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Dynamic Effort...when?

Discussion in 'Strength & Conditioning Discussion' started by RJ43, Nov 2, 2005.

  1. RJ43

    RJ43 The Baddy

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    I'm obviously new to powerlifting, but after years wasted on body building nonsense I'm trying to learn everything I can. I'm just getting back into lifting after about a year layoff and my 5 rep maxes are 225 bench, 295 deadlift, and about a 235 squat. Should I even bother trying to include dynamic effort lifts at this stage? As it stand now my routine is Max Effort upper body, Max Effort lower body, then a repitition upper body with days of core work and active rest in between. If I shouldn't mess with DE now, when would you guys reccomend to start, or when did you start? Any help appreciated.
     
  2. yomon

    yomon Green Belt

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    for now keep training heavy and don't even worry about DE days yet. Once you notice your gains leveling off then you might want to consider it.
     
  3. MadDildo

    MadDildo Shame Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    It depends, how much do you weigh?

    With that squat, I find it unlikely that you're prepared for dynamic lifts or plyometrics. The fact is your potential for power will be more efficiently increased at this point through your max strength training. The cookie-cutter recommendation is to not begin plyo's until you are able to squat 1.5x your bodyweight or do a full pistol.
     
  4. RJ43

    RJ43 The Baddy

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    I'm 6'1 and weigh 185. Yeah I can't do a single pistol, even when I did lift I rarely did legs and now I'm paying for it, but I'll improve. Thanks for the help guys
     
  5. nudge119

    nudge119 Green Belt

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    Don't bother with DE stuff yet, concentrate on getting your dead and squat up to par with your bench.


    Post your exact routine - what lifts and sets and reps so we can help you more. What is your diet like. What are you exact goals?
     
  6. Sean S

    Sean S Brown Belt

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    I have to agree with everyone posting so far. If I remember correctly James Smith, and I am sure others I have read have said this, usually you don't start until:

    Deadlift: At least 2x body weight
    Squat: At least 2x body weight
    Bench: At least 1.5x body weight

    And I think these were the bare minimums. So people I have read say even higher then those guidelines. Basically, you don't have to worry about it yet.
     
  7. yomon

    yomon Green Belt

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    damn by that i'll have to deadlift about and squat bout 400lb. i'm no where near at the moment.
     
  8. graedy

    graedy Brown Belt

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    On the other hand, Dan181, who is pound for pound very strong, advised to do the advanced stuff almost right from the beginning.
     
  9. Sean S

    Sean S Brown Belt

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    Fair enough since, pound for pound nothing, the guy was strong. I guess it might cme down to: if your lifts are moving up well, then why bother? But then again, that could be used to justify a lot of training types, good or bad.
     
  10. aronafan

    aronafan Yellow Belt

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    http://www.elitefts.com/articles/Current-Articles/default.asp

    Maybe you already know the site considering it looks like you are using a Westside template for your lifting, if not there is more lifting knoweldge available than you could ever ask for. Not to mention, they also have a forum that you could ask the very same question and get a response from one of the members of the crew. Not saying that the guys on here don't know what they are saying, not saying that at all. Just in my opinion if you want to learn how to box as well as you can, you go to a boxing trainer, if you want to learn about lifting you seek help from the guys "walk the walk". BTW, they are fighter friendly and have several guys ask specific questions regarding fight training. Good luck.
     
  11. CrazyAZNRedneck

    CrazyAZNRedneck Orange Belt

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    Well, I think it would benefit you to do Box Squats at the very least. To get you good at the "starting strength" people are so crazy about these days. You could follow Bill STarr's 5x5 until you have a 275 bench, 365 Deadlift and a 205ish Powerclean. Being able to Wide-Grip Chin your bodyweight is also a good indication of strength if you ask me.

    OR, a good thing I tried is the Metal Militia program for Bench Press (which trains the Bench in two phases: Full Bench and Lockout Strength). I'm currently training 3 of my lifts (Wide-Grip Chins w/ added plates, Bench, Deadlift) 3x a week (quite a bit shy of failure--even on max days) and it's certainly helping those lifts sky rocket. Though, it is pretty impossible to concentrate on your Deadlift and Squat at the same time, so you'll have to split them up or trade weeks.
     
