Fedor strengths and weaknesses and his skillset in the UFC today (Long Thread)

[Sweater of AV]

Funny, I just bumped the thread not too long ago. It was on the first page. Here is a good summary of your childish attempts in that thread:

You're too dense to understand that you're not showing science, you're showing peak performance charts in selected events. That's basically the same exact thing that I'm showing with my "Champions By Age" threads. They are essentially MMA performance charts by age, as they are showing the elite athlete's age in each division when reaching the pinnacle. You're also failing to understand that when you questioned me about the physiological science of a man's prime being between the ages of 27-35, that I proved that with multiple scientific studies of muscle/bone growth and deterioration.

I purposely underlined that part that you think agrees with what you're saying, but you're not comprehending how it applies. Peak performance does not equate to physical prime. You keep wanting them to mean the same thing, they don't. You keep wanting to show shit about swimming and gymnastics, yet adolescents tend to be the top competitors. Are you claiming that adolescent gymnasts and swimmers are in their physical prime? Do you know how naive and ridiculous that sounds? A decline in peak performance does not equate to a decline in physicality. "Out of prime" is when your body starts to physically decline, not when individuals aren't at their personal best. A selective loss or degeneration of type II fibers is a physical decline. So is hypoplasia and loss of nerve terminals. That's the scientific part you wanted so badly before. A progressive decrease in the calcium content and a deterioration in the organic matrix of the bones is the scientific explanation of a physical decline. Sprinters slowing down as they gain and retain mass doesn't help your argument as you think it does, it helps mine.

You have shown nothing scientific, and you're grasping onto an athletic performance review as if it is scientifically explaining how humans physiologically progress and decline. It doesn't. You're doing that while simultaneously trying to discredit and discard my documentation of an MMA performance review. That article and your words do not mean what you think they mean, and your inability to conceptualize the difference between physiological development and event-based performance reviews is not helping your case. You don't even want to try to understand or accept the difference, you just want to be right. Yes, you are correct in some things you are saying, but overall you're not understanding. I'll repeat, again, the most basic and easiest way to understand this: individual peak performance does not equate to physiological prime. Being more flexible and having less muscle mass/density does not mean you are in your physical prime. It is beneficial to some select athletic events, and detrimental to others. Humans do not physically decline before or at the age of 30. Males will start to decline in their late 30's. This is when muscles and bones typically start to deteriorate. There are exceptions, but 27-35 is the general rule of thumb. Some claim 25-35 since muscle strength begins to peak at 25, but muscle density and cognitive ability are not quite there yet in most. 20-35 seems to be a broader category that also covers all of the events you want it to, but age 35 is still considered "young adulthood". Do you know why? I noticed you skipped a lot of the questions I've been asking over the last few posts. Why is that? Maybe try to discuss something rather than post the same recently googled article repeatedly. I saw that shit too, quite a while ago, but I was able to distinguish the difference between a performance review and physiological science. I'm trying to help you understand it too.

This was the post I made that made you panic patty cake childish bullshit. I'm sure you'll do it again now. Good luck, slick.

Yup still can’t answer the questions. Hey kiddo, as has been pointed out to you by everyone, you don’t understand that the concept of absolute physical prime doesn’t exist. You can write whatever essay you like but creating the concept and trying to apply it is the source of your hilarious confusion.

You were given multiple scientific studies that show various physical traits peak at very early ages. It’s not that hard to understand. The only issue is you actually treating physical prime as an absolute.

When everyone is making fun of you and telling that you’re an idiot then you should take a step back and listen. Or not, it’s up to you. However I’m not wasting a week trying to explain basics to you.

Enjoy your day in grade 6.

 

[fzoid4454]

That's a pretty comprehensive breakdown.

Naysayers will be naysayers, and it's pretty impossible to compare fighters from different eras (or athletes from different eras in any sport - if Brady tried playing in the 70s the game he plays today, his WRs would all be dead, for example), but that's a pretty compelling case.

