Fedor Was Only 33yrs old When He lost to Werdum

[Mamou]

@Mamou

History of odds and rankings 2001-2004

Gary was ***NEVER**** ranked top 10. THAT MEANS HE WASN'T BEFORE HE FOUGHT FEDOR.

You are completely and 100% pathetic. You were wrong. Say it. I've proven it about 50 times over 3 days. Say it, nerd.

Just lol, seriously. I'm willing to bet you're single and still live with your parents.

October 2002 and October 2003 proves nothing regarding something that happened in August 2003.

 

[JKS]

It was actually 12 fights in PRIDE after he won the title, with 4-5 of them being ranked. I previously counted Nagata and Valavicious by mistake when I said 14. Regardless, let's say it was 5 out 12 that were ranked. That's 41.67% - less than half. Pretty shitty for the #1 HW champion in the world in the supposed top organization. Yes, it got better when he started to fight in Affliction and Strikeforce. The first time in his career that he fought 4 top 10's in a row, he lost. That's the entire point of talking about his level of competition. That streak was much easier to achieve because of the low level people he fought. I agree 100% he shouldn't be knocked for his earlier fights as an up and comer. It just gets lumped in because his streak was so massive.

Gary Goodridge was never ranked top 10, bro. Look: History of odds and rankings 2001-2004 - Sherdog Mixed Martial Arts Forums (archive.fo)

It was 12 that is correct, I didn't count Big Nog 2 as it was a NC but that is a fight on his record and a top 10 win. But you are incorrect, it's actually 8 top 10 wins. Fujita, Randleman, Coleman, Hunt, Big Nog 2x, Cro Cop and your boy Gary. So 8 of 12 is still very good, considering TK was a revenge match that Fedor took for a Bushido main event and a tune up for the Cro Cop fight and Zulu for a freak fight. Ogawa was a GP, you can't blame him for how the brackets work. Coleman 2 was just whatever.

The first time he fought 4 in a row was 11 years into his career. We both know if Fedor from 2005 fought those guys he would have creamed em. I don't think Fedor was shot but he was not the same fighter.

Yes, the streak was easier to achieve with some lower comp. But the point is that this happens to every fighter. There is no standard of having nothing but top ranked wins over a period of 20+ fights. No one has had that kind of resume, not Fedor, not Big Nog, not Khabib or Jones. In mma, we rationalize and grade everything by comparison to others and that is the standard. So even if Fedor had the lesser names on his record, it's still incredibly impressive and probably the best winning streak in the sports history.

And that's just sherdog rankings. There were many other rankings systems.

 

[Fioretti]

@Mamou

History of odds and rankings 2001-2004

Gary was ***NEVER**** ranked top 10. THAT MEANS HE WASN'T BEFORE HE FOUGHT FEDOR.

You are completely and 100% pathetic. You were wrong. Say it. I've proven it about 50 times over 3 days. Say it, nerd.

 

[Mamou]

@Mamou

History of odds and rankings 2001-2004

Gary was ***NEVER**** ranked top 10. THAT MEANS HE WASN'T BEFORE HE FOUGHT FEDOR.

You are completely and 100% pathetic. You were wrong. Say it. I've proven it about 50 times over 3 days. Say it, nerd.

Prove it

 

[Fioretti]

It was 12 that is correct, I didn't count Big Nog 2 as it was a NC but that is a fight on his record and a top 10 win. But you are incorrect, it's actually 8 top 10 wins. Fujita, Randleman, Coleman, Hunt, Big Nog 2x, Cro Cop and your boy Gary. So 8 of 12 is still very good, considering TK was a revenge match that Fedor took for a Bushido main event and a tune up for the Cro Cop fight and Zulu for a freak fight. Ogawa was a GP, you can't blame him for how the brackets work. Coleman 2 was just whatever.

The first time he fought 4 in a row was 11 years into his career. We both know if Fedor from 2005 fought those guys he would have creamed em. I don't think Fedor was shot but he was not the same fighter.

