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Game of Thrones S07E07 Discussion Thread: FinallyJumpedTheDragon (No Spoilers/Leaks)

The book it's even more straight forward.

I have read all the books and not it is not more straight forward because GRRM never answered it. Varys has something interesting going on. No reason to think LF does not.

1.) Martin has overall control of the story. It's his. He may not be writing the lines and the scenes since he's writing the books again, but he is telling them where to take the show to match up with the books. They aren't making up their own story separate from the books.

I would say that this is possible, but it is also possible he has a bit of different things to put in the book or it is possible he does not have all the answers or the answers could change in the next decade before the books are finished
 
LF clearly just wanted power/fame..

he came from a tiny 'house' that was gifted that title in the first place, w/ no real power or knights or anything to call upon

I mean he coulda chilled w/ Lysa and his presumed weirdo son after killing Jon Aryen, but no.....

he had to stay scheming
he likely only owns brothels to gather intel on the elite/wealthy
nah he just had a thing for climbing laddduhs
 
IN THE SHOW, which is what this thread is for.
None of the Starks have black hair. Hell, even the Baratheons don't have black hair.

I'm finding too many potential spoilers from the books in here so I will have to put more posters on ignore to avoid them.
Damn bruh calm down.
 
I know everyone is calling it the 'Loot Train Attack' but wasn't that part of the army mostly (if not all) grain? Randall Tarley clearly informed Jamie that the loot made it safely to KL. So shouldn't it be called the "Grain Train Attack"?
 
I know everyone is calling it the 'Loot Train Attack' but wasn't that part of the army mostly (if not all) grain? Randall Tarley clearly informed Jamie that the loot made it safely to KL. So shouldn't it be called the "Grain Train Attack"?

i just rewatched a scene. from that episode where bronn and jaime are talking and they open up a carriage and it looked like a shit ton of gold bars and bags in it
 
i just rewatched a scene. from that episode where bronn and jaime are talking and they open up a carriage and it looked like a shit ton of gold bars and bags in it
That carriage is prior to the attack on the convoy though.

Right before Jaime hears the sounds of hoofbeats and shit from the Dothraki horder Randyll comes up to him and says the majority of the carriages have made it over the river blahblahblah "want me to whip the last of the stragglers to hurry up".
 
i just rewatched a scene. from that episode where bronn and jaime are talking and they open up a carriage and it looked like a shit ton of gold bars and bags in it

yes, that was at the beginning. But before the attack, Randell tell Jamie and Bronn that that said shit ton of gold bars and bags have made it passed the gates of KL
 
Anyone else still think Cersei isn't actually preggers?

She seems to only bring it up when she wants something or wants someone to do something her way and not the way they were going to.
 
There has not been. I'm just thinking about what could be the Night Kings motives as I hope that it is more than just kill everyone at the end.
Considering it's been 6 seasons and we haven't gotten much about their motives other than the Children of the Forest made them to fight the first men...

Their motivation is to kill everything and make it eternal night.
 
I get the first paragraph but I still don't think Lyanna would go along with passing along another person's child to Ned. I just don't think that would happen.

You don't think she would attempt to save her husband's son? That her love ended just for him? I think that runs contrary to human nature and who both Lyana and the Starks are as people. I don't see any of the people involved in that saying "Yo, F this baby".

As to the prophecy, I'm not saying the prophecy has to be introduced but in the fucking show we have NO RECORD that Rhaegar even knew of the fucking prophecy or believed in it. HELL, WE NEVER EVEN HEAR THE NAMES OF THE TWO KIDS THE MOUNTAIN KILLED EITHER. We just know them as Oberyn's nephew and niece.

While that's true, the books and the show aren't two seperate worlds. They're the same world, with the same story.



I really feel like the limitations of six episodes, even if they're at 1.5 to 2 hours long there just isn't enough time to introduce the fact that Rhaegar knew of the prophecy, believed in it almost fanatically, and had Varys pull the kid out prior to The Mountain and Tywin appearing at KL is just too much to get into the show and explain with the Army of the Dead coming, the Golden Company coming, and in general shit hitting the fan.



Introducing the fact that Rhaegar knew of the prophecy, that Varys secreted out a infant during a siege, Lyanna willingly went along with passing off another's child as her own to her own brother... that's a whole hell of a lot of Bran flashbacks to explain that.

