Divisions where the champion isn't the best

[TheRealMikeson]

and he is now, it was 2 years ago..... stop acting like it was a lifetime ago. since that defeat Max has destroyed everyone in front of him. That win still counts

Closer to 3 years actually. You're actually using Max Holloway's recent performances as a crutch to try and show how great McGregor is. Do they not teach you about fallacies in Scotland? Or did you take one too many to the head?

 

[MayhemMonkey]

Only one judge scored round one for Cruz.

you are overvaluing me adding "the judges agreed with me" part..... I wasnt talking about per round, I meant overall

either way, Dom deserved to win and did win

 

[MayhemMonkey]

Closer to 3 years actually. You're actually using Max Holloway's recent performances as a crutch to try and show how great McGregor is. Do they not teach you about fallacies in Scotland? Or did you take one too many to the head?

So the fact that both Max and Dustin have went on tears since they lost to Conor doesnt make Conors wins over them look better? in what way? They had nothing for Conor, yet are dismantling everyone else. How does that not make Conors wins over them seem more impressive?

 

[Lucifer Alpha]

Everyone is beatable. That being said McGregor is the most dominant champion just by the way he dispatched his opposition.

The guy with zero title defenses is the most dominant champion?

 

[Sgt Smith]

MMA has some real depth now, so all champs are going to be somewhat threatened. MM and Cruz are probably the least under threat because of their level of talent and subsequent talent within their division currently. This is actually a really good thing, we're just not used to it.

 

[milenss]

you are overvaluing me adding "the judges agreed with me" part..... I wasnt talking about per round, I meant overall

either way, Dom deserved to win and did win

This is subjective.
See how this works? Nobody's opinion is unquestionable.
I think Cruz deserved to win just 1 out of 5 rounds, maybe 2 in the best case. Even his corner was telling him he must go for the finish going into the 5th round. What does this tell you? Yeah.. even his men didn't believe he was winning that fight.

 

[Mob69]

I think only three or four of the ten champs are clearly the best: Joanna, Cruz, DJ and probably Conor.

Incredibly state of affairs. It's a phase and won't last.

 

[Fight Professor]

3... Max, Chad and Aldo

Pourier would have been a top 10 fighter too if he had not moved up. Conor has a very solid FW resume. Frankie is the only fighter missing to make it great.

 

[The Schmoop]

Lol at people saying Conor is unstoppable at 145. Mendes was doing takedown drills on him fresh off the coach and he KO'd Aldo is 13 seconds. Props on the Aldo victory but it wasn't exactly a 25 minute drumming. Huge win on a beautiful shot, no doubt but let's wait to anoint him unstoppable until after *(if ever) he musters a title defense.

 

[Lanx]

Only 135 and under (except Nunes) are unbeatable

Cruz

MM

JJ

Well if Jones is suspended for 2 years, then i guess DC can reign longer as the paper champ too.

 

[Turtlejuice]

Sherdog has him as top five. Either way, using a technicality to try and say McGregor hasn't proved himself at FW is silly. He's beaten the best FWs, excepting Frankie Edgar. All the others are a good ways beneath Mendes, Aldo, Edgar, and Holloway.

I think Frankie beats McGregor, but the others he has beaten once already.

I didn't say he hasn't proven himself at FW. I'm saying he hasn't proven unquestionably that he is the best FW. DJ has proven unquestionably that he is the best FLW.

I'd put DC up there

Joanna probably too

JJ and DC could be argued as well.

 

[incinerate]

Miocic is an unknown so I don't feel comfortable questioning his abilities, he is the champ.
Bisping is capable of beating all of those guys so it's not for sure he isn't the best.
Woodley just beat the man and again so he should be considered the best.
Alvarez had some UFC jitters but sense then he has been dominant and before then he was the underground champ.
McGregor is the best FW just not a good LW/WW.
Nunes looks like a beast right now so we'll see on that one.

Overall I think it's pretty bold to call out a champ for not being the best in their division. So you better come with some better arguments than those if you're going to say it.

Bisping is capable but highly unlikely to make it through Jacare and/or Romero.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

I didn't say he hasn't proven himself at FW. I'm saying he hasn't proven unquestionably that he is the best FW. DJ has proven unquestionably that he is the best FLW.

If Demetrious Johnson level of dominance is your standard, then few champs have ever reached it. A more reasonable view imo is that a champ needs to beat several of the elite fighters in a division to show he is the best. Right now at FW, there are only two fighters who can realistically claim to be the best, and one of them has beaten the other.