 

[fzoid4454]

If you're going to discuss Fedor's weaknesses, you have to mention his tendency to cheat by grabbing the ropes. A good example of this is his fight with Lindland.

The referee was repeatedly shouting at Fedor to "let go the ropes" and even had to resort to trying to physically remove Fedor's hand and arm from holding onto the ropes.

It was no surprise that when Fedor had to fight in a cage instead of a roped ring, he struggled.

Right..... because, as we see by no one ever grabbing the cage, such tactics are impossible to translate over.

 

[Fioretti]

Yup still can’t answer the questions. Hey kiddo, as has been pointed out to you by everyone, you don’t understand that the concept of absolute physical prime doesn’t exist. You can write whatever essay you like but creating the concept and trying to apply it is the source of your hilarious confusion.

You were given multiple scientific studies that show various physical traits peak at very early ages. It’s not that hard to understand. The only issue is you actually treating physical prime as an absolute.

When everyone is making fun of you and telling that you’re an idiot then you should take a step back and listen. Or not, it’s up to you. However I’m not wasting a week trying to explain basics to you.

Enjoy your day in grade 6.

There she is. Back to patty cake. So weird that MMA peak performance aligns with physiological prime, isn't it? It doesn't matter what any of you fanatics say, or how frequently you try to deny science, it's still facts.

Bones and muscles don't start deteriorating until late 30s. These are the things that take a man out of his prime. Fedro wasn't out of his prime at 33. Get over it. Try something new. Adolescent gymnasts and swimmers aren't in their physiological prime in their teens or early twenties. Try harder, sweetie.

 

[BFoe]

Awesome


Again...



Fedor gave up the most basic single-leg/slide by to a 40 year old MW immediately before getting ko'd.

and

Got Mounted and besmirched by Bigfoot.

and

Thrown onto his head by Randleman.

and


Used ropes to avoid being taken down by MW Lindland.

and

Easily taken down and gave up back to Coleman.

Khabib-esque.

—Mark Coleman was a juiced-to-the-gills, Olympic level wrestler FFS. Fedor literally outgrappled him, and submitted him, twice. In the 2nd fight, Fedor defended 10 of 12 TD attempts.
—Randleman was a juiced-to-the-gills, 2x NCAA Div 1 champ and 3x Big 10 champ. You understand that people with good wrestling credentials can get TDs, right? Like Abel Trujillo and Gleison Tibau? Fedor swept Randleman from side control and subbed him.

—Yeah, Lindland really gave Fedor hell, bud.

Your “40 year old MW” is another TRT-juiced Olympic level wrestler. Bigfoot was a BJJ black belt with a 50 lb weight advantage. I’d love to compare that to Khabib’s MMA career, but not only has he never had to deal with that but he retired and walked away from the sport before he ever got to be 34 years of age like Fedor was in those fights.

With Sherdog end of year awards coming up, there’s got to be some Most Dogshit Takes award I can nominate you for. Truly, I can’t think of another poster who is so consistently bad. I often question whether or not you’ve actually watched this sport.

 

[Pankration never dies]

Honestly, there seems to be some nostalgic bias in here.

Don’t get me wrong, the Last Emperor is a legend and one of the very best GOAT candidates, eternal respect for what he accomplished and for many of his top abilities, but historical prime Fedor would certainly not easily “crush everybody” today the way he did in the 2000s, for two main reasons.

1 – The technical level is better

We often read that heavyweights now are less technical or more one-dimensional than in the 2000s Pride era or the 2010s UFC : this is globally pure bullshit. Actually, one of the reasons Fedor could shine so much was because he fought in a technically super-uneven division.


How many of his basic armbars do you think Fedor could pull off nowadays ? Probably not so much considering almost nobody falls for armbars now as they are super-known and drilled, while for some Pride fighters they were apparently very esoteric and startling feats.

Clearly, one of the reasons (not the only one) why Fedor was so good in Pride was because he was one of the most (probably the most) complete fighters of all. With his sambo, he had a polyvalent skillset and a great understanding of all aspects of MMA, enhancing his other abilities (aggression, speed, etc.).

