getting counter'd

Discussion in 'Standup Technique' started by Jrohm24, Dec 18, 2012.

  1. Jrohm24

    Jrohm24 Orange Belt

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    Not trying to be that guy but tonight at muay thai i really lost some confidence. I felt like everytime i tried to punch i got counterpunched. no matter what. i dont know what im doing wrong but i got so frustrated everytime i tried to land a punch. Makes me feel like i just got set back big time from where ive felt the last few weeks. this is sort of a rant, but if anyone has any tips or advice it'd be appreciated
     
  2. DoctorTaco

    DoctorTaco Breadhead

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    Sounds a little like sparring partner syndrome.

    People on here can (and will) give you advice. Some relevant and helpful, some convoluted and confusing.

    The person you should be talking to is your sparring partner. Ask them how and why they were beating you to the punch
     
  3. LZD

    LZD Purple Belt

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    Show up to training every night. Regardless of how often you get tooled/embarrassed.

    I'm sure Jose Aldo gets owned from time to time (perhaps often) sparring people like Anderson Silva and Machida. I imagine it would be worse for Paul Daley if he ever spars with Gokhan Saki and Badr Hari. Who cares? Jose hasn't lost a fight since 2005.

    Rather than losing confidence, gain confidence knowing that you are acquiring experience against better fighters. As the doc said, learn from them by asking questions.
     
  4. Azam

    Azam Brown Belt

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    Use your training as a chance to improve - everyone has ups & downs in training - heck it even happens to guys with bag loads of experience - there's no reason to feel down - don't look at it as 'feel like i just got set back big time from where ive felt the last few weeks' but rather 'I've reached a new phase or level in my training'


    If he's countering you alot - use it - learn how to start feinting when striking, how to change elevation in combinations to keep him guessing, to counter the counter, to improve the way you time shots - think tactics & strategy - what I'm saying is - this is a good opportunity provided you use it - to be better than you were at a few weeks ago - a good chance to learn new crap that's only going to add to you.
     
  5. Pugilistic

    Pugilistic Silver Belt

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    It helps to know which punches were getting countered and when and how you were getting countered. Right hand over the jab? Uppercut counter to the body hook?

    If you're getting countered coming in, feint and jab more. Throw a feint to make the guy counter and miss, then he'll be less enthusiastic about throwing counters since he'll be afraid of missing and opening himself up. Or feint, and counter his counter.
     
  6. TheBruteFist

    TheBruteFist Orange Belt

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    Guys, he didn't ask for a motivation thread... what's with the "never give up"?

    Anyway, TS, getting countered only means one thing, timing, either you got bad timing (pattern, range, etc) or he got good timing (good reflex actions, experience, basically a counter fighter, etc) and in either way, you will learn how to adapt (either reach his level or get past him or learn how not to get counted, etc etc) by sparring alot.
     
  7. Jrohm24

    Jrohm24 Orange Belt

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    its mainly everytime i pop in with my jab or cross. i feel like kept getting popped by their straight punch first. not so much on my hooks or uppercuts. maybbe i should work on my feints more as ive never really worked with them before. ive only been seriously training for roughly a year.
     
  8. Discipulus

    Discipulus Black Belt

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    Not getting countered has to do with more than just timing, in my opinion. Since I've started focusing on it, I've been able to throw jabs right from my chin that my opponent sees coming, tries to counter, and yet can't touch me with their jab while mine lands. It has to do with positioning--the subtle sink, slip, and pull of a good jab from a lowered stance.

    Regardless, TS, your sparring partner can tell you what is actually allowing him to counter you. Unless he's a douch, he'll be glad to point those out to you if you ask. Ask him what opening he sees when you throw a particular punch at him, or why the counter he keeps landing consistently seems open to him. It could be that you're telegraphing the shot or timing it poorly, as Brutefist was saying; or it could be that you're punching with bad form and leaving yourself open. Or it could be that you're allowing your partner to get an angle on you. Just ask next time you spar.

    And don't look at it as a setback. Just look at it as a learning experience. You should enter every round of sparring with a goal, and now you know what goals to try and achieve next time.
     
  9. Discipulus

    Discipulus Black Belt

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    See, this sounds like what I was guessing: that your head is staying static when you punch. You need to work on your punching mechanics to fix that. There have been a lot of threads around here lately discussing good jab and right hand mechanics. Check out Sinister's Tile Exercise for Boxing thread. Get those motions down and you'll notice a near-instantaneous improvement.
     
