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In her interview with DOJ, Ghislaine Maxwell had nothing but praise for the president.
By ERICA ORDEN, JOSH GERSTEIN and KYLE CHENEY
Convicted sex trafficker Ghislaine Maxwell, who is seeking a pardon from Donald Trump, told top Justice Department officials during an interview last month that she never witnessed the president “in any inappropriate setting” with girls introduced to him by disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein.
Maxwell, Epstein’s co-conspirator who is serving a 20-year federal prison sentence, makes unfailingly flattering references to Trump, according to transcripts of the conversation released by the Justice Department on Friday. She says she “never” observed Trump receive a “massage,” which is the term prosecutors have said Epstein and Maxwell used as code language to describe sexual encounters with the girls and young women they recruited.
- I believe in them. Criminals never lie!
“I actually never saw the president in any type of massage setting,” she said in a hastily arranged interview that took place in Florida over the course of two days last month. “I never witnessed the president in any inappropriate setting in any way. The president was never inappropriate with anybody. In the times that I was with him, he was a gentleman in all respects.”
The Justice Department released the interview materials around the same time it delivered a tranche of the so-called Epstein files to Capitol Hill in response to a congressional subpoena. The information in those files is not yet public. The moves are part of the department’s continued efforts to quell the uproar from Trump’s MAGA base over the administration’s handling of the Epstein files.
The transcripts provide few fresh details about the Epstein saga, which has been meticulously documented in criminal and civil trials for decades. When Maxwell was pressed on newly reported information about Trump’s relationship with Epstein — including his purportedly raunchy submission to a book compiled for Epstein’s 50th birthday — Maxwell said she could not recall specifics. Trump has denied he wrote the submission and POLITICO has not independently verified it.
“It’s been so long,” Maxwell said when asked to recall the names of contributors to the book. “I want to tell you, but I don’t remember.”
Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche interviewed Maxwell, and the two were joined in the room by Diego Pestana, the acting associate deputy attorney general, an FBI special agent, a deputy U.S. marshal and three of Maxwell’s attorneys.
In February, DOJ released what it called the “first phase” of documents related to the Epstein investigation, which has been a fixation of some of the president’s supporters. But the limited materials it disclosed to far-right influencers only further infuriated Epstein conspiracy theorists who pressed the administration to release more documents related to the deceased sex trafficker.
It has long been public that Trump — along with other prominent figures — had a relationship with Epstein and was referenced in documents released in court cases involving him. Trump hasn’t been accused of any wrongdoing tied to Epstein. A spokesperson for the White House did not immediately respond to requests for comment on the release of the transcripts.
Maxwell was convicted at a jury trial in 2021 of having aided and participated in Epstein’s sex trafficking ring, which the government has said victimized more than 1,000 young women and girls. Epstein died in jail by suicide in 2019 while awaiting trial on sex trafficking charges. Prosecutors have called Maxwell a serial liar and also charged her with perjury but dropped those counts after her conviction on other charges.
“I never, ever saw any man doing something inappropriate with a woman of any age. I never saw inappropriate habits,” she said.
- Obviously. Trump hundred acusations are because he is well behaved!
Maxwell insisted she was unaware of any sexual contact between Epstein and minors or any other type of “non-consensual” sexual activity. But she said she now recognizes some of those things may have happened outside her presence.
“I’m not saying that Mr. Epstein did not do those things,” she said. “I don’t feel comfortable saying that today, given what I now know to be true. So I am not here to defend him. But what I can say is that I did not participate in that activity.”
Maxwell also acknowledged Epstein’s interest in women changed over time, moving toward younger women and even teenagers.
“I never understood that change to encompass children. I did see from when I met him, he was involved … however you want to characterize it, with women who were in their 20s. And then the slide to, you know, 18 or younger looking women. But I never considered that this would encompass criminal behavior,” she said.
While not taking responsibility for any criminal conduct, Maxwell said she and others close to Epstein accepted his obsessive tendencies involving massages and young women.