In short, Fedor appeared even more as a demi-god because he faced many guys, particularly big ones, who were in the “MMA technical stone-age”, and while it was normal for the time, it would be very different today, aggravating the size factor.


One of the peak MMA athletes of the glorious year 2005 that Fedor had to face, before elite HW MMA dramatically declined.

2 – Everyone is bigger

“Heavyweight” can mean a lot of things, and the standard has totally inflated from Pride to 2022. If we speak in today’s terms, the functional and complete “HW” of the prime Fedor era were mostly blown-up MW and LHW (HW Cro Cop and LHW rehydrated Prochazka are roughly the same size, minus some fat).

There were big guys in Pride sure but, with some exceptions, they were not complete MMA fighters, either unathletic freaks (Zulu, etc.) or pure kickboxers with minimal grappling (Hong-Man Choi and some others were 100x more unidimensional than the Ganes and N’Gannous some like to deconsider).

Today HW are way bigger and often more athletic than the average functional “HW” Pride fighter (N’Gannou and many others cutting weight to fight jacked at 265 lbs) and the difference it makes in striking and grappling is enormous.

First, the one punch KO power they display is nothing to laugh at, particularly when you see how Fedor was sometimes put on skates in his prime or KOed by Henderson in 2011 when he was far from being a greybeard (good luck boxing aggressively against 265+ lbs, 83 inches-reach counter-puncher N’Gannou and his underrated precision).



Cro Cop had KO power with his high-kicks sure, but now many HWs can do equal or more damage just with their fists, which tells of the power evolution and also explains why wrestling reigns less supreme than in other divisions, as it is much more risky to implement.

Talking about the wrestling/grappling, Fedor’s throws worked against guys who had no clinch game (today cage fighters work it a lot, and I highly doubt Fedor could toss Stipe, MT Gane or N'Gannou), were his size or less, but against big guys with a bit of technique, his abilities were often nullified, which is totally normal and why we have weight divisions in the first place.


By the way, if we apply to the Silva fight the same logic many apply to Gane/N’Gannou, we should conclude that Fedor has complete shit grappling for getting stuck in mount.

And what if…

Fedor was in his prime today and adapting his game to another era ? That's a good question, even if there are many reasons to think that size would remain a big problem for him at HW.

Still a legend.

 

[BoxingMMA]

Fedors strength was that at his best and taking the fight seriously he was faster on the fight than most hw’s and had a lead right faster than many fighters jabs. When he fought smart, as you saw in the cro cop fight, he was hard to handle and didn’t make mistakes.

the problem came when he fight fighters he didn’t seem to deem that dangerous and he just went balls out throwing hands and he didn’t have the chin for it, the got caught by fujita pretty bad and later in his career he started fighting this way against everyone, like he didn’t care anymore.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Yup still can’t answer the questions. Hey kiddo, as has been pointed out to you by everyone, you don’t understand that the concept of absolute physical prime doesn’t exist. You can write whatever essay you like but creating the concept and trying to apply it is the source of your hilarious confusion.

You were given multiple scientific studies that show various physical traits peak at very early ages. It’s not that hard to understand. The only issue is you actually treating physical prime as an absolute.

When everyone is making fun of you and telling that you’re an idiot then you should take a step back and listen. Or not, it’s up to you. However I’m not wasting a week trying to explain basics to you.

Enjoy your day in grade 6.

I do actually think part of the advantage of the earlier era was that promoters being more proactive in signing talent up tended to be at HW espeically you had much younger fighters, guys like Fedor, Crocop, Arlovski, Sergei, Nog, Barnett I think we got to see their physical and their technical primes overlap.

Often with modern HW's thats not the case, they start so late that by the time their hitting their technical prime their physical prime is past.

 

[Westbrick]

Fedor isn't close to the grappler of Khabib.


He gave up the most basic single-leg/slide by to Hendo before the KO

Thats 40yo headhunter Fedor.

What is your issue with Aldo's coaching?

