting civilians on purpose.

The US lied about civilian deaths all the time in the Middle East wars.

Bradley Manning's helicopter video showed US Apache crews falsely claiming that there is shooting, opening fire and then laughing over the dead.

So why the hell would I take anything Israel or Hamas say at face value when there is such a strong political incentive to lie or omit information? Only a complete fool would just outright believe everything one side says.
 
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He cares less about "facts and truth" so much as pointing out that someone supporting Israel is wrong about something, no matter how inconsequential it is to the overall point. Hes one of those guys that started to shut the fuck up really quick about the hospital bombing once it came out that Israel didnt do it.
Has that even been solved? It still seems like all speculation.
 
News outlets deny prior knowledge of Hamas attack following a report from a pro-Israel media watchdog

From CNN's Oliver Darcy

Four news organizations strongly denied on Thursday having had prior knowledge of Hamas’ Oct. 7 terror attack after a pro-Israel watchdog outlet published a report claiming that freelance photographers from the outlets were present during the initial attack.

The pushback comes after the Israeli government demanded answers from the press and stoked questions about their credibility following the thinly sourced report from an agenda-driven media monitoring group that insinuated news organizations knew about the looming assault.

The Associated Press, Reuters, The New York Times, and CNN all swiftly issued statements strongly pushing back against the report published late Wednesday from the staunchly pro-Israel media watchdog, HonestReporting, that claimed photographers for the news outlets were present during the initial attack, citing screenshots posted on social media.

Two of the outlets, the Associated Press and CNN, however, said they had severed ties with the freelance photographer Hassan Eslaiah after he was identified in the report as having been present with Hamas militants during the heinous attack on the Jewish state.

“The Associated Press had no knowledge of the Oct. 7 attacks before they happened,” Lauren Easton, the director of media relations for the Associated Press, said in a statement. “The first pictures AP received from any freelancer show they were taken more than an hour after the attacks began. No AP staff were at the border at the time of the attacks, nor did any AP staffer cross the border at any time.”
“We are no longer working with Hassan Eslaiah, who had been an occasional freelancer for AP and other international news organizations in Gaza,” Easton added.
In a statement, CNN said Eslaiah was not working for the network on the day of the attack.

“We had no prior knowledge of the October 7th attacks,” a CNN spokesperson said. “Hassan Eslaiah, who was a freelance journalist working for us and many other outlets, was not working for the network on October 7th. As of today, we have severed all ties with him.”
Reuters also pushed back on the insinuation that it was somehow aware of the Hamas’ planned assault on Israel.

“Reuters categorically denies that it had prior knowledge of the attack or that we embedded journalists with Hamas on Oct. 7,” a Reuters spokesperson said, adding, “The photographs published by Reuters were taken two hours after Hamas fired rockets across southern Israel and more than 45 minutes after Israel said gunmen had crossed the border.”
“Reuters staff journalists were not on the ground at the locations referred to in the HonestReporting article,” the spokesperson added.
The New York Times also issued a statement about accusations made against another freelance photographer, Yousef Massoud, who was mentioned in HonestReporting’s report.

“Though Yousef was not working for The Times on the day of the attack, he has since done important work for us,” the company said. “There is no evidence for Honest Reporting’s insinuations. Our review of his work shows that he was doing what photojournalists always do during major news events, documenting the tragedy as it unfolded.”

HonestReporting has a history of making serious — and often misleading accusations against the news media.

https://edition.cnn.com/middleeast/live-news/israel-hamas-war-gaza-news-11-09-23/index.html

 
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