Yes, the streak was easier to achieve with some lower comp. But the point is that this happens to every fighter. There is no standard of having nothing but top ranked wins over a period of 20+ fights. No one has had that kind of resume, not Fedor, not Big Nog, not Khabib or Jones. In mma, we rationalize and grade everything by comparison to others and that is the standard. So even if Fedor had the lesser names on his record, it's still incredibly impressive and probably the best winning streak in the sports history.

And that's just sherdog rankings. There were many other rankings systems.

The NC isn't a win, but it is technically a fight, yes. Hunt and Randleman are very iffy top 10's, moreso Hunt, and Coleman was not top 10 the second time. Gary was never top 10, and it has been proven multiple times in this thread.

Compare the consistency of his level of competition to Jones, Werdum, Hendo, or JDS. Or any long standing UFC champion. These guys all have streaks of 10+ top 10 opponents. That's the point. They don't have win streaks of 27+, sure. Because they consistently fight better competition and one is more likely to lose when that happens. Such as Fedor going 3-3 when he finally fought 6 in a row, some of which were barely top 10, and one of which was ranked in a lower weightclass.

The rankings weren't Sherdog, they were MMAWeekly archives, which was the #1 in accuracy and most accepted source of rankings at the time.

 

[Fioretti]

Prove it

It's been proven, many times. If you need help reading, you're free to phone a friend, mama.

History of odds and rankings 2001-2004

Gary was ***NEVER**** ranked top 10. THAT MEANS HE WASN'T BEFORE HE FOUGHT FEDOR.

You are completely and 100% pathetic. You were wrong. Say it. I've proven it about 50 times over 3 days. Say it, nerd.

 

[Mamou]

It's been proven, many times. If you need help reading, you're free to phone a friend, mama.

History of odds and rankings 2001-2004

Gary was ***NEVER**** ranked top 10. THAT MEANS HE WASN'T BEFORE HE FOUGHT FEDOR.

You are completely and 100% pathetic. You were wrong. Say it. I've proven it about 50 times over 3 days. Say it, nerd.

October 2002 and October 2003 are not the same rankings as June/July/August 2003 you fucking idiot... I mean Jesus christ, man. Is it really that hard to comprehend?

 

[Fioretti]

@Mamou

It's been proven, many times. If you need help reading, you're free to phone a friend, mama.

History of odds and rankings 2001-2004

Gary was ***NEVER**** ranked top 10. THAT MEANS HE WASN'T BEFORE HE FOUGHT FEDOR.

You are completely and 100% pathetic. You were wrong. Say it. I've proven it about 50 times over 3 days. Say it, nerd.

 

[Mamou]

@Mamou

It's been proven, many times. If you need help reading, you're free to phone a friend, mama.

History of odds and rankings 2001-2004

Gary was ***NEVER**** ranked top 10. THAT MEANS HE WASN'T BEFORE HE FOUGHT FEDOR.

You are completely and 100% pathetic. You were wrong. Say it. I've proven it about 50 times over 3 days. Say it, nerd.

It's been proven that the "mid 2003" rankings were October 2003 rankings... lmao at thinking you've proven anything other than your stupidity

 

[Fioretti]

@Mama

It's been proven, many times. If you need help reading, you're free to phone a friend, mama.

History of odds and rankings 2001-2004

Gary was ***NEVER**** ranked top 10. THAT MEANS HE WASN'T BEFORE HE FOUGHT FEDOR.

You are completely and 100% pathetic. You were wrong. Say it. I've proven it about 50 times over 3 days. Say it, nerd.

 

[JKS]

The NC isn't a win, but it is technically a fight, yes. Hunt and Randleman are very iffy top 10's, moreso Hunt, and Coleman was not top 10 the second time. Gary was never top 10, and it has been proven multiple times in this thread.