Nova União is a cancer bro, Dedé is always telling it's all good, they have the worst and dumbest gameplans ever, all you need is to watch Aldo dashing into Conor left hand after a camp in Cuba doing that shit and posting videos everyday doing the same thing.

They all have shit cardio, shit gameplans, and Dedé telling it's all good, they're winning.

The first time i saw Dedé pissed and telling Aldo to kick was Aldo vs Font, thats his last win.

 

[BFoe]

Honestly, there seems to be some nostalgic bias in here.

Don’t get me wrong, the Last Emperor is a legend and one of the very best GOAT candidates, eternal respect for what he accomplished and for many of his top abilities, but historical prime Fedor would certainly not easily “crush everybody” today the way he did in the 2000s, for two main reasons.

1 – The technical level is better

We often read that heavyweights now are less technical or more one-dimensional than in the 2000s Pride era or the 2010s UFC : this is globally pure bullshit. Actually, one of the reasons Fedor could shine so much was because he fought in a technically super-uneven division.

View attachment 955864
How many of his basic armbars do you think Fedor could pull off nowadays ? Probably not so much considering almost nobody falls for armbars now as they are super-known and drilled, while for some Pride fighters they were apparently very esoteric and startling feats.

Clearly, one of the reasons (not the only one) why Fedor was so good in Pride was because he was one of the most (probably the most) complete fighters of all. With his sambo, he had a polyvalent skillset and a great understanding of all aspects of MMA, enhancing his other abilities (aggression, speed, etc.).

In short, Fedor appeared even more as a demi-god because he faced many guys, particularly big ones, who were in the “MMA technical stone-age”, and while it was normal for the time, it would be very different today, aggravating the size factor.

View attachment 955865
One of the peak MMA athletes of the glorious year 2005 that Fedor had to face, before elite HW MMA dramatically declined.

2 – Everyone is bigger

“Heavyweight” can mean a lot of things, and the standard has totally inflated from Pride to 2022. If we speak in today’s terms, the functional and complete “HW” of the prime Fedor era were mostly blown-up MW and LHW (HW Cro Cop and LHW rehydrated Prochazka are roughly the same size, minus some fat).

There were big guys in Pride sure but, with some exceptions, they were not complete MMA fighters, either unathletic freaks (Zulu, etc.) or pure kickboxers with minimal grappling (Hong-Man Choi and some others were 100x more unidimensional than the Ganes and N’Gannous some like to deconsider).

Today HW are way bigger and often more athletic than the average functional “HW” Pride fighter (N’Gannou and many others cutting weight to fight jacked at 265 lbs) and the difference it makes in striking and grappling is enormous.

First, the one punch KO power they display is nothing to laugh at, particularly when you see how Fedor was sometimes put on skates in his prime or KOed by Henderson in 2011 when he was far from being a greybeard (good luck boxing aggressively against 265+ lbs, 83 inches-reach counter-puncher N’Gannou and his underrated precision).



Cro Cop had KO power with his high-kicks sure, but now many HWs can do equal or more damage just with their fists, which tells of the power evolution and also explains why wrestling reigns less supreme than in other divisions, as it is much more risky to implement.

Talking about the wrestling/grappling, Fedor’s throws worked against guys who had no clinch game (today cage fighters work it a lot, and I highly doubt Fedor could toss Stipe, MT Gane or N'Gannou), were his size or less, but against big guys with a bit of technique, his abilities were often nullified, which is totally normal and why we have weight divisions in the first place.


By the way, if we apply to the Silva fight the same logic many apply to Gane/N’Gannou, we should conclude that Fedor has complete shit grappling for getting stuck in mount.

And what if…

Fedor was in his prime today and adapting his game to another era ? That's a good question, even if there are many reasons to think that size would remain a big problem for him at HW.

Still a legend.