 

[Turtlejuice]

If Demetrious Johnson level of dominance is your standard, then few champs have ever reached it. A more reasonable view imo is that a champ needs to beat several of the elite fighters in a division to show he is the best. Right now at FW, there are only two fighters who can realistically claim to be the best, and one of them has beaten the other.

That is exactly what I said. DJ is the only champ that has proven unquestionably that he is the best of his division. There are a couple of others that could be argued.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

That is exactly what I said. DJ is the only champ that has proven unquestionably that he is the best of his division. There are a couple of others that could be argued.

Why not just say he's the only champ to have cleaned out his division? That's a great accomplishment, and he deserves a lot of credit for it. But other champs can reasonably claim to be the best in their divisions as well. It doesn't have to be completely unquestionable when you have the strap. Joanna is a great example. Their may be strawweights who can beat her and maybe she'll lose her next fight. but for the time being she's marked herself out as the best, even though she's far from having cleaned out her division.

 

[MustangSally]

HW - Miocic. Good chance that he gets beaten by Overeem and maybe Cain or JDS again.
MW - Bisping. There is a great chance that get beaten by Jacare, Romero, Rockhold, Weidman, Machida and Whittaker.
WW - Woodley. There is a good chance that gets beaten by either MacDonald, Wonderboy or maybe (big question) Maia.
LW - Alvarez. Good chance that he gets beaten by Khabib or Ferguson.
FW - McGregor. Good chance that he could get beaten by Edgar and maybe Aldo or Holloway.
FBW - Nunes. Great chance she gets beaten by Shevchenko, and a good chance that Zingano and Pena beat her.

Are there more that you think? or is that all?

A healthy Gastelum and Conditi can be added to the list of people who could potentially beat Woodley. Cowboy has already beaten Alvarez recently

 

[Turtlejuice]

Why not just say he's the only champ to have cleaned out his division? That's a great accomplishment, and he deserves a lot of credit for it. But other champs can reasonably claim to be the best in their divisions as well. It doesn't have to be completely unquestionable when you have the strap. Joanna is a great example. Their may be strawweights who can beat her and maybe she'll lose her next fight. but for the time being she's marked herself out as the best, even though she's far from having cleaned out her division.

Well technically, all champs are the best in their division until proven otherwise. With DJ being the exception, he is just the best in his division.

 

[JKS]

HW, MW, WW, LW

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Well technically, all champs are the best in their division until proven otherwise. With DJ being the exception, he is just the best in his division.

See, I don't think that is necessarily true either. Not trying to be argumentative, I swear.

It's possible to have new champs who have yet to face dangerous contenders, like Woodley and Wonderboy. Or you could have a situation like LHW where DC is the champ, but Jones is the best LHW. Even had Lawler won, I think it would be reasonable to claim that Condit was a better fighter than he was, etc. Or you could have a situation like LW where a guy like Khabib seems unbeatable to some extent, but has been kept out of action because of injuries.

I think that as the quality of MMA fighters continues to rise, we'll see more and more parity toward the top, so this type of situation may become more common.

I think this discussion mainly pertains to newish champs. But even champs who haven't cleaned out their divisions, like Joanna, can be considered the best because they have shown they ought to be favored in pretty much every match up, even though it is quite plausible that they could lose to a fighter in their division.

 

[Turtlejuice]

See, I don't think that is necessarily true either. Not trying to be argumentative, I swear.

It's possible to have new champs who have yet to face dangerous contenders, like Woodley and Wonderboy. Or you could have a situation like LHW where DC is the champ, but Jones is the best LHW. Even had Lawler won, I think it would be reasonable to claim that Condit was a better fighter than he was, etc. Or you could have a situation like LW where a guy like Khabib seems unbeatable to some extent, but has been kept out of action because of injuries.

I think that as the quality of MMA fighters continues to rise, we'll see more and more parity toward the top, so this type of situation may become more common.

I think this discussion mainly pertains to newish champs. But even champs who haven't cleaned out their divisions, like Joanna, can be considered the best because they have shown they ought to be favored in pretty much every match up, even though it is quite plausible that they could lose to a fighter in their division.

I guess it's just different perspective. Every champ has fought there way to the top of the totem pole, and that's where they sit until someone knocks them off.

What you said above pretty much point's to what I said before, that others can be argued (I originally said Cruz could be argued, but later agreed that DC and JJ could as well), and others could make a case for themselves in the future, Bisping could beat Hendo, then go on to beat Jacare, Romero, Weidman and Rockhold. But with DJ, there is no argument.