Compare the consistency of his level of competition to Jones, Werdum, Hendo, or JDS. Or any long standing UFC champion. These guys all have streaks of 10+ top 10 opponents. That's the point. They don't have win streaks of 27+, sure. Because they consistently fight better competition and one is more likely to lose when that happens. Such as Fedor going 3-3 when he finally fought 6 in a row, some of which were barely top 10, and one of which was ranked in a lower weightclass.

The rankings weren't Sherdog, they were MMAWeekly archives, which was the #1 in accuracy and most accepted source of rankings at the time.

Every fighter and great champion has lower level top 10s on their resume. Its just part of the fight game, some top 10 guys are a lower level, but still top 10. I never said, Coleman was ranked the second time, I was pretty clear when I said the second time it was whatever, come on, try and keep up. It hasn't been proven on here, from what I see you just posted rankings without Gary. But there are other rankings that had him. You just gotta leave that alone.

Werdum had inconsistent competition, the only time he fought a string of higher ranked opponents was on his title run. Hendo in Pride same thing, look at Hendos resume it has opponents like Shoji, Oyama, Gracie, Kondo, Gono etc. Both those guys you mentioned had similar competition to Fedor, they just lost cause they weren't as good as him. Fedor having a few cans and lower ranked opponents make his streak look better, yes, but it's still very impressive what he did in his streak outside of those fights. Cans and lower ranked fighter or not, every time a fighter steps in to fight he can lose. So those fights are just bonuses to an already impressive run of performances vs many good fighters.

So yes, you are correct that those names makes his run look better than it actually is. And if you replace say 6 guys with higher level opponents, sure it increases the chances of a loss. But take those names out, and it's still pretty dam impressive just considering the good comp he fought and the opponents early on.

 

[Fioretti]

Every fighter and great champion has lower level top 10s on their resume. Its just part of the fight game, some top 10 guys are a lower level, but still top 10. I never said, Coleman was ranked the second time, I was pretty clear when I said the second time it was whatever, come on, try and keep up. It hasn't been proven on here, from what I see you just posted rankings without Gary. But there are other rankings that had him. You just gotta leave that alone.

Werdum had inconsistent competition, the only time he fought a string of higher ranked opponents was on his title run. Hendo in Pride same thing, look at Hendos resume it has opponents like Shoji, Oyama, Gracie, Kondo, Gono etc. Both those guys you mentioned had similar competition to Fedor, they just lost cause they weren't as good as him. Fedor having a few cans and lower ranked opponents make his streak look better, yes, but it's still very impressive what he did in his streak outside of those fights. Cans and lower ranked fighter or not, every time a fighter steps in to fight he can lose. So those fights are just bonuses to an already impressive run of performances vs many good fighters.

So yes, you are correct that those names makes his run look better than it actually is. And if you replace say 6 guys with higher level opponents, sure it increases the chances of a loss. But take those names out, and it's still pretty dam impressive just considering the good comp he fought and the opponents early on.

The only place you'll find Gary Goodridge as a top 10 ranked fighter is on Fight Matrix, and only because Fight Matrix is flawed and inaccurate. It tells you in their disclaimer that their historical rankings won't match previously published rankings because it was before the site's inception. He was not ranked. I showed all of the relevant archived rankings. He was inactive between August 28th 2002 and August 10th 2003. Are you suggesting he got into the top 10 6-7 months (or more) after a win over 0-0 Lloyd van Dams while being inactive? Seriously? Not a single one of you advocating for Gary Goodridge being top 10 in 2003 have answered this question directly, and for good reason. He was never a top 10 HW in his life, let alone when he fought Fedor with a 17-13-1 record after a year lay-off. Be real, man.

All of those guys I listed have streaks in their careers where they faced 10+ top 10's in a row. JDS and Hendo have arguably the two hardest schedules in MMA history. It's normal for a few unranked or lower ranked fighters here and there. This has been established. It is not normal for the #1 ranked fighter in the world (in any division) to fight more unranked and freakshow fights than ranked fighters. I don't understand why you guys push this shit so hard and pretend so hard, yet are quick to downplay Stipe's resume calling his top 10 wins "old", "washed", etc..etc..

