Movies DUNE: PART TWO (Passes $600 Million Worldwide; Dragonlord's Review)

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Just got back from it. Very good, I’ll score it 8.5/10 but I have to say, a few of the changes really surprised me, to the point that I’m not really sure if it’s more or less book accurate than the 1984 David Lynch movie. As far as book accuracy is concerned nothing holds a candle to the 2000 Scyfy Channel miniseries. The big changes from the book that surprised me:

Spoiler

1. No Alia - which of course leads to Paul killing the Baron himself in this version compared to Alia doing the deed.

2. Drawing out the Emperor to Arrakis by threatening to expose his involvement in bringing down House Atreides as opposed to in the book where they draw him out along with the collective armies of the Houses of Landsraad by bringing spice production to a standstill. It’s supposed to be a big revelation towards the very end that Maud’dib is Paul.

3. The exclusion of the Spacing Guild. In the books the Guild basically forces the Emperor to step down and accept Paul as the new Emperor. The Guild effectively is the real power in the Dune universe, yet in this movie they literally weren’t even in part 2 AT ALL.

4. The reason for the Jihad at the very end was changed. In this movie they say that the Great Houses won’t accept Paul as Emperor. In the book they do accept him an Emperor — what causes the Jihad is that accepting Paul as Emperor isn’t good enough, the Fremen want everyone to accept Paul as the messiah, the Mahdi. The Jihad is truly religious in nature, while this movie imo didn’t really set that up.

5. Paul didn’t train the Fremen in the movie to become the ultimate fighting force. In the book and miniseries Paul trains the Fremen all the combat techniques he learned from Gurney and Dunan, but more important than that he taught them all the Weirding Way of the Bebe Gesserit to make them the greatest warriors in the universe, even more deadly than the Emperor’s Saurdakar. That never happened in this movie, and inexplicably the Saurdakar were made into jobbers in part 2.

6. In this Paul threatens to use nuclear weapons to blow up the spice fields. In the book he threatens to use water to kill all the Sandworms, as it’s revealed in the books that the worms actually make the spice. The ecology of Dune is important in the books but it’s a complete non factor in the movie.


Probably a few others that just aren’t coming to mind

In Lynch’s version from 1984 the big changes were the inclusion of the Weirding Module “sound guns” which were truly bizarre, and then the “they all lived happily ever after” ending which is a farce to anyone that’s read Dune Messiah.

 

[Deadwing88]

I could have sworn they really leaned into the Bene Gesseritt seeding prophecies in the film.

And yes, Bardem was fantastic.

I think they leaned into the suggestion that the prophecy had died out in belief amongst a large chunk of the population.. Lady Jessica is doing a mass propaganda campaign to convert non believers in the background while Paul is doing the guerilla war against the Harkonnens.

 

[method115]

Just got done watching it. Amazing movie. I thought it was a little to simple how things worked out in the end but overall great. Also don't understand the last order given by Paul. Im sure the books explain that a bit more but the movie should have given us something to explain it. Don't want to spoil it but yea I just don't get it.

 

[method115]

Just got back from it. Very good, I’ll score it 8.5/10 but I have to say, a few of the changes really surprised me, to the point that I’m not really sure if it’s more or less book accurate than the 1984 David Lynch movie. As far as book accuracy is concerned nothing holds a candle to the 2000 Scyfy Channel miniseries. The big changes from the book that surprised me:

Spoiler

1. No Alia - which of course leads to Paul killing the Baron himself in this version compared to Alia doing the deed.

2. Drawing out the Emperor to Arrakis by threatening to expose his involvement in bringing down House Atreides as opposed to in the book where they draw him out along with the collective armies of the Houses of Landsraad by bringing spice production to a standstill. It’s supposed to be a big revelation towards the very end that Maud’dib is Paul.

3. The exclusion of the Spacing Guild. In the books the Guild basically forces the Emperor to step down and accept Paul as the new Emperor. The Guild effectively is the real power in the Dune universe, yet in this movie they literally weren’t even in part 2 AT ALL.

4. The reason for the Jihad at the very end was changed. In this movie they say that the Great Houses won’t accept Paul as Emperor. In the book they do accept him an Emperor — what causes the Jihad is that accepting Paul as Emperor isn’t good enough, the Fremen want everyone to accept Paul as the messiah, the Mahdi. The Jihad is truly religious in nature, while this movie imo didn’t really set that up.

5. Paul didn’t train the Fremen in the movie to become the ultimate fighting force. In the book and miniseries Paul trains the Fremen all the combat techniques he learned from Gurney and Dunan, but more important than that he taught them all the Weirding Way of the Bebe Gesserit to make them the greatest warriors in the universe, even more deadly than the Emperor’s Saurdakar. That never happened in this movie, and inexplicably the Saurdakar were made into jobbers in part 2.

6. In this Paul threatens to use nuclear weapons to blow up the spice fields. In the book he threatens to use water to kill all the Sandworms, as it’s revealed in the books that the worms actually make the spice. The ecology of Dune is important in the books but it’s a complete non factor in the movie.