“I don’t think he did hide it. … And I think that the people around him, I think, myself included obviously normalized his behavior on a number of fronts,” she said. “I own my side of that fence that I was there and that I saw his behavior with women and didn’t challenge him or do something.”
But the administration reversed course last month, revealing that the unreleased evidence was largely a collection of explicit videos of girls, and that there was no evidence to contradict the conclusion that Epstein killed himself in prison or a supposed “client list.” The decision led to an uproar among Trump allies that exposed some cracks among the MAGA base and prompted an extraordinary rush by Trump allies to quell the furor.
Blanche’s decision to interview Maxwell — a highly unusual task for the No. 2 official at DOJ — as well as his ill-fated decision to seek the release of grand jury transcripts connected to the case, were aimed at tamping down the anger.
His decision to interview Maxwell came despite prosecutors’ longtime description of Maxwell as a serial liar. She was charged with two counts of perjury for lying to authorities during a deposition about Epstein. Those charges were later dropped after her conviction on other counts. She declined to testify at her trial.
- She is lying you know?
Nah, bro Epstein is inocent. Just like Harvey Weinstein
Maxwell, in the interviews, rejected claims by prosecutors that Epstein paid her enormous sums of money, as much as $30 million, during the course of their relationship. Prosecutors had suggested during her trial that the largesse was intended to keep her quiet about her role in recruiting underage girls to engage in sexual activity with him, but she denied that.
“That is categorically false,” she said.
Maxwell said some of the money funded investments and business deals, while other payments were moved to accounts linked to her but actually used to buy things for Epstein.
“My belief is that that money also contained money that was for a helicopter, for instance, that I never owned and I — was never mine,” she said.
By ERICA ORDEN, JOSH GERSTEIN and KYLE CHENEY
Convicted sex trafficker Ghislaine Maxwell, who is seeking a pardon from Donald Trump, told top Justice Department officials during an interview last month that she never witnessed the president “in any inappropriate setting” with girls introduced to him by disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein.
Maxwell, Epstein’s co-conspirator who is serving a 20-year federal prison sentence, makes unfailingly flattering references to Trump, according to transcripts of the conversation released by the Justice Department on Friday. She says she “never” observed Trump receive a “massage,” which is the term prosecutors have said Epstein and Maxwell used as code language to describe sexual encounters with the girls and young women they recruited.
- I believe in them. Criminals never lie!
“I actually never saw the president in any type of massage setting,” she said in a hastily arranged interview that took place in Florida over the course of two days last month. “I never witnessed the president in any inappropriate setting in any way. The president was never inappropriate with anybody. In the times that I was with him, he was a gentleman in all respects.”
The Justice Department released the interview materials around the same time it delivered a tranche of the so-called Epstein files to Capitol Hill in response to a congressional subpoena. The information in those files is not yet public. The moves are part of the department’s continued efforts to quell the uproar from Trump’s MAGA base over the administration’s handling of the Epstein files.
The transcripts provide few fresh details about the Epstein saga, which has been meticulously documented in criminal and civil trials for decades. When Maxwell was pressed on newly reported information about Trump’s relationship with Epstein — including his purportedly raunchy submission to a book compiled for Epstein’s 50th birthday — Maxwell said she could not recall specifics. Trump has denied he wrote the submission and POLITICO has not independently verified it.
“It’s been so long,” Maxwell said when asked to recall the names of contributors to the book. “I want to tell you, but I don’t remember.”
Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche interviewed Maxwell, and the two were joined in the room by Diego Pestana, the acting associate deputy attorney general, an FBI special agent, a deputy U.S. marshal and three of Maxwell’s attorneys.
In February, DOJ released what it called the “first phase” of documents related to the Epstein investigation, which has been a fixation of some of the president’s supporters. But the limited materials it disclosed to far-right influencers only further infuriated Epstein conspiracy theorists who pressed the administration to release more documents related to the deceased sex trafficker.
