General MMA discussion and future lines - August 2016

[plekz]

? How does

because if the intrest was to put on the best fight, that just trump ''asses in seats'' rory is what 26 now? if he wants to he has atleast 4 years left in the sport, and he's only ever lost to people who's either been champ or rated in the top 5 of the division.

conor been offered a straight up title fight in lw (if he wants it) further affirms that the so called ''sport'' is a fucking spectacle. and even if bellator pinch a fighter here and there, they'll still never have the market power to compete with the ufc.

and with a union it's likely that the gaps wouldn't have been as immense as they are now in terms of salaries.

 

[Joseph Budden]

because if the intrest was to put on the best fight, that just trump ''asses in seats'' rory is what 26 now? if he wants to he has atleast 4 years left in the sport, and he's only ever lost to people who's either been champ or rated in the top 5 of the division.

conor been offered a straight up title fight in lw (if he wants it) further affirms that the so called ''sport'' is a fucking spectacle. and even if bellator pinch a fighter here and there, they'll still never have the market power to compete with the ufc.

and with a union it's likely that the gaps wouldn't have been as immense as they are now in terms of salaries.

Correct, putting asses in seats is what brings the UFC money. Lets be honest, Rory is getting the Fitch/Okami treatment. Is he a top guy? Sure. But other than the Lawler fight, he hasn't had a casually appealing fight in a long ass time and putting him in a main event anywhere but Canada isn't going to get people excited. Couple that with the fact hes already competed with a majority of the top talent, why spend budgeted roster money on out bidding Bellator when there are still guys like Larkin and Cerrone who are now free agents?

Conor's situation does nothing but affirm that if you are an asset to the company, than you gain more leeway. OF COURSE thats how it works, thats how life works. Conor fighting for the LW belt will do over a million PPV buys. Anyone else in that slot won't even be in the same hemisphere.

EDIT also the salary argument is a nonsensical one. If you want salaries to go up, you need Conor in the biggest fights possible cause he'll generate the most revenue which in turn will eventually bounce back to the fighters. This has been a great year for increase in pay for fighters. The sport is still in infancy, its only going to get better and better

 

[plekz]

Conor fighting for the LW belt will do over a million PPV buys

it's supposed to be a sport, not the fucking wwe.

EDIT also the salary argument is a nonsensical one.

no but yours is moronic, the ''increase'' is fucking crumbs if even that of what we would be looking at if the sport was unionized. of course you do not give a fuck, since you are just a vulture at the end of the day who is trying to profit on people putting their life and welfare on the line so why would you give a fuck if fighters don't earn a pension and suffer long term damage right? i mean it's not you in there.

it's a scary thought to think you are supposed to become some sort of contributing part of society.

 

[LEMONZEST]

i understand why ufc let rory go, from a ''asses in seats'' perspective, but that really also confirms that this ''sport'' is still a fucking spectacle, and the notion that it belongs in the olympics is fucking laughable.

i hope 2017 is the year we see a union formed for real.

I agree that it is time for a fighters union. Fighers are not getting paid nearly enough.

However I really don't agree about letting Rory go. If I was UFC I would let him go too - he is a broken fighter. Rory's nose injury is a very real and ongoing concern, he likely won't be the same guy. I say this as a big Rory fan, I freaking love this guy (fellow Canadian). He will still be one of my fave fighters even though he probably will never be a champ, even in Bellator. FWIW I think the more good fighters that go to Bellator the better. UFC needs a real competitor and Bellator is poised to become a serious org. over the coming years.

he'll generate the most revenue which in turn will eventually bounce back to the fighters.

awww thats cute I like idealism.

 

[Joseph Budden]

it's supposed to be a sport, not the fucking wwe.



no but yours is moronic, the ''increase'' is fucking crumbs if even that of what we would be looking at if the sport was unionized. of course you do not give a fuck, since you are just a vulture at the end of the day who is trying to profit on people putting their life and welfare on the line so why would you give a fuck if fighters don't earn a pension and suffer long term damage right? i mean it's not you in there.

it's a scary thought to think you are supposed to become some sort of contributing part of society.

Right, its a sport. But its like you're comparing it to other sports when thats non sensical. Its its own unique entity, and saying to yourself ''aw shit in the NFL all the best teams play each other and all the best players are there! So thats how UFC should be'' is nonsensical for many reasons.