Probably a few others that just aren’t coming to mind

In Lynch’s version from 1984 the big changes were the inclusion of the Weirding Module “sound guns” which were truly bizarre, and then the “they all lived happily ever after” ending which is a farce to anyone that’s read Dune Messiah.

2. Yea I didn't think this was written well. Even what they did in the book isn't much better.

3. I would think is going to come up in the next movie.

4. Glad this was changed I like this idea better makes more sense for the way this movie ended.

5. Wish that would have happened actually would have been a great addition to the story.

6. Wish this would have been kept in as well. Sounds better than what they went with but overall not a huge deal to me.

 

[Cole train]

Just got done watching it. Amazing movie. I thought it was a little to simple how things worked out in the end but overall great. Also don't understand the last order given by Paul. Im sure the books explain that a bit more but the movie should have given us something to explain it. Don't want to spoil it but yea I just don't get it.

FInal order actually is not in the books if i recall correctly

Its just put there as reference to what was said earlier and for some dramatic effect (Stilgar saying what was the fremen dream)

 

[method115]

FInal order actually is not in the books if i recall correctly

Its just put there as reference to what was said earlier and for some dramatic effect (Stilgar saying what was the fremen dream)

Yea after what Law Talkin said that actually makes more sense in a way but at the same still doesn't makes sense.

Spoiler

The freman have been stuck on the planet and now they are going into space to fight. I would think that is where they get destroyed. I just don't get why the houses would fear them at all in space. It made sense that they could win on their own planet but the whole universe? How?

If it spoils the story don't tell me.

 

[Cole train]

Yea after what Law Talkin said that actually makes more sense in a way but at the same still doesn't makes sense.

Spoiler

The freman have been stuck on the planet and now they are going into space to fight. I would think that is where they get destroyed. I just don't get why the houses would fear them at all in space. It made sense that they could win on their own planet but the whole universe? How?

If it spoils the story don't tell me.

The spoiler part is kinda explained in ending

Spoiler

"Whoever controls the spice controls universe"

All space travel is dependent on spice which paul now controls, basically fremen ships are only ones that have any fuel in the galaxy

And they cant glass paul from orbit either because paul will nuke spice fields

They cant even really engage fremen because paul could nuke spicefields killing space travel

Someone else probably has better explanaition but above made sense to me and it actually went like this when they wanted to glass fremen in books if i remember correctly

 

[method115]

The spoiler part is kinda explained in ending

Spoiler

"Whoever controls the spice controls universe"

All space travel is dependent on spice which paul now controls, basically fremen ships are only ones that have any fuel in the galaxy

And they cant glass paul from orbit either because paul will nuke spice fields

They cant even really engage fremen because paul could nuke spicefields killing space travel

Someone else probably has better explanaition but above made sense to me and it actually went like this when they wanted to glass fremen in books if i remember correctly

Ok that does make more sense.

Spoiler

I was underestimating how rare the spice was

 

[Cole train]

Ok that does make more sense.

Spoiler

I was underestimating how rare the spice was

It literally only exist on fremen planet

 

[method115]

It literally only exist on fremen planet

Yea that makes the whole thing make way more sense now. I didn't know that. I'll have to go back and see if the first one mentions that. I don't remember if it did or not.

 

[Cole train]

Yea that makes the whole thing make way more sense now. I didn't know that. I'll have to go back and see if the first one mentions that. I don't remember if it did or not.

It does in the scene where paul listens to scientefic tapes about arrakis

 

[freakroor]

is the audio better in part 2?

 

[method115]

is the audio better in part 2?

It's the same as the first. You need a good setup to really enjoy it. Main reason I went to the theater. My surround sound got fried in a thunderstorm.

 

[Loiosh]

Just got back from it. Very good, I’ll score it 8.5/10 but I have to say, a few of the changes really surprised me, to the point that I’m not really sure if it’s more or less book accurate than the 1984 David Lynch movie. As far as book accuracy is concerned nothing holds a candle to the 2000 Scyfy Channel miniseries. The big changes from the book that surprised me:

Spoiler

1. No Alia - which of course leads to Paul killing the Baron himself in this version compared to Alia doing the deed.

2. Drawing out the Emperor to Arrakis by threatening to expose his involvement in bringing down House Atreides as opposed to in the book where they draw him out along with the collective armies of the Houses of Landsraad by bringing spice production to a standstill. It’s supposed to be a big revelation towards the very end that Maud’dib is Paul.

3. The exclusion of the Spacing Guild. In the books the Guild basically forces the Emperor to step down and accept Paul as the new Emperor. The Guild effectively is the real power in the Dune universe, yet in this movie they literally weren’t even in part 2 AT ALL.

4. The reason for the Jihad at the very end was changed. In this movie they say that the Great Houses won’t accept Paul as Emperor. In the book they do accept him an Emperor — what causes the Jihad is that accepting Paul as Emperor isn’t good enough, the Fremen want everyone to accept Paul as the messiah, the Mahdi. The Jihad is truly religious in nature, while this movie imo didn’t really set that up.