It has long been public that Trump — along with other prominent figures — had a relationship with Epstein and was referenced in documents released in court cases involving him. Trump hasn’t been accused of any wrongdoing tied to Epstein. A spokesperson for the White House did not immediately respond to requests for comment on the release of the transcripts.
Maxwell was convicted at a jury trial in 2021 of having aided and participated in Epstein’s sex trafficking ring, which the government has said victimized more than 1,000 young women and girls. Epstein died in jail by suicide in 2019 while awaiting trial on sex trafficking charges. Prosecutors have called Maxwell a serial liar and also charged her with perjury but dropped those counts after her conviction on other charges.
Maxwell describes Epstein’s behavior
Maxwell’s denials of inappropriate behavior went well beyond Trump. She told DOJ officials in their interviews that she never witnessed any misconduct by any men who visited or traveled with Epstein — contradicting both what Justice Department officials have concluded and mountains of evidence presented at her criminal trial and in numerous civil cases.“I never, ever saw any man doing something inappropriate with a woman of any age. I never saw inappropriate habits,” she said.
- Obviously. Trump hundred acusations are because he is well behaved!
Maxwell insisted she was unaware of any sexual contact between Epstein and minors or any other type of “non-consensual” sexual activity. But she said she now recognizes some of those things may have happened outside her presence.
“I’m not saying that Mr. Epstein did not do those things,” she said. “I don’t feel comfortable saying that today, given what I now know to be true. So I am not here to defend him. But what I can say is that I did not participate in that activity.”
Maxwell also acknowledged Epstein’s interest in women changed over time, moving toward younger women and even teenagers.
“I never understood that change to encompass children. I did see from when I met him, he was involved … however you want to characterize it, with women who were in their 20s. And then the slide to, you know, 18 or younger looking women. But I never considered that this would encompass criminal behavior,” she said.
While not taking responsibility for any criminal conduct, Maxwell said she and others close to Epstein accepted his obsessive tendencies involving massages and young women.
“I don’t think he did hide it. … And I think that the people around him, I think, myself included obviously normalized his behavior on a number of fronts,” she said. “I own my side of that fence that I was there and that I saw his behavior with women and didn’t challenge him or do something.”
Trump admin tries to control the narrative
Trump and his allies fueled conspiracy theories about Epstein for years, hinting that the government was sitting on a trove of evidence of powerful people participating in Epstein’s sex trafficking operation, perhaps included on an incriminating client list Epstein supposedly kept. They also suggested Epstein’s death may have been the result of foul play. And Trump aides, including Attorney General Pam Bondi, fueled speculation further when they suggested in February that a massive release of files was coming soon.But the administration reversed course last month, revealing that the unreleased evidence was largely a collection of explicit videos of girls, and that there was no evidence to contradict the conclusion that Epstein killed himself in prison or a supposed “client list.” The decision led to an uproar among Trump allies that exposed some cracks among the MAGA base and prompted an extraordinary rush by Trump allies to quell the furor.
Blanche’s decision to interview Maxwell — a highly unusual task for the No. 2 official at DOJ — as well as his ill-fated decision to seek the release of grand jury transcripts connected to the case, were aimed at tamping down the anger.
His decision to interview Maxwell came despite prosecutors’ longtime description of Maxwell as a serial liar. She was charged with two counts of perjury for lying to authorities during a deposition about Epstein. Those charges were later dropped after her conviction on other counts. She declined to testify at her trial.
- She is lying you know?
Nah, bro Epstein is inocent. Just like Harvey Weinstein
Maxwell, in the interviews, rejected claims by prosecutors that Epstein paid her enormous sums of money, as much as $30 million, during the course of their relationship. Prosecutors had suggested during her trial that the largesse was intended to keep her quiet about her role in recruiting underage girls to engage in sexual activity with him, but she denied that.
“That is categorically false,” she said.
Maxwell said some of the money funded investments and business deals, while other payments were moved to accounts linked to her but actually used to buy things for Epstein.
“My belief is that that money also contained money that was for a helicopter, for instance, that I never owned and I — was never mine,” she said.