Most of this coming season is going to have to be relatively focused. They're going to have to spend whole episodes on one subject and not jump around. I don't think it's going to be out of the realm of possibility that much of this next season is one big Bran flash back.


It also aids in keeping anyone from questioning who Jon really is.

I'm sure more people than Cat were curious who the baby was that Jon came back from Dorne with and why Howland Reed basically has gone into hiding in his lands and hasn't been seen since the war. Hell, Reed as far as we know in either the show or the book didn't even help with the Greyjoy Rebellion when Robert, Ned, Thoros, Jorah, and Jaime with other D-Day'd on Pyke.

Other than The Hound, The Mountain, and Jaime is there any people of a noble house that would be willing to truly get in the face of the man that everyone believes bested the Sword of the Morning in single combat? I doubt any one would which is why Ned's story of "it was a tavern girl" no one but show-Stannis seems to doubt.

"That Ned's bastard? The son of some tavern slut" -Stannis' wife watching Jon train new recruits
"That wasn't Ned Stark's way" -Stannis

I feel like Stannis, outside of now Bran and Sam (and probably Arya and Sansa off screen after their convo) was the only one that even suspected that Jon was something more.

I got the feeling that many people didn't believe the "Ned Stark's son" story. Robert seemed to want to talk about who the mother was, that it was odd that he wouldn't know her. And like you said, Stannis says that wasn't his way.
 
You don't think she would attempt to save her husband's son? That her love ended just for him? I think that runs contrary to human nature and who both Lyana and the Starks are as people. I don't see any of the people involved in that saying "Yo, F this baby".
IDK, maybe? I just think logistically in the show there isn't enough time to get that all out.

lfd0311 said:
Most of this coming season is going to have to be relatively focused. They're going to have to spend whole episodes on one subject and not jump around. I don't think it's going to be out of the realm of possibility that much of this next season is one big Bran flash back.
While I agree it's going to be focused, with the horde coming through the Wall, Tormund/Beric likely on the run to Castle Black to get Edd and whoever they can ready and Jon stuck with nothing but horse lord rapists and cockless Spartan wannabes we won't have a ton of time for Bran sitting at the tree in his wheelchair viewing shit.

lfd0311 said:
I got the feeling that many people didn't believe the "Ned Stark's son" story. Robert seemed to want to talk about who the mother was, that it was odd that he wouldn't know her. And like you said, Stannis says that wasn't his way.
I get this feeling past 2 of the 3 Baratheon brothers (ie, the non-homo ones) and MAYBE Tywin, most everyone DID believe him. Outside of Robert who has reason to doubt as he has no clue who the mom COULD be, Stannis who doesn't believe Ned because Ned would never just randomly sleep around "that wasn't Ned Stark's way", and Tywin simply because he's, well, Tywin and suspicious of everything most everyone else had no reason not to doubt Ned's story.

Also, no one other than LF that could scheme or think otherwise of Jon has meet him for more than a couple minutes at a time. Cersei has only met him for like 10-20 minutes tops during the summit, Varys sees him once in awhile but doesn't have the spy network he once had and his concerns seem to be elsewheres right now, LF is dead, and I doubt The Hound gives two flying fucks and neither would Davos at this juncture.
 
Why is that retarded? You have to make some sort of argument, other than just "no". Rhaegar never sees this kid, if it is in fact his child with Lyana, which by the way would be massively, massively premature and would not have grown up into a normal, healthy child. Why would she, of her own initiative name it Aegon? What connection does that name have for her? Nothing, none. It makes no sense that she would do that.

Maybe she knows that Elia Martel's Aegon is dead and she's giving this child that name on the basis that Rhaegar would have wanted that.

Or maybe Rhaegar was like George Foreman or BJ Penn's dad and wanted to give all of his sons the same name.

Or maybe show Jon's true name will be Aegon while book Jon's true name will be something different since on the show the name's still available since they have never stated the names of Rhaegar's children on the show.
 
While that's true, the books and the show aren't two seperate worlds. They're the same world, with the same story.

They're two separate worlds with commonality. Alternate versions of each other. It's a misstep to conflate the two to support theories for either one.
 