It's fucking crazy.

 

[Greyscale]

Exaggerating much?
Have you trained a day om your life, competed?

Show me someone who went over 30-0, like Fedor did.

And looks like you don't know how Pride worked.
They liked to put Japanese fighters to test and when you are champ, you had
to fight all they make you. Top contenders and freak shows sometimes, cause that brought japanese audience.

My training and competition have nothing to do with it.

Fedor never went 30-0. You may say he didn't lose to Kohsaka (though he chose to compete under these crazy rules and it's his problem), I can say he didn't win the Arona fight.

I know exactly how pride worked. Fixed fights, no drug testing, freak fights. That's why Fedor and '#2' Mirko Cro Cop liked beating up MWs and non-fighters that much. They sure looked strong as hell destroying Nagatas, Zulus, Kaneharas and Dos Carases of the world and could've gone 10000-0 doing it. When they moved to the US, they were predictably exposed though.

 

[Deleted member 498977]

My training and competition have nothing to do with it.

Fedor never went 30-0. You may say he didn't lose to Kohsaka (though he chose to compete under these crazy rules and it's his problem), I can say he didn't win the Arona fight.

I know exactly how pride worked. Fixed fights, no drug testing, freak fights. That's why Fedor and '#2' Mirko Cro Cop liked beating up MWs and non-fighters that much. They sure looked strong as hell destroying Nagatas, Zulus, Kaneharas and Dos Carases of the world and could've gone 10000-0 doing it. When they moved to the US, they were predictably exposed though.

If you trained and competed properly you would know what kind of toll it takes on your body.
Fedor hot a "loss" from illegal elbow, because someone had to move forward in tournament and Fedor was cut from illegal elbow and Kosaka was shown favouritism.
Fedor cleared everything in rematch.

When Fedor returned to US, he beat top UFC HW champs and in Timmy and Arlovski, who were best at that time.
Also, Pride had former UFC champs - Coleman, Randleman, primed juiced to the gills.
Ogawa - olympian, Hunt - K-1 champ, he also beat Mirko and Nog.
Pride was superior to UFC at that time, looks like you don't know MMA history.

P.S. Arona fight was not full MMA rules - no GnP, which is Fedor's forte.

 

[Deleted member 498977]

My training and competition have nothing to do with it.

Fedor never went 30-0. You may say he didn't lose to Kohsaka (though he chose to compete under these crazy rules and it's his problem), I can say he didn't win the Arona fight.

I know exactly how pride worked. Fixed fights, no drug testing, freak fights. That's why Fedor and '#2' Mirko Cro Cop liked beating up MWs and non-fighters that much. They sure looked strong as hell destroying Nagatas, Zulus, Kaneharas and Dos Carases of the world and could've gone 10000-0 doing it. When they moved to the US, they were predictably exposed though.

It was 12 that is correct, I didn't count Big Nog 2 as it was a NC but that is a fight on his record and a top 10 win. But you are incorrect, it's actually 8 top 10 wins. Fujita, Randleman, Coleman, Hunt, Big Nog 2x, Cro Cop and your boy Gary. So 8 of 12 is still very good, considering TK was a revenge match that Fedor took for a Bushido main event and a tune up for the Cro Cop fight and Zulu for a freak fight. Ogawa was a GP, you can't blame him for how the brackets work. Coleman 2 was just whatever.

The first time he fought 4 in a row was 11 years into his career. We both know if Fedor from 2005 fought those guys he would have creamed em. I don't think Fedor was shot but he was not the same fighter.