I appreciate the well thought out breakdown, but I respectfully disagree in regards to HW evolution technically. Now, I don’t think prime Fedor would “crush” everyone; after all, he didn’t even back then. He had competitive fights sometimes, or had to make a comeback sometimes, or whatever.
I agree with you that HWs overall are bigger.
—Ngannou is 10 years into his career and only recently started adding wrestling. He’s a mere blue belt in BJJ.
—Lewis is a striker with no real wrestling or grappling.
—Tuivasa is a striker with no real wrestling or grappling.
—Gane is a Muay Thai fighter with no real wrestling, and a literal white belt on the ground.
—Rozenstruik is a kickboxer with no real wrestling or grappling.
—Even a great HW like Stipe had wrestling and boxing, but no real grappling to speak of, doesn’t have a BJJ belt that I’m aware of and hasn’t even attempted a sub as far as I can recall.
—Even Chris Daukaus has a BJJ black belt but has never won a fight by submission and in fact has lost by submission; he comes from “Daukaus Boxing” but got stopped by wrestler Curtis Blaydes in his last fight.

If prime Fedor fought dudes like Cain, DC, or JDS in prime he may lose some of those. But if he was just here competing in today’s HW division, I think he’d do just fine.

 

[MartinGibson86]

—Mark Coleman was a juiced-to-the-gills, Olympic level wrestler FFS. Fedor literally outgrappled him, and submitted him, twice. In the 2nd fight, Fedor defended 10 of 12 TD attempts.
—Randleman was a juiced-to-the-gills, 2x NCAA Div 1 champ and 3x Big 10 champ. You understand that people with good wrestling credentials can get TDs, right? Like Abel Trujillo and Gleison Tibau? Fedor swept Randleman from side control and subbed him.

—Yeah, Lindland really gave Fedor hell, bud.

Your “40 year old MW” is another TRT-juiced Olympic level wrestler. Bigfoot was a BJJ black belt with a 50 lb weight advantage. I’d love to compare that to Khabib’s MMA career, but not only has he never had to deal with that but he retired and walked away from the sport before he ever got to be 34 years of age like Fedor was in those fights.

With Sherdog end of year awards coming up, there’s got to be some Most Dogshit Takes award I can nominate you for. Truly, I can’t think of another poster who is so consistently bad. I often question whether or not you’ve actually watched this sport.

Mark Coleman was literallt a style vs style fighter dude lol Fedor hit an arbar on a guy who never trained armbars.

Jesus Christ...



I could see Khabib getting sidemounted twice by a K1 guy with no grappling. like Hunt.


Why'd the armbar fail against Hunt?? Why was he sidemounted twice? lol


Fedor was past it, right?

 

[MartinGibson86]

Thats 40yo headhunter Fedor.


Nova União is a cancer bro, Dedé is always telling it's all good, they have the worst and dumbest gameplans ever, all you need is to watch Aldo dashing into Conor left hand after a camp in Cuba doing that shit and posting videos everyday doing the same thing.

They all have shit cardio, shit gameplans, and Dedé telling it's all good, they're winning.

The first time i saw Dedé pissed and telling Aldo to kick was Aldo vs Font, thats his last win.

He was actually 34 against Hendo but why let facts get n the way of some good hero worship.


He was barely 30 when he got fucking sidemonted twice by grappling ace Mark Hunt.


Goddamn smh

 

[BFoe]

Mark Coleman was literallt a style vs style fighter dude lol Fedor hit an arbar on a guy who never trained armbars.

Jesus Christ...

So to be clear, over the course of their 2 fights Olympic wrestler Mark Coleman attempted 15 TDs, and Fedor defended 12 of them. Fedor subbed Coleman both times. Your criticism is what—that Fedor didn’t defend all 15? You want to compare it to Khabib who has been taken down by wrestlers with a lesser pedigree?

I could see Khabib getting sidemounted twice by a K1 guy with no grappling. like Hunt.


Why'd the armbar fail against Hunt?? Why was he sidemounted twice? lol


Fedor was past it, right?