5. Paul didn’t train the Fremen in the movie to become the ultimate fighting force. In the book and miniseries Paul trains the Fremen all the combat techniques he learned from Gurney and Dunan, but more important than that he taught them all the Weirding Way of the Bebe Gesserit to make them the greatest warriors in the universe, even more deadly than the Emperor’s Saurdakar. That never happened in this movie, and inexplicably the Saurdakar were made into jobbers in part 2.

6. In this Paul threatens to use nuclear weapons to blow up the spice fields. In the book he threatens to use water to kill all the Sandworms, as it’s revealed in the books that the worms actually make the spice. The ecology of Dune is important in the books but it’s a complete non factor in the movie.


Probably a few others that just aren’t coming to mind

In Lynch’s version from 1984 the big changes were the inclusion of the Weirding Module “sound guns” which were truly bizarre, and then the “they all lived happily ever after” ending which is a farce to anyone that’s read Dune Messiah.

In Lynch's version it *cough* rained *cough*.

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

2. Yea I didn't think this was written well. Even what they did in the book isn't much better.

3. I would think is going to come up in the next movie.

4. Glad this was changed I like this idea better makes more sense for the way this movie ended.

5. Wish that would have happened actually would have been a great addition to the story.

6. Wish this would have been kept in as well. Sounds better than what they went with but overall not a huge deal to me.

I strongly disagree that the change to #4 makes more sense than how it goes in the book.

Spoiler

The Fremen don’t really recognize the Imperial governance structure in the first place, so why do they give a shit whether or not the Great Houses bend the knee to Paul as Emperor?

In the book the Great Houses, the Guild, the Bene Gesserit etc all bend the knee to Paul as Emperor. However, the Fremen are fanatical and basically view Paul as a Messiah or even a living God, so they send their missionaries and holy armies out into the universe to convert everyone to their religion. Those that don’t convert are killed. At the start of Dune Messiah twelve years have passed and in that time Paul’s Jihad (which he has basically zero control over) has slaughtered 60 BILLION people and Paul decides he needs to find a way to stop it, leading to the events of that book and its sequel, Children of Dune.

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

In Lynch's version it *cough* rained *cough*.

LOL, oh yeah, forgot about that one!

 

[method115]

I strongly disagree that the change to #4 makes more sense than how it goes in the book.

Spoiler

The Fremen don’t really recognize the Imperial governance structure in the first place, so why do they give a shit whether or not the Great Houses bend the knee to Paul as Emperor?

In the book the Great Houses, the Guild, the Bene Gesserit etc all bend the knee to Paul as Emperor. However, the Fremen are fanatical and basically view Paul as a Messiah or even a living God, so they send their missionaries and holy armies out into the universe to convert everyone to their religion. Those that don’t convert are killed. At the start of Dune Messiah twelve years have passed and in that time Paul’s Jihad (which he has basically zero control over) has slaughtered 60 BILLION people and Paul decides he needs to find a way to stop it, leading to the events of that book and its sequel, Children of Dune.

Rereading your post I still think it can happen this way just not exactly. I do think they sort of set it up with what happened in the movie.

 

[Loiosh]

LOL, oh yeah, forgot about that one!

Probably the only thing that pissed me off more than the Weirding modules.

 

[Streeter]

Second thought I hope they end this franchise here unless they make Messiah and Children 1 movie. Messiah by itself was a decent book but would make a really boring movie .

 

[PurpleStorm]

Dune 2 is a masterpiece of brilliant engaging filmmaking. Every element at the filmmaker's disposal is used to maximum effect for the purpose of moving the story forward. This deeply engrossing tale is not told outright in the first few minutes. It reveals itself over time by allowing the viewer to actively engage with the material.

I saw it in a theater and was enthralled from start to finish. You could watch this movie with no sound and feast on the visual beauty of every frame. Conversely you could listen to the sound - with zero dialogue - and follow along with the brilliant Hans Zimmer soundtrack. Working in tandem with the cinematography and soundtrack the sheer beauty of shot choices and sound design are as deep and rich as the universe in which this cosmic philosophical tale inhabits. Some may compare it to the brilliant books but to me books and movies are different works of art and should be viewed on their own.

The movie never talks down to its audience. It lets you think throughout. What is going on? Why is this happening? What is the purpose of religion, of politics, of scarcity, of greed, of demagogues, of technology, of war, of myth? Within the first act I knew it wasn't going to tell me everything. Instead I trusted the movie to offer ways of seeing and listening. Or you can just kick back enjoy your popcorn and hard cider and trip out on the sound and light show as though you're at a planetarium listening to some incredible unreleased pink floyd album.

Denis Villenueve has already established himself as a director unlike any other. Prisoners, Sicario, Arrival, Blade Runner 2049 and Dune are all worth seeing for the bold storytelling and visual acuity. With Dune 2 he has created his fullest - and most audacious - movie.

10/10

@Dragonlordxxxxx I enjoy reading your reviews. I respect your thoughtful opinions and the ways you present them. We're in agreement on Dune 2. Thanks for sharing your always engaging reviews.

Thanks to everyone sharing their thoughts in this thread!