They're two separate worlds with commonality. Alternate versions of each other. It's a misstep to conflate the two to support theories for either one.
CW DC universe vs cinematic DC universe?
 
You don't think she would attempt to save her husband's son? That her love ended just for him? I think that runs contrary to human nature and who both Lyana and the Starks are as people. I don't see any of the people involved in that saying "Yo, F this baby".



While that's true, the books and the show aren't two seperate worlds. They're the same world, with the same story.





Most of this coming season is going to have to be relatively focused. They're going to have to spend whole episodes on one subject and not jump around. I don't think it's going to be out of the realm of possibility that much of this next season is one big Bran flash back.


It also aids in keeping anyone from questioning who Jon really is.



I got the feeling that many people didn't believe the "Ned Stark's son" story. Robert seemed to want to talk about who the mother was, that it was odd that he wouldn't know her. And like you said, Stannis says that wasn't his way.
Give it up, dude. You're wrong.
 
I'm sorry, but that just simply isn't the case anymore. You're falling into the trap of a common myth that germ has to OKAY everything before it goes ito production. This is a falsehood.


http://time.com/4791258/game-of-thrones-george-r-r-martin-interview/
https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywoo...rtin-game-of-thrones-new-story-targaryen-2017
https://grrm.livejournal.com/429752.html

D&D are indeed making up many elements of the show, as long as things fall into place in regards to the ultimate endgame..


Feel free to explain to me how that's in any way different than what I said. He isn't involved in the creative process, in the writing of the story. They check in with him to find out where the books are going. That's his whole involvement in the show at this point. They're making sure the books and the show end up at the same point.


How can you watch this show & think to yourself, "Yeah, germ definitely told them to do that. It makes total sense!"..

Bro... What? And what are you getting all butt hurt about? Or is being butt hurt on the internet just sort of your thing?

Sorry bud, but the puppet strings are not wrapped around germ's lil sausage fingers like you think they are. D&D are fucking runninng this shit. They always have been. There is a massive difference between showrunner (D&D) & co-executive producer (germ). Sorry to burst your bubble.


ROFL. So you're going to sit here and tell me that the books and the show are going to have two drastically different endings? That's actually what you think? OK, guy.....

What?? Did you read the passage that you copy & pasted? Nowhere does Varys make the claim that he stole the true Aegon from Westeros. He only talks about how Aegon has been bred to lead & rule since birth—Aegon who is already a known entity in Westeros at the time of this interaction. If anything, the way Varys talks about fAegon (& the ways in which he doesn't) are hints that fAegon is indeed a fake, not the actual son of Ellia & Rhaegar, & that Varys is flaunting his & Illario's brilliant scheme to take back the throne for the Targs w/ a fake, albeit a convincing fake.

Bro, have you paid a single bit of attention to anything I've typed? First of all, Young Griff, the man claimed to be the baby Aegon in the books is the one who says that Varys snuck the baby out of King's Landing. He says that the baby killed by the Mountian is a tanner's son traded to Varys for a jug of wine. He tells all of this to Tyrion.

Secondly, AS I'VE SAID ABOUT 5 TIMES NOW, Young Griff is a distraction. His purpose is to distract from Jon Snow. Varys is talking about Jon Snow, he isn't talking about Young Griff.

Lastly, you need to get into who Ned Stark says Snow's mother is. It's a woman named Wylla, who just so happens to be a Dornish wetnurse for the Dayne family, and Arthur Dayne's nephew. Now why in the world would he suggest that Jon Snow may be half Dornish? Where do you suppose he may have learned the name a Dornish wetnurse with connections to the Dayne family?

Snow is also described as having black eyes. The only other people that I remember being described as having black eyes are Elia and Oberyn Martell. (This is where you prove me wrong by providing someone else that might fit that description , and not just say something like "impossible!!" and act like that's an argument)




We're all making rebuttals that are way more grounded in the reality of this show than whatever you've been saying, but you're hilariously blinded by your crackpot theory.

ROFL. You have yet to make any sort of point that I can see. Keep trying to tell yourself that though.

Beric is literally a minor character. To say he is a central character just because he shared a couple scenes w/ Jon is funny as fuck.

If he's such a minor character, why is he still alive? Why is he becoming more and more a central part of the story? Critical thinking is really hard for you, huh?
 
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