Yes, the streak was easier to achieve with some lower comp. But the point is that this happens to every fighter. There is no standard of having nothing but top ranked wins over a period of 20+ fights. No one has had that kind of resume, not Fedor, not Big Nog, not Khabib or Jones. In mma, we rationalize and grade everything by comparison to others and that is the standard. So even if Fedor had the lesser names on his record, it's still incredibly impressive and probably the best winning streak in the sports history.

And that's just sherdog rankings. There were many other rankings systems.

 

[Greyscale]

If you trained and competed properly you would know what kind of toll it takes on your body.
Fedor hot a "loss" from illegal elbow, because someone had to move forward in tournament and Fedor was cut from illegal elbow and Kosaka was shown favouritism.
Fedor cleared everything in rematch.

Should those fights be excluded from his official MMA record then? It's not me who placed them there, you know. Kohsaka was shown favoritism in Fedor fight, Fedor was shown favoritism in Arona fight. Now what?

As to training, Fedor stopped training seriously around 2007 to pursue movies and other opportunities. Admitted it himself. And it was perfectly evident in his subsequent fights.

I love how training took such a heavy toll on Fedor's body before he was 33 years old. But when someone brings up Cormier, people say no, look how late his MMA career started. Apparently training for high-level wrestling for a couple decades is easy and completely injury-free.

When Fedor returned to US, he beat top UFC HW champs and in Timmy and Arlovski, who were best at that time.

First, they were NO ufc champs, let's make it clear. They WERE ufc HW champs for a short period of time some 2 years prior to facing Fedor. Big Difference. Second, of course, they actually were nowhere near the top, despite what rankings were saying. Arlovski lost next 3 bouts, Sylvia went on to face Ray Mercer. Their career trajectory is pretty obvious and neither of them ever became relevant again.

Also, Pride had former UFC champs - Coleman, Randleman, primed juiced to the gills.

Yeah, 4-7 years removed from their championships. Also, Coleman was 40 at the time of their first fight.

Ogawa - olympian, Hunt - K-1 champ, he also beat Mirko and Nog.

He should've faced a chess master and a nobel prize laureate as well, imo.

Pride was superior to UFC at that time, looks like you don't know MMA history.

Lol. I wonder why pride never bought out ufc then.

P.S. Arona fight was not full MMA rules - no GnP, which is Fedor's forte.

Again, it's not like I forced him to compete under these rules.

 

[Deleted member 498977]

Should those fights be excluded from his official MMA record then? It's not me who placed them there, you know. Kohsaka was shown favoritism in Fedor fight, Fedor was shown favoritism in Arona fight. Now what?

As to training, Fedor stopped training seriously around 2007 to pursue movies and other opportunities. Admitted it himself. And it was perfectly evident in his subsequent fights.

I love how training took such a heavy toll on Fedor's body before he was 33 years old. But when someone brings up Cormier, people say no, look how late his MMA career started. Apparently training for high-level wrestling for a couple decades is easy and completely injury-free.



First, they were NO ufc champs, let's make it clear. They WERE ufc HW champs for a short period of time some 2 years prior to facing Fedor. Big Difference. Second, of course, they actually were nowhere near the top, despite what rankings were saying. Arlovski lost next 3 bouts, Sylvia went on to face Ray Mercer. Their career trajectory is pretty obvious and neither of them ever became relevant again.



Yeah, 4-7 years removed from their championships. Also, Coleman was 40 at the time of their first fight.



He should've faced a chess master and a nobel prize laureate as well, imo.



Lol. I wonder why pride never bought out ufc then.



Again, it's not like I forced him to compete under these rules.

DC's wrestling is not fighting . Fedor also competed in sambo and combat sambo.
Fedor had 34 fights by 33, DC had 10. It's MMA camps , sparring and damage that take a toll on your body. Looks like you have trained very little in your life and don't get it.

Still Tim and Arlovski were top HW, Dana talked would whoop Fedor.
Fedor whooped them both inside a round and broke them.

Being better fight org didn't mean they had a better business model.
Dana and Feritta's mafia money did it's job.

