Media Fedor vs Cro Cop battle of the reflexes

[Superzorro]

This move to me was absolutely incredible

Not only did Fedor defend against Cro Cop's signature move, but he countered it in one motion and attacked with his own leg kick that looked to really buckle Cro Cop's knee

If I remember correctly Fedor took this fight very seriously as Cro Cop had just KO'd Alex. He spent a lot of time in the Netherlands training with the top kickboxers like Hoost to prepare for Cro Cop, and it certainly paid off

A lot of what made Cro Cop dangerous was anticipation of the high kick. Fedor had success because he let him know early on that he was not afraid of it by throwing at the same time. If you’re throwing with an opponent who is equally as fast and powerful a lot of the time it will come down to having a better chin. Fedor was more confident in exchanging. But it’s still a dangerous game— amazing that he never got caught.
This was such a cerebral fight.

 

[TheBulge]

Exactly. I've been saying those things for many years.

Fyodor Emelianenko (in his best condition) would be an elite assassin and top contender in the 2025 version of the UFC Heavyweight Division.

Mirko Filipović (in his best condition) would be an elite assassin and top contender in the 2025 version of the UFC Heavyweight Division. Those brutal years in Pride FC took a lot out of him before he had his MMA fight against Sanchez.

Liddell (in his best condition) would be an elite assassin and top contender in the 2025 version of the UFC Light Heavyweight Division.

Isn't it convenient how these guys were all past their primes at the exact moment they fought in a cage in the US with drug testing? Cro Cop keell evrybady, then boom he's past his prime in the cage against Sanches. Fedor the best defensive performance and spectacular KO of his career against Arlovski, then boom past his prime in the cage against a car mechanic. Nog too.

It's so unfortunate how the universe worked against all 3 men like this, the biggest coincidence ever that it all lined up the exact nano second they entered the US cage they were washed and none of those losses count so that we can protect their legacies.

 

[TheBulge]

Did you just imply that I don't know what a Scramble is?

I've trained, competed and taught for 18 years longer than you've been on this site.

There was a very slick armbar literally last night.

And yes, of course Derrick Lewis is more skilled than let's say Sergei Kharitinov another top 10 fighter.

Sure.

I believe you.

Which is why I also believe that if you were honest with yourself, you would tell me that Cro Cop off his back in the early to mid 00s was a very primitive skillset that shouldn't be bragged about.

 

[Superzorro]

Literally the only threat on that list is Aspinal and I think prime Cro Cop and Fedor both have a chance at beating him.

A chance? If that fight were to happen and Aspinall’s somehow the favorite, I’d put an entire paycheck on Fedor submitting him. Maybe not Cro Cop because there might be a chance he gets exploited on the ground.

 

[Nathan LaMontagne]

I believe you.

Which is why I also believe that if you were honest with yourself, you would tell me that Cro Cop off his back in the early to mid 00s was a very primitive skillset that shouldn't be bragged about.

I'm specifically talking about his Sprawl.
He was decent at stopping takedowns from the clinch

Yeah he wasn't great off his back minus his double foot on hip escape he used.


Pride had the yellow card system so it made more sense to avoid the ground in the first place and stall out

Long story short, he was an elite striker with better TDD than he should have. Not great on the ground by any means bbut he survived with defense. But he wasn't getting tapped by anyone but elite grapplers.

But is he really that much worse anywhere than even top 10 HWs.

Also you need to factor in his competition.

I wouldn't be nearly as worried of getting submitted by a Derrick Lewis or even a blaydes (emphasis on submission) than a Nogueria or Fedor.

 

[TheBulge]

I'm specifically talking about his Sprawl.
He was decent at stopping takedowns from the clinch

Yeah he wasn't great off his back minus his double foot on hip escape he used.


Pride had the yellow card system so it made more sense to avoid the ground in the first place and stall out

Long story short, he was an elite striker with better TDD than he should have. Not great on the ground by any means bbut he survived with defense. But he wasn't getting tapped by anyone but elite grapplers.

But is he really that much worse anywhere than even top 10 HWs.

Also you need to factor in his competition.

I wouldn't be nearly as worried of getting submitted by a Derrick Lewis or even a blaydes (emphasis on submission) than a Nogueria or Fedor.

Doesn't your logic at the end of your post indicate that his ground defence should have been better than it was for that era?

HE may get away with it against many hw now, but he would have serious issues if he has someone on top of him like DC, Werdum, Cain, Stipe, Bigfoot, Ubereem, Jon Jones.