You better sit down for this, because I’m going to drop a piece of knowledge that will blow your mind:
Fighters don’t succeed at every single submission they go for. I know, I know, pretty crazy. Mark Hunt was 290 lbs in that fight, dude. While Fedor did have nice TDs and mount in that fight, one of those side mounts came from a failed TD attempt. I’d love to see how Khabib handles that, but he’s never had to fight anyone that outweighed him by 60 lbs.

And no, I don’t think Fedor was “past it” in 2006, but he was injured going into that fight. I posted an article just earlier ITT which said Fedor was going to be pulled from that event due to injury. Fedor decided to fight anyway, won the fight by rd 1 sub and you want to criticize him because you don’t think his grappling was up to the standard of a LW/WW who only fought other LWs and WWs?
Get lost.

 

[TheComputerGuy]

The physical declines from age typically don't happen until after 35. "Out of prime" is a reference to declines due to age.

Most of the declines are due more to wear and tear on the body then age. It is why Randy was able to do well in his 40s. He got a late start.

 

[MartinGibson86]

So to be clear, over the course of their 2 fights Olympic wrestler Mark Coleman attempted 15 TDs, and Fedor defended 12 of them. Fedor subbed Coleman both times. Your criticism is what—that Fedor didn’t defend all 15? You want to compare it to Khabib who has been taken down by wrestlers with a lesser pedigree?



You better sit down for this, because I’m going to drop a piece of knowledge that will blow your mind:
Fighters don’t succeed at every single submission they go for. I know, I know, pretty crazy. Mark Hunt was 290 lbs in that fight, dude. While Fedor did have nice TDs and mount in that fight, one of those side mounts came from a failed TD attempt. I’d love to see how Khabib handles that, but he’s never had to fight anyone that outweighed him by 60 lbs.

And no, I don’t think Fedor was “past it” in 2006, but he was injured going into that fight. I posted an article just earlier ITT which said Fedor was going to be pulled from that event due to injury. Fedor decided to fight anyway, won the fight by rd 1 sub and you want to criticize him because you don’t think his grappling was up to the standard of a LW/WW who only fought other LWs and WWs?
Get lost.

Hunt was easily subbed by Barnett prior and easily subbed by McCorkle after...so you can make whatever excuses you want lol

He put Fedor in side control TWICE when they were both fresh.



Fedor isn't close to the grappler of Khabib.

 

[Talibankocken]

That's not what physical prime means. Muscle strength doesn't peak until 25. Gymnasts at 20-21 aren't in their physical prime.





Personal best does not equate to physical prime.




27-35 is physical prime for males.



Francis hasn't fought since he turned 36. So the last few fights we've seen from him, he was in his physical prime. Athletes can combat, prevent, and even reverse the effects of aging (up to 20 years) with regular exercise. I believe fighters, including Fedro, mostly qualify. Correct, being in or out of your physical prime isn't the end all be all determining factor in whether or not a fighter wins a fight. That's literally the whole point of arguing with these fanatical and defiant kids trying to deny science.

They say Fedro was out of prime at 33, and that's why he lost 3 in a row. I find it hilarious that they use gymnasts as an example, citing a young age for peak performance, to prove this. The age for peak performance in MMA is 31-33. The average age of current UFC champions is 33+. Let's ignore the fact that he's fought, and had success, into his mid 40s.

Weird.

You're acting as if the term "physical prime" has an undisputable and established definition, which it doesn't. It heavily suggests peak performance though (which makes sense as it's the only measurable factor), and it would be completely unreasonable to argue as you do, as if there was a certain age range where everybody peaks. For obvious reasons, the performance peak varies heavily among individuals depending on lifestyle, physical activity and a bunch of other factors.

Gymnasts definitely have their prime at around 20 as their performance deteriorates after that. The fact that they might be a bit stronger at 25 doesn't change the fact that they can't do what they did five years before, because their physical shape won't allow them. There's much more to it than just strength. Speed, reflexes, mobility, recovery, accumulated damage and much more, all are factors that affect when your physical peak occurs. Someone who hasn't lifted their butt off their chair until they're 35 and then start training will quickly become stronger and more physically able than they'd ever been before, thus reaching their physical peak later than someone who's been doing it since they were teens.