Fedor did compete without Gnp and fought to majority draw with a prime Arona, who was beating HW at ADCC tournaments which is a great feat.
Add GnP and Arona would be a bloody mess.
There would always be controversy in decisions - Khabib arguably lost to Tibau, GSP to Hendriks, etc.

 

[PIИKBLIИK]

Maybe he was dominant because he trained so hard ..... training / sparring adds to mileage as well .... you know that right ?

That could be true. Training was also much poorer back in those days and the techniques and sport science within MMA in the early to mid 00's was truly dreadful. Even Wanderlei has spoke in the past on how bad the training was on their bodies and how they though going hard was the right thing to do but realized later it was a mistake and was actually hurting their bodies.

But at the same time things still don't add up. Such as briefly prior to the Werdum fight few people were actually questioning Fedor's place as the one top HW on the planet, something media outlets would also parrot.

 

[Fioretti]

DC's wrestling is not fighting . Fedor also competed in sambo and combat sambo.
Fedor had 34 fights by 33, DC had 10. It's MMA camps , sparring and damage that take a toll on your body. Looks like you have trained very little in your life and don't get it.

Still Tim and Arlovski were top HW, Dana talked would whoop Fedor.
Fedor whooped them both inside a round and broke them.

Being better fight org didn't mean they had a better business model.
Dana and Feritta's mafia money did it's job.

Fedor did compete without Gnp and fought to majority draw with a prime Arona, who was beating HW at ADCC tournaments which is a great feat.
Add GnP and Arona would be a bloody mess.
There would always be controversy in decisions - Khabib arguably lost to Tibau, GSP to Hendriks, etc.

If you took out the 18 unranked fighters on his resume at that point (in which he took zero damage when fighting), then he would have only had 15 or so fights. I mean, how much damage does the #1 HW in the world, and most dominant fighter of that time, take in 1-3 minutes of fighting these guys with little to no experience? Oh, yeah....the training? Wrestling training is nothing, but sambo and combat sambo are excruciatingly harsh on the body, right? Only Fedor suffers this intense, prime-eliminating, training by the age of 33. Everyone else is immune to it.

Tim and Arlovski were both a few years past being champs and had both been out of the UFC at that point. They weren't at the top of their game. Tim went on to KO'd by Mercer in a few seconds in his next fight, then trickled off into Bolivian. Andrei went on a hefty losing streak and eventually bounced back a little, but would go on to alternate small win streaks and losing streaks. Both were ranked a little higher than they should've been when they fought Fedor, and both were off the top 10 very soon after.

Arona was 2-0 in MMA when Fedor faced him. Rings wasn't full-on MMA.

 

[Deleted member 498977]

If you took out the 18 unranked fighters on his resume at that point (in which he took zero damage when fighting), then he would have only had 15 or so fights. I mean, how much damage does the #1 HW in the world, and most dominant fighter of that time, take in 1-3 minutes of fighting these guys with little to no experience? Oh, yeah....the training? Wrestling training is nothing, but sambo and combat sambo are excruciatingly harsh on the body, right? Only Fedor suffers this intense, prime-eliminating, training by the age of 33. Everyone else is immune to it.

Tim and Arlovski were both a few years past being champs and had both been out of the UFC at that point. They weren't at the top of their game. Tim went on to KO'd by Mercer in a few seconds in his next fight, then trickled off into Bolivian. Andrei went on a hefty losing streak and eventually bounced back a little, but would go on to alternate small win streaks and losing streaks. Both were ranked a little higher than they should've been when they fought Fedor, and both were off the top 10 very soon after.

Arona was 2-0 in MMA when Fedor faced him. Rings wasn't full-on MMA.

Where did i say that everybidy is immune from wear and tear from fight camps, grappling and amateur mma tournaments?
Please show me another fighter who had 30 fights and still was in his prime and with no serious injuries after that.

@gono btw , whoop dat ass!