In hindsight its not that impressive that he stuffed old Coleman, Bjj Nog who still got him, Aleks, Hunt, and he beat Barnett and Fujita but they did put him on his back.

Gonzaga ruined him on the ground. No yakuza ref to bail him out. Elbows in the face instead.l

 

[Ludwig von Mises]

Isn't it convenient how these guys were all past their primes at the exact moment they fought in a cage in the US with drug testing? Cro Cop keell evrybady, then boom he's past his prime in the cage against Sanches. Fedor the best defensive performance and spectacular KO of his career against Arlovski, then boom past his prime in the cage against a car mechanic. Nog too.

It's so unfortunate how the universe worked against all 3 men like this, the biggest coincidence ever that it all lined up the exact nano second they entered the US cage they were washed and none of those losses count so that we can protect their legacies.

What the hell are you going on about? Cro Cop had close to 100 fights between amateur boxing, kick boxing at the highest level in 90s K-1 and MMA at the highest level, fighting in front of 60,000 people with multiple KO losses and surgeries. He was still good when he landed in the UFC but it was clear he was past his prime and on the third leg of his professional career.

Fedor had 30 fights by the time he lost. 23 of those fights were in the first 4 years of his career with dozens of full contact fights in combat sambo during those 4 years where he fought guys like Oleinik in full contact bare knuckle sambo fights. Fedor was in wars and getting slammed on his neck in 2004-2005 but shertards pretend he was still peaking in 2011.

Fedors fight against Arlovski wasnt his "most masterful defensive" performance ever lol. His coaches said it was horrible and that he was clearly slowing down. Half of that training camp Fedor was in Thailand shooting some shitty, straight to DVD film.

The exact words of Fedors coaches were that he pulled that win out of his ass using "old tricks" This was even more obvious in his next fight where he struggled on the ground with Brett Rogers where he lost top position and got GnPd and got his nose bloodied. It's not surprising that he finally lost in his next fight. This isn't a peaking fighter.

Nobody watching those two fights sat there thinking, "Damn this is the best Fedor has ever looked." It was clear that although he was still good, he was 4-5 years removed from his peak form when he was fighting for and defending his HW title in Pride.

Shertards (clowns like you) never trained a day in their life and don't understand how a fighter who started fighting in his early 20s, who had the biggest fights of their life in their mid 20s was no longer in his physical and emotional peak form by the time he was in his 30s. The same clowns making these idiotic posts think Jose Aldo was on his prime at 33. Smh.

Low level posters with zero real life experience.

 

[TR1]

Isn't it convenient how these guys were all past their primes at the exact moment they fought in a cage in the US with drug testing? Cro Cop keell evrybady, then boom he's past his prime in the cage against Sanches. Fedor the best defensive performance and spectacular KO of his career against Arlovski, then boom past his prime in the cage against a car mechanic. Nog too.

It's so unfortunate how the universe worked against all 3 men like this, the biggest coincidence ever that it all lined up the exact nano second they entered the US cage they were washed and none of those losses count so that we can protect their legacies.

You mean like Anderson started failing the first random test he ever took, and never won a fight again?

Such a coincidence as well.

 

[HHJ]

Gonzaga ruined him on the ground.

 

[DiazSlap]

Man these guys were fast. Mirkos left cross is easily one of the fastest punches in the history of the sport. This is the punch he broke Bob Sapps orbital bone with. It wasn't an easy punch to avoid getting hit by because it was short and snappy. It looks stupid fast even on the slow motion replay.

Fedor did a great job of making reads and ducked out of the way beautifully. Incredible reaction time and reflexes from the GOAT Fedor. He even paried some of these shots and countered with shots of his own. Truly insane speed.

Mirko recognized that Fedor was ducking to the side and tried to adjust by throwing a hook but Fedor made a read on that too and ducked under the the left hook and countered with his own punch. To Mirko's credit he also ducked out of the way of some bombs from Fedor.

This is the pinnacle of HW fighting. Two guys meeting eachother in their prime. Incredible speed and incredible reaction time. Both guys had the reflexes of a cat. No Jon Jones style ducking and cowardice.

Study this video anon and then study it some more.

Tom Asspinfail KO’s both in their primes in the 1st Round ~ Sherdog

 

[DrawK]

Nah, Cro Cop was actually able to do high kicks that come from above downwards and hit opponent on dome of the head coming from above, above his block, a rare and difficult technique since most of other kickers do high kicks that come from down upwards. There is a video somewhere of Mirko doing kicking training on a heavy bag and all kicks landing from above downwards in unusual trajectory. Had Mirko not slipped, it would have landed on the dome of Fedor's head like on Dos Caras or Wanderlei.