With your logic, a recovering drug addict who goes clean at 35 after 15 years of drug abuse, starts going to the gym and gets in shape isn't in his prime, but his 27 year old methhead self were. That's just ridiculous. Potential and reality is not the same thing, and you can impossibly determine when someone's physical prime is, by looking as something as abstract as their potential.

 

[Westbrick]

He was actually 34 against Hendo but why let facts get n the way of some good hero worship.


He was barely 30 when he got fucking sidemonted twice by grappling ace Mark Hunt.


Goddamn smh

He just lost to Werdum and Bigfoot bro, that's not even close to prime Fedor, or prime Hendo too to be clear, but Hendo is another p4p great.

 

[Fioretti]

Most of the declines are due more to wear and tear on the body then age. It is why Randy was able to do well in his 40s. He got a late start.

Randy joined the Army at 19. You think there was no wear and tear in the Army? After that he wrestled for about 8 years, then got into MMA. TRT helped him do well into his 40s, not his lack of wear and tear. Are you aware of the benefits of TRT?

You're acting as if the term "physical prime" has an undisputable and established definition, which it doesn't. It heavily suggests peak performance though (which makes sense as it's the only measurable factor), and it would be completely unreasonable to argue as you do, as if there was a certain age range where everybody peaks. For obvious reasons, the performance peak varies heavily among individuals depending on lifestyle, physical activity and a bunch of other factors.

Gymnasts definitely have their prime at around 20 as their performance deteriorates after that. The fact that they might be a bit stronger at 25 doesn't change the fact that they can't do what they did five years before, because their physical shape won't allow them. There's much more to it than just strength. Speed, reflexes, mobility, recovery, accumulated damage and much more, all are factors that affect when your physical peak occurs. Someone who hasn't lifted their butt off their chair until they're 35 and then start training will quickly become stronger and more physically able than they'd ever been before, thus reaching their physical peak later than someone who's been doing it since they were teens.

With your logic, a recovering drug addict who goes clean at 35 after 15 years of drug abuse, starts going to the gym and gets in shape isn't in his prime, but his 27 year old methhead self were. That's just ridiculous. Potential and reality is not the same thing, and you can impossibly determine when someone's physical prime is, by looking as something as abstract as their potential.

Physiological prime is an age range in which humans are the most developed, before they start to decline naturally. When bones, muscles, speed, reflexes, cardio, and recovery literally start to deteriorate, it's very different than having a personal best or an off night.

You, like the others, are lumping event-based peak individual athletic performance with physiological prime. The are not the same thing. Period.

 

[Talibankocken]

Physiological prime is an age range in which humans are the most developed, before they start to decline naturally. When bones, muscles, speed, reflexes, cardio, and recovery literally start to deteriorate, it's very different than having a personal best or an off night.

You, like the others, are lumping event-based peak individual athletic performance with physiological prime. The are not the same thing. Period.

"Physiological" prime isn't even a thing, and even if it was, once again, it all depends on the individual and their lifestyle, genes, training etc. Gymnasts performing their best at around 20 years of age has absolutely nothing to do with on nights or off nights, but more with the fact that gymnasts typically starts training from a very young age and reach their peak potential early, and then start to deteriorate. Exactly how does gymnasts performance go downhill if their strength, speed, reflexes, cardio etc. keeps going up for 5-10 more years? Because they all magically get bored around the same age? No, but because the conditions made them reach their "prime" earlier than the average person.

It's impossible to define a range of "prime" years when you're talking about professional athletes that has been training at an elite level since childhood, there is way too many factors to take into consideration that affects when their bodies start deteriorating.

 

[BFoe]

Randy joined the Army at 19. You think there was no wear and tear in the Army? After that he wrestled for about 8 years, then got into MMA. TRT helped him do well into his 40s, not his lack of wear and tear. Are you aware of the benefits of TRT?

You have a source for Couture being on TRT? I have never heard of him having an exemption, and he always spoke out against it.