  10. Pugilistic

    Pugilistic Silver Belt

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    It ain't a set back for sure. Now you know you're susceptible to counters. Now you have something you need to work on. Next time you spar this guy, try not to get hit by counters so much.

    Feints take practice like everything else. I've been training for about 3 years and I'm now getting the idea of feints. Instead of just throwing a jab, step in like you're throwing it and step back out of range to mess with his rhythm. He can't counter you if you're not really punching. Then when he doesn't expect it, throw a real jab.

    Or you can pretend to throw a straight but then throw a left hook instead. I've been using this a lot to get inside.

    You also want to have your head off center when you throw to make his straight punches miss.
     
  11. Jrohm24

    Jrohm24 Orange Belt

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    that sounds about right. i do notice that i leave my head in place 99% of the time im throwing. so your saying like when i throw my punches not to leave my head where its at while im in stance?
     
  12. Discipulus

    Discipulus Black Belt

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    Absolutely. Seriously, check out this thread:

    http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f11/tile-exercise-boxing-2255705/

    Read through and watch the videos. The latest video near the end of the thread is an excellent example of how your body and head should move, both for good power and balance in your punches, and good defense from counters. There's just a small, subtle amount of movement and weight shift needed, but it makes a world of difference. Good luck!
     
  13. Jrohm24

    Jrohm24 Orange Belt

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    oh and thanks for the reply homie! appreciate a long response that actually took thought
     
  14. Jrohm24

    Jrohm24 Orange Belt

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    thanks man, appreciate it big time
     
  15. Discipulus

    Discipulus Black Belt

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    No problem. It's definitely been helping me big time. I felt very confident the last time I sparred and, perhaps best in my case, I didn't gas because of that confidence. Being able to relax and think in sparring is the shit, and it's hard to do that when you get tagged every time you think about attacking.
     
  16. Jrohm24

    Jrohm24 Orange Belt

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    im on the thread now, which video were you saying i should check out? the very last one posted by Lucas Coradini?
     
  17. Jrohm24

    Jrohm24 Orange Belt

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    I think i kind of get what your getting at. So instead of driving my head directly forward with my straight punches, my head should go just slightly forward with a bit of a diagonal motion towards the hand that isnt punching.
     
  18. TheBruteFist

    TheBruteFist Orange Belt

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    Its called weight shifting...Your body's weight moves from left to the right leg and from right to the left leg as you punch, not only your face, that would be epic, only moving your head left and right as you punch lolol. ehm. yeah, just, try to understand what is he actually doing in the video, i can see you only looked at his head. His whole body transferred in every punch to another side. By the way, can you record a video of your self punching? Just shadow.
     
  19. Discipulus

    Discipulus Black Belt

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    Lucas' video is good, as is the one Sinister posted last. It's of a guy named David, I believe.

    As for your description: sort of. The cross is a much harder motion to learn than it seems at first. I've had a long battle with trying to get mine just right. The weight, as Sinister describes it, moves diagonally downward. I didn't get what that meant when I first heard it, but I can feel it now. What you want to avoid is driving your weight forward off the back foot, because that will only make you give the opponent your face. You want to bend your knees, and drop that weight from your right hip (assuming you're orthodox) onto your left hip as you throw the cross. When I do it right I can really feel my left hip kind of fold at the joint. It works better for me to feel this weight go into my hip than just into my lead foot, because when I focus on foot-to-foot weight transfer, I tend to start leaning again.

    sullivan80 once told me "turn, don't lean," and that's been a good maxim to keep in mind. You're dropping your weight onto your lead hip, turning your hips and shoulders, as if trying to bring that right shoulder over your left leg.

    Ideally your head doesn't go forward much at all. It moves side to side slightly with the punches. On the jab there's a bit of a pulling back motion of the upper body as the arm extends, as well. But remember that any side-to-side movement is a function of your hips being loaded--weight moving back and forth from one hip to the other. It's not you deliberately moving your head or upper body around. Weight goes from one hip to the next, the head moves the right way on its own.

    Hopefully that helps. All I know about good boxing I learned on this forum, so post videos and stick with it. I promise you'll see improvement, and hopefully get your butt kicked less often. The fewer punches you take to the grill, the better. That's good boxing.

    P.S. I see now you do Muay Thai. No worries. So do I. :cool: The same shit applies.
     
  20. Jrohm24

    Jrohm24 Orange Belt

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    ill try to get a video up here in a few of a little shadow boxing. itll just be at the house though its a little to late to hit the gym haha
     

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