Cro Cop had a bad luck that day, 2-3 slips on the same spot, probably the canvas was wet from the sweat of other fighters rolling on the ground, since it was a co main event with 5-6 fights that happened before. Those slips one after another costed him both the high kick which could have KOd Fedor, and the takedown that allowed Fedor to lay on him for next 5 minutes. Fedor did not take Cro Cop down, Mirko slipped again like on the ice on approximatley the same spot.

I haven't thought about this right in a while and that's an interesting take.

As for my 2 cents on them vs modern HWs I could see either one strike with any modern HW. Fedor's takedown offense and Cro Cop's takedown defense I also believe would stand. The big issue here is the scrambling, leg rides and guard passing. If Tybura got them down it would be big trouble.

 

[ComfortablyNumb55]

It'd be a shame if someone like my balls is hot knocked them out.

 

[JBJ was here]

Greatest fight in MMA history, prove me wrong.

Most of the fight was on the ground and really, really, bad. Some great standup and a lot of sloppy, fun standup makes it a fight well worth watching, but the groundwork was all Cro Cop fending off g&p without trying to get up and Fedor trying the same thing over and over that Fedor was successfully fending off. It's a very overrated fight.

 

[Ludwig von Mises]

Most of the fight was on the ground and really, really, bad. Some great standup and a lot of sloppy, fun standup makes it a fight well worth watching, but the groundwork was all Cro Cop fending off g&p without trying to get up and Fedor trying the same thing over and over that Fedor was successfully fending off. It's a very overrated fight.

What a chump

 

[Ludwig von Mises]

It'd be a shame if someone like my balls is hot knocked them out.

Peak Mirko would have exploded Balls is hot's liver

Fedor would ragdoll him to the mat and GnP him like he stole something in the south in the 1960s.

 

[joy2day]

I'm specifically talking about his Sprawl.
He was decent at stopping takedowns from the clinch

Yeah he wasn't great off his back minus his double foot on hip escape he used.


Pride had the yellow card system so it made more sense to avoid the ground in the first place and stall out

Long story short, he was an elite striker with better TDD than he should have. Not great on the ground by any means bbut he survived with defense. But he wasn't getting tapped by anyone but elite grapplers.

But is he really that much worse anywhere than even top 10 HWs.

Also you need to factor in his competition.

I wouldn't be nearly as worried of getting submitted by a Derrick Lewis or even a blaydes (emphasis on submission) than a Nogueria or Fedor.

Yeah see I was actually really impressed by CC's guard in the fight. Fedor has a REALLY hard time landing anything on the ground after wrecking others with GnP, perhaps the best GnP ever if you watch the Herring fight or the first Nog fight.

Fedor keeps trying to stand up and land punches because he can't get anything in while laying on top of CC in his guard but still has little success. A good portion of the fight was actually spent with Fedor struggling to land anything from the top; that was the real story, not the standup (other than the fact Fedor got the TDs from standing).

In the standup, Fedor pressured him by constantly moving forward, which really prevented CC from being able to get anything off before getting taken down; moving backward really fouled up CC's striking game.

I get that CC wasn't a master of the guard in the sense that he was going to catch someone in a triangle or get a slick reversal, but he uses his strong legs for some of the best defense I have ever seen from the guard in that fight.

 

[Ludwig von Mises]

Yeah see I was actually really impressed by CC's guard in the fight. Fedor has a REALLY hard time landing anything on the ground after wrecking others with GnP, perhaps the best GnP ever if you watch the Herring fight or the first Nog fight.

Fedor keeps trying to stand up and land punches because he can't get anything in while laying on top of CC in his guard but still has little success. A good portion of the fight was actually spent with Fedor struggling to land anything from the top; that was the real story, not the standup (other than the fact Fedor got the TDs from standing).

In the standup, Fedor pressured him by constantly moving forward, which really prevented CC from being able to get anything off before getting taken down; moving backward really fouled up CC's striking game.

I get that CC wasn't a master of the guard in the sense that he was going to catch someone in a triangle or get a slick reversal, but he uses his strong legs for some of the best defense I have ever seen from the guard in that fight.

Werdum was Cop's BJJ coach at the time and really did a good job of teaching him how to use a defensive stall guard. Mirko had strong legs and once he tied up with you it was very hard to posture up on him. Fedor did better in Nogs guard than he did in Mirkos because Nog was offensive and guys who are offensive leave more openings to posture up.