  12. Mark Limbaga

    Mark Limbaga Amateur Fighter

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    Those are actually high numbers but I'll have to say bench can be lowered to 1.25xBW. I agree that one must build a decent strength base first i order to maximize the benefits of dynamic training.

     
  13. MadDildo

    MadDildo Shame Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Yeah, that's not the first time I've seen them that high, but Chu wrote the 1.5x for the squat.

    I wish James were here to elaborate.
     
  14. Sean S

    Sean S Brown Belt

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    I could have his numbers high, but the idea is that you shouldn't even bother until you have had a decent amount of time under the bar.
     
  15. gruesome

    gruesome Green Belt

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    DE is a way to get more time under the bar without burning yourself out.
     
  16. RJ43

    RJ43 The Baddy

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    Yeah I go to elite lifts alot. It's just hard for me as a beginner to incorporate so many articles into a successful routine, but I'm taking bits and pieces and putting a routine together. I haven't posted anything there yet though...
     
  17. RJ43

    RJ43 The Baddy

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    I have just recently changed my routine to the 5x5 method for the big 3 lifts. It looks something like this:

    I do the big 3 lifts 2-3 weeks in a row, then I switch to the left to the right of it after teh slash. 3 weeks of Deads, then 3 weeks of GMs instead.

    Monday
    Deadlifts/GM/Romanian Dead (5x5)
    Bent Over Barbell Rows/Chest Supported Rows/Tbar rows (3-4 sets 6-10 reps)
    Wide grip chins (I can only do about 4 sets of 5)
    BB Shrug/DB Shrug/Any shrug at a diff angle (3 sets 6-10 reps)
    Occasionally an additional upper back pull if I have the strength after

    Tuesday
    Core is a huge weakness of mine so I could use some advice here
    Hanging Leg Raises 3 x 6
    Dumbbell Crunches on Physioball 3 x 8
    Vacuums 3 x 10 second holds

    Wednesday
    Flat Barbell bench/BoardPress/FloorPress/Close Grip bench (5x5)
    Incline DB press (3 sets 8-10)
    Skull Crushers/Tate Press/Pushdowns/JM Press (haven't done this one yet) (3 sets 6-10)
    Push Presses/Overhead DB presses (3 sets 6-10)

    Thursday
    Core
    Side Bends 3 x 6 each
    Rotation Medicine Ball Throws 2 x 8 each
    Medicine Ball twists? 3x10 each

    Friday
    Back Squat/Front Squat/Box Squat (5x5)
    Walking Lunges/Barbell Lunges/Bench Step ups (3x6-10)
    Leg Curls/ Straight Legged Deads/Pull Throughs (3x 8-10)

    SAT
    OFF

    Sun
    Grip also another huge weakness I struggle holding the CoC Trainer shut with my left hand

    I do a few sets of like 3 with the CoC trainer, then I'll close it and hold it shut for as long as I can.

    We don't have flat plates at my school's gym so it's very hard to do plate pinches so I take a dumbell and hold it the top of the one side with my fingers for as long as i can.

    My diet looks like this (after about 2 months of eating pure garbage)

    Protein Shake
    7-8 Eggwhites scrambled
    2 slices wheat toast
    Can of Tuna
    Turkey Breast sandwich on wheat
    Natural peanut butter sandwich on wheat
    Apple
    2 Large Chicken breasts/Hamburgers on wheat buns/whole wheat pasta
    bowl of soup, usually some form of chicken soup

    My goals are simply to increase strength and now be plateued for too long. I'd like to be able to flat bench 275 for my set of 5, Squat about 300+ and DL 350+ by April, I'm not sure if these goals are too out of site or too low but I'm gonna try. I'd like to lose a little fat around the midsection, but the core strength is more important to me at this point. It looks like I should hold off on the DE effort for about a year or so maybe. As usual, any help appreciated.
     

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