Oh man plekz i'm not in the mood for you to be a cunt so don't throw the moronic shit and me being a vulture around when you clearly are lacking in terms of business management knowledge lol. No one is arguing they wouldn't get a bigger piece of the pie if the sport was unionized (even though the union is likely to ONLY be for UFC and not MMA as a whole). I think everyone who wants to see the fighters maximize their worth wants that. But that still doesn't take away the FACT fighter pay has done nothing but increase. Do you think within the first 15 years of the NBA being formed the athletes were all rich? (don't pull some bullshit about the UFC being around longer when that is the time period it has been profitable)

 

[Joseph Budden]

I agree that it is time for a fighters union. Fighers are not getting paid nearly enough.

However I really don't agree about letting Rory go. If I was UFC I would let him go too - he is a broken fighter. Rory's nose injury is a very real and ongoing concern, he likely won't be the same guy. I say this as a big Rory fan, I freaking love this guy (fellow Canadian). He will still be one of my fave fighters even though he probably will never be a champ, even in Bellator. FWIW I think the more good fighters that go to Bellator the better. UFC needs a real competitor and Bellator is poised to become a serious org. over the coming years.



awww thats cute I like idealism.

Not idealism, even though obviously I can't state that factually. Idealism is this notion that the sport is denigrated unless the UFC makes sure they always sign the top ranked guys, and always match make them accordingly.

But Conor is the companies number one asset as far as the roster is concerned, by a country mile (besides Rousey). Thats a lot more valuable than Conor haters would like to admit. Not just for himself and the company, but the sport as a whole.

 

[LEMONZEST]

Not idealism, even though obviously I can't state that factually. Idealism is this notion that the sport is denigrated unless the UFC makes sure they always sign the top ranked guys, and always match make them accordingly.

But Conor is the companies number one asset as far as the roster is concerned, by a country mile (besides Rousey). Thats a lot more valuable than Conor haters would like to admit. Not just for himself and the company, but the sport as a whole.

I am just giving you a hard time. I was only referring to the portion I quoted...specifically that when the UFC makes more money then that will trickle down to the fighters.

The UFC is a corporation and the goal of every company is to make a profit. The UFC views their fighters as an expense, and as such seek to minize their expenses as much as possible while maximizing their profit. I don't really see this as UFC being villains because every company operates this way.

Let say for example that Starbucks gross profit is 13B this year. If the following year their gross profit is 22B will all their employees make more? They might get a little pay bump but the vast majority of that extra profit will go to stakeholders.

I think it is time for a union so all the fighters get a piece of the pie and not just the McStars. People, even debuting, in the UFC and getting 10k is criminal.

 

[Joseph Budden]

I am just giving you a hard time. I was only referring to the portion I quoted...specifically that when the UFC makes more money then that will trickle down to the fighters.

The UFC is a corporation and the goal of every company is to make a profit. The UFC views their fighters as an expense, and as such seek to minize their expenses as much as possible while maximizing their profit. I don't really see this as UFC being villains because every company operates this way.

Let say for example that Starbucks gross profit is 13B this year. If the following year their gross profit is 22B will all their employees make more? They might get a little pay bump but the vast majority of that extra profit will go to stakeholders.

I think it is time for a union so all the fighters get a piece of the pie and not just the McStars. People, even debuting, in the UFC and getting 10k is criminal.

You are right about the minimizing expenses maximizing profits parts, but the fighters are more assets than they are expenses. An expense is more along the lines of bringing in Sinead O Connor to sing for Conor. EDIT bad example since that was a one time thing. An expense is more along the lines of buying a new octagon mat for every event. Something they HAVE to spend money to properly function, but really doesn't have a substantial impact on revenue

Starbucks is different in that every employee is replaceable. There will ALWAYS be someone in need of a job who will accept their offer of employment. You only have so many top level fighters in the world. As they realize their worth and demand a larger chunk of the pie, as Conor and Nate have, its going to have a trickle down effect cause either A.) the other fighters will look to unionize thus forcing the UFCs hand or B.) the UFC will up fighter pay (as they have) and delegate more of their chunk of the pie to mitigate grievances from their other assets (fighters).

If the fighter's don't unionize before the FOX deal expires and UFC has to negotiate a new TV deal, honestly thats just ridiculous stupidity on their end. They will all be GREATLY compensated, from the top to the bottom, if their union is modeled anything like the other leagues.

 

[rille31]

rumour: gsp-nick diaz for ufc 206 toronto

 

[Shoulder]

rumour: gsp-nick diaz for ufc 206 toronto

Anyone reporting on this or where did you read about it?

 

[Ballsaque]

rumour: gsp-nick diaz for ufc 206 toronto

Oh god, please no.

 

[rille31]

Anyone reporting on this or where did you read about it?

some swedish mma site

 

[Joseph Budden]

Arnold Allen vs Mirsad Bektic at 204

Poor Arnold gonna get killed in front of his people

 

[Shoulder]

some swedish mma site

Kimura or MMA-nytt? Couldn't find anything there...

 

[Gametheory]

Anyone else tempted to bet a lot on Gall, over CM Punk?
I watched his videos on Youtube and Punk is straight up beginner who has been learning the game.
Gall is young in the game too but he has many years of training over Punk and Gall is much younger.

And it's Punk's debut...

 

[EzFlyer]

leaning gall sub, but let's no one go nuts here. no one knows what to expect, really. and gall is hardly a proven vet

 

[Joseph Budden]

leaning gall sub, but let's no one go nuts here. no one knows what to expect, really. and gall is hardly a proven vet

Yeah no offense guys, but I kind of cringe everytime I hear someone saying they're gonna unload bank on Gall. Why would anyone do such a thing when we've never seen Punk fight (I know he looks like complete shit on the show, but keep in mind they're showing his first sparring sessions) and Gall has had one fight that lasted about 30 seconds against a can.

Complete dog for fun or pass fight, laying close to -300 in this situation is nuts to me

 

[LEMONZEST]

Are there uknowns about Punk/Gall ? Sure. However, there is still value on Gall just on the face of it. Gall is an actuall MMA fighter that trains BJJ, cardio, boxing skills etc. Gall came up through the amateur circuit to be in the UFC with 2 legit amateur wins.

Punk is a complete unkown factor. The fact is most people are not cut out for full combat sports like MMA. It is very unlikely Punk goes from WWE to being a decent fighter (BJJ, wrestling, endurance, boxing etc.) in like what - 1 year or so? Punk is also starting off his career coming off of a back injury ...

So yeah there are unknowns for this bout and it is gambling but I think 3-1 or taking Gall ITD has value for at least a few units.

Also its not like we have no information on Gall he has a few fights under his belt...

 

[Agent Mulder]

Are there uknowns about Punk/Gall ? Sure. However, there is still value on Gall just on the face of it. Gall is an actuall MMA fighter that trains BJJ, cardio, boxing skills etc. Gall came up through the amateur circuit to be in the UFC with 2 legit amateur wins.

Punk is a complete unkown factor. The fact is most people are not cut out for full combat sports like MMA. It is very unlikely Punk goes from WWE to being a decent fighter (BJJ, wrestling, endurance, boxing etc.) in like what - 1 year or so? Punk is also starting off his career coming off of a back injury ...

So yeah there are unknowns for this bout and it is gambling but I think 3-1 or taking Gall ITD has value for at least a few units.

Also its not like we have no information on Gall he has a few fights under his belt...

Agree except for the "few units" part, I will probably do 1u tho.

 

[Joseph Budden]

Are there uknowns about Punk/Gall ? Sure. However, there is still value on Gall just on the face of it. Gall is an actuall MMA fighter that trains BJJ, cardio, boxing skills etc. Gall came up through the amateur circuit to be in the UFC with 2 legit amateur wins.

Punk is a complete unkown factor. The fact is most people are not cut out for full combat sports like MMA. It is very unlikely Punk goes from WWE to being a decent fighter (BJJ, wrestling, endurance, boxing etc.) in like what - 1 year or so? Punk is also starting off his career coming off of a back injury ...

So yeah there are unknowns for this bout and it is gambling but I think 3-1 or taking Gall ITD has value for at least a few units.

Also its not like we have no information on Gall he has a few fights under his belt...

Fair enough there is some footage of Gall. But everyone is just assuming Punk is going to get blown out for a bunch of hypotheticals. Gonna